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Old May 17th, 2010, 07:52 PM   #2601
chornedsnorkack
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yaohua2000 View Post
Length: 300 km
Maximum in-service speed: 300–350 km/h
Investment: CN¥39.45 billion
Construction started on July 1, 2008
Due to open on July 1, 2010
What shall the trip time be:
with all 31 stops?
with fewest stops?
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Old May 17th, 2010, 08:00 PM   #2602
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knuddel Knutsch View Post
do you have more pics of the Shanghai-Nanjing PDL line?

Whatever people are arguing in this thread---China is doing a great job.
I agree. I hope my country will make even more cooperation with China. Already Chinese are involved in modernising our energy infrastructure and building a bridge in Belgrade.

There are some speculations they will be involved in reconstructing the rail network. Today , the HSR is unfortunately only a dream for Serbia.
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Old May 17th, 2010, 08:07 PM   #2603
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Originally Posted by foxmulder View Post
By the way, Chinese has the best high speed network on the World.
Biggest, yes.
Best, no.

Quote:
It is fastest
At the expense of safety.

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And there is absolutely nothing you can do about this.
I can pray it doesn't come to the US.

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Originally Posted by Restless View Post
I could also say that GM is one of the best known companies in the US and it's products are generally a piece of crap.
There are American companies better known to Chinese than GM.

Once again, I picked BYD because this company has the best brand awareness in the US because of Warren Buffet's China riches.

Quote:
It's more like Daimler is keeping its options open
No, just an OEM deal, which Nissan is urging to drop and go exclusive with their battery.

Quote:
whilst BYD are keen to absorb what they can from Daimler in terms of carmaking
There is nothing to learn. It is just a badge-engineering OEM deal in China, where Daimler wants to re-sell some BYD models.

Quote:
In 10years time, who knows what the industrial landscape will look like?
Look at Hong Kong and Taiwan for the future of China's economy 10 years from now?

Quote:
Remember that "Made in Japan/Taiwan/Korea" was once a byline for cheap and low quality. LOL
I really really don't understand why Chinese have this misconception that Japan once competed on price and were considered to be cheap junks like Chinese goods of today.

Go to a big library, get a 70s archive of Car & Driver or Motor Trend, and look at the ads. You will see Chevy and Dodge undercutting Toyota and Nissan in prices. Yes, American cars were already cheaper than much smaller Japanese cars in the 70s! Japan was already a major industrial power before WW2, and only during the reconstruction period of 1955~1965 did Japanese compete on price. After Tokyo Olympics, Japanese no longer competed on price, but only on quality and features.

Koreans had that cheap junk image for 20 years until early 90s, but completely lost it by 2000 and now they no longer compete on price, but on quality and design only.

Taiwanese on the other hand still competes on value and low prices, and Taiwan doesn't have world-class brands like Japan and Korea have. Why? Lack of world-class brands is a curse common to all Sinitic countries, attributable to Chinese culture that values low price over high quality.

So if you think Chinese product will be of high quality in 10 years, forget it. That ain't happening.
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Old May 17th, 2010, 08:16 PM   #2604
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HyperMiler View Post
Biggest, yes.
Best, no.


At the expense of safety.


I can pray it doesn't come to the US.


There are American companies better known to Chinese than GM.

Once again, I picked BYD because this company has the best brand awareness in the US because of Warren Buffet's China riches.


No, just an OEM deal, which Nissan is urging to drop and go exclusive with their battery.


There is nothing to learn. It is just a badge-engineering OEM deal in China, where Daimler wants to re-sell some BYD models.


Look at Hong Kong and Taiwan for the future of China's economy 10 years from now?


I really really don't understand why Chinese have this misconception that Japan once competed on price and were considered to be cheap junks like Chinese goods of today.

Go to a big library, get a 70s archive of Car & Driver or Motor Trend, and look at the ads. You will see Chevy and Dodge undercutting Toyota and Nissan in prices. Yes, American cars were already cheaper than much smaller Japanese cars in the 70s! Japan was already a major industrial power before WW2, and only during the reconstruction period of 1955~1965 did Japanese compete on price. After Tokyo Olympics, Japanese no longer competed on price, but only on quality and features.

Koreans had that cheap junk image for 20 years until early 90s, but completely lost it by 2000 and now they no longer compete on price, but on quality and design only.

Taiwanese on the other hand still competes on value and low prices, and Taiwan doesn't have world-class brands like Japan and Korea have. Why? Lack of world-class brands is a curse common to all Sinitic countries, attributable to Chinese culture that values low price over high quality.

So if you think Chinese product will be of high quality in 10 years, forget it. That ain't happening.

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Old May 17th, 2010, 08:22 PM   #2605
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carrot1 View Post


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Old May 17th, 2010, 08:27 PM   #2606
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HyperMiler View Post
I was commenting on the quality of Chinese engineers and engineering. BYD is the best known Chinese tech company to westerners because of its association with Warren Buffet, so I used it.


Yes, for China and China only, since Daimler's EVs for Europe and the US will use Daimler's inhouse battery or NEC's battery from NEC-Nissan battery joint venture(of Nissan Leaf fame).
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Old May 17th, 2010, 08:32 PM   #2607
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HyperMiler View Post
Numbers can be misleading, since each of these Chinese workers are much less efficient than their foreign counterparts.

For example, BYD claims to have 5,000 engineers working on electric car battery alone, yet hardly any break-through came out of it with BYD batteries being the worst and least competitive battery in the automotive world in spite of their low cost. It's so bad that even Chinese auto makers bypass BYD batteries for foreign batteries, and all BYD bids on overseas EV project failed.

Similar force is at work here, with Chinese easily defeated by foreign forces numbering 1/10th.

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Old May 17th, 2010, 10:25 PM   #2608
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A testimony to Chinese knock-off product's quality.

http://www.manufacturing.net/article.aspx?id=257074

Quote:
China military refuses to accept new domestically made fighters
BEIJING, May 17 KYODO

China's Air Force has refused to accept 16 J-11B fighters manufactured by a domestic aircraft maker due to technical problems, the Kanwa Defense Review magazine said in its June issue, quoting a Western intelligence source in Beijing.
J-11, the Chinese replica of Su-27, has been under flight testing since 1998, and Chinese still hasn't been able to produce a working plane after 12 years of repair work.

It's the same story with other high-profile Chinese replica products, be it a jet fighter or a bullet train.

BTW, Shenyang is the same aircraft company that built China's first Maglev train, so I would be wary of riding that.
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Old May 17th, 2010, 11:16 PM   #2609
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Originally Posted by carrot1 View Post
Just ignore that stupid troll. He was posting with another name, but was banned because of trolling and making wild claims.

Last edited by maldini; May 17th, 2010 at 11:30 PM.
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Old May 18th, 2010, 02:14 AM   #2610
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lol now Taiwan is dragged into the debate. Hmm..how come the way he rants about Taiwan is so familiar ? I think I saw it somewhere on SSC, if my memory serves correctly it was also said by some Asian members on SSC before.

Last edited by snow is red; May 18th, 2010 at 02:26 AM.
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Old May 18th, 2010, 05:18 AM   #2611
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HyperMiler View Post
When atheists dream of a world without Christianity, I point them toward China as the example what a Godless world would look like today.
(Sorry I had lost this "pearl")
I can understand you, a world with a severe shortage of cocaine for our teenagers, not enough prostitution and little or no children willing to please the priesthood, is in a bad predicament indeed.
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Old May 18th, 2010, 06:31 AM   #2612
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High-speed rail bridge sections join

By Zha Minjie
Shanghai Daily
2010-5-18

A MAJOR link in the high-speed railway from Shanghai to neighboring Hangzhou was completed yesterday with the joining of the two sections of a long arch bridge, railway authorities said. The 160-meter arched span is the longest used on a fast train route, authorities said. Wang Feng, deputy director of the Shanghai Railway Bureau, said yesterday that it was a breakthrough in technology for fast railway routes. The arch bridge in Zhejiang Province overpasses an expressway connecting Shanghai and Hangzhou.

To not disrupt the 40,000 vehicles that use the expressway daily, builders constructed the two arched sections separately beforehand. Builders then took an hour to connect the two sections yesterday.

Construction of the railway began in April 2009 with a total investment of 30 billion yuan (US$4.4 billion). The trains on the 154-kilometer route can reach a top speed of 350 kilometers per hour. Testing will begin in July. The line is expected to start operating on October 1.


image hosted on flickr

Workers conduct a final inspection before the two sections of an
arch bridge on the Shanghai-Hangzhou railway were connected yesterday.
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Old May 18th, 2010, 07:58 AM   #2613
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HyperMiler View Post
When atheists dream of a world without Christianity, I point them toward China as the example what a Godless world would look like today.
China has lots of Christians no? Not only Christians, there are also many Buddhists, Muslims, etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HyperMiler View Post
A testimony to Chinese knock-off product's quality.

http://www.manufacturing.net/article.aspx?id=257074


J-11, the Chinese replica of Su-27, has been under flight testing since 1998, and Chinese still hasn't been able to produce a working plane after 12 years of repair work.

It's the same story with other high-profile Chinese replica products, be it a jet fighter or a bullet train.

BTW, Shenyang is the same aircraft company that built China's first Maglev train, so I would be wary of riding that.
According to your logic, since China clearly does not accept faulty products, then anything China does accept is therefore good, whether domestic or not, no?
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Old May 18th, 2010, 08:57 AM   #2614
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HyperMiler View Post
A testimony to Chinese knock-off product's quality.

http://www.manufacturing.net/article.aspx?id=257074


J-11, the Chinese replica of Su-27, has been under flight testing since 1998, and Chinese still hasn't been able to produce a working plane after 12 years of repair work.

It's the same story with other high-profile Chinese replica products, be it a jet fighter or a bullet train.

BTW, Shenyang is the same aircraft company that built China's first Maglev train, so I would be wary of riding that.
What about the F-22 and F-35? what a disaster they have been, and they were designed and built by some of the worlds most advanced economies.

China is playing catchup with the rest of the world. Considering they have had 20 years to learn what the rest of the word developed over the best part of a century, I think they are doing remarkably well.
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Old May 18th, 2010, 10:30 AM   #2615
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according to his mentality, which is so negatively Enthusiastic about PRC, HyperMiler is an indian, can't be wrong.
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Old May 18th, 2010, 10:53 AM   #2616
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Gentlemen, don't feed the troll. He'll be banned soon enough, let's get back on topic.
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Old May 18th, 2010, 12:20 PM   #2617
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When atheists dream of a world without Christianity, I point them toward China as the example what a Godless world would look like today.
Haha, I should have known we were dealing with a religious nut job here.

But in fact, I'm almost starting to believe in miracles because this clown hasn't actually been banned yet. Moderators-- do your job!
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Old May 18th, 2010, 04:15 PM   #2618
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Yeah, moderators should do something with these trollers, they are wasting time of everyone subscribing this thread.
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Old May 18th, 2010, 04:37 PM   #2619
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snow is red View Post
lol now Taiwan is dragged into the debate.
I was pointing to Taiwan as the future of China.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Huhu View Post
China has lots of Christians no?
Christians are persecuted in China. Most importantly, Chinese ethics code has no effect in China.

Quote:
since China clearly does not accept faulty products
Consumers don't accept defective product, but sellers do try to pass defective product onto consumers, who could be anybody from poor farmer's wife shopping for a baby formula to PLAAF.

Quote:
Originally Posted by strandeed View Post
What about the F-22 and F-35?
F-22 works fine and you have rich countries lined up to buy this thing even with its supposed defect if Americans would sell it.

As for F-35, yes this project is a failure in terms of cost because of its overstretching supply chain across the globe, but it works as planned performance wise. A lesson learned from F-35 program is to not get too many partners involved in single project, as management complexity derails project.

Now, J-11 isn't a brand new design; it is a Chinese replica of an old Russian design for which they have full design plan, yet Chinese cannot fully replace the missing Russian tech that Russians refuse to supply and make it work the original. And the people who are working on J-10/J-11 are the cream of Chinese engineering talent pool, far more talented than people working on CRH380.

So why are Chinese engineers struggling on J-10 and J-11? Because of engine failures caused by poor material, and unstable FWB system. That poor material issue has a direct consequence on China's high speed train development program, since Chinese are decades behind the West in material science and metallurgy, and it's inconceivable that Chinese are able to produce a wheel+axle assembly that could tolerate a higher operating speed than Germans could.

Quote:
Originally Posted by staff View Post
But in fact, I'm almost starting to believe in miracles because this clown hasn't actually been banned yet. Moderators-- do your job!
Well, mods aren't doing their job of banning flame throwers like yourself and carrot1, so why would they be banning a productive and contributing member like me?
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Old May 18th, 2010, 04:48 PM   #2620
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Hypermiller get a life please and stop ruining my forum.

get out...
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