daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Railways

Railways (Inter)national commuter and freight trains



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old April 25th, 2009, 04:56 AM   #1481
octopusop
BANNED
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 107
Likes (Received): 2

Quote:
Originally Posted by clkgtr View Post
You really have a sense of HUMOR!
That's not humor, that's abhorring against ugly features of LiuZhijun, a fawning underling. He named HX 河蟹 for all of chinese new trains and new locos to kiss HuJintao's a$$.
octopusop no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old April 25th, 2009, 07:09 AM   #1482
ina555
Registered User
 
ina555's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Beijing
Posts: 464
Likes (Received): 40

hahahahahahahahahahaha
ina555 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 25th, 2009, 02:21 PM   #1483
octopusop
BANNED
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 107
Likes (Received): 2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rail1435 View Post
Finally, I found myself.
The second 9600 kW CoCo (HXD1b):
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/487...1787350235.jpg

For the third (HXD2b), please wait until May '09.
HXD2B in the air faced a rocky road ahead.

Production of 9600kW HXD1/HXD2 had been ceased last year, total 192 sets, without foreseeable order. In fact, these 2 types were customized for Datong-Qinhuangdao line, the energy lifeline of China.

The hottest type of locomotive nowadays is 7200kW Co-Co HXD3, 500+ have been procuded and 300+ in order. Beijing Erqi Locomotive Works will assemble this type about qty. of 100.

Next month, another 7200kW Co-Co HXD1C will roll off the interim line, which will be introduced to competition.

7200kW locomotives are more applicable in China railway. Heavy duties for 9600kW HXD3B & HXD1B are rare.

The number of HXDs do not mean type, and followed character do not mean modification, different from DFs and SSs.

The number of HXDs means the leading works who designed the loco.
1-- Zhuzhou 株洲
2-- Datong 大同
3-- Dalian 大连
5-- Qishuyan 戚墅堰
the followed character means type. For example, HXD3 was designed by Dalian, and HXD3B was based on design of Bombardier, they were nothing similar. That's why HXNs have only two types -- HXN3 and HXN5.
octopusop no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 26th, 2009, 08:42 AM   #1484
UD2
A very cool person
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,294
Likes (Received): 31



closing down 9600kw lines is a good move. Having this much power on 12 wheeles is useless because the amount of traction on a 1X co-co is just not enough to compensate for the massive amount of troque from a 9600kw engine. The 9600kw is probably only useful for running a very even terrain and the second the train have to go on any type of a incline there will be significant wheelspin.

Good move.

a 2X Co-co with 7200kw each is a much better choice. The best design for heavy coal trains I believe is still the articulated 2X Bo-Bo with I believe around 4800kw on each engine ( someone confirm this).
__________________
"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed" - President Eisenhower
UD2 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 26th, 2009, 10:27 AM   #1485
octopusop
BANNED
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 107
Likes (Received): 2

Quote:
Originally Posted by UD2 View Post


closing down 9600kw lines is a good move. Having this much power on 12 wheeles is useless because the amount of traction on a 1X co-co is just not enough to compensate for the massive amount of troque from a 9600kw engine. The 9600kw is probably only useful for running a very even terrain and the second the train have to go on any type of a incline there will be significant wheelspin.

Good move.

a 2X Co-co with 7200kw each is a much better choice. The best design for heavy coal trains I believe is still the articulated 2X Bo-Bo with I believe around 4800kw on each engine ( someone confirm this).
You misunderstood it. 2X Bo-Bo 9600kW HXD1/2 lines were closed down, those loco have 16 wheels. Co-Co 9600kW HXD3B/1Bs are in testing from pole to tropic, a news in 2007 said that Railway Ministry would buy 1500 sets of them, 500 HXD3Bs and 500 HXD1Bs and future 500 HXD2Bs. But the testing results is not satisfied, especially in large sloped area. Maybe they are improving those locos.
Price of those HXDs:
HXD1 & HXD2 -- RMB 41million
HXD3 & HXD1C -- RMB 15million
HXD3B & HXD1B -- RMB 22million
octopusop no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 27th, 2009, 07:40 AM   #1486
UD2
A very cool person
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,294
Likes (Received): 31

Quote:
Originally Posted by octopusop View Post
You misunderstood it. 2X Bo-Bo 9600kW HXD1/2 lines were closed down, those loco have 16 wheels. Co-Co 9600kW HXD3B/1Bs are in testing from pole to tropic, a news in 2007 said that Railway Ministry would buy 1500 sets of them, 500 HXD3Bs and 500 HXD1Bs and future 500 HXD2Bs. But the testing results is not satisfied, especially in large sloped area. Maybe they are improving those locos.
Price of those HXDs:
HXD1 & HXD2 -- RMB 41million
HXD3 & HXD1C -- RMB 15million
HXD3B & HXD1B -- RMB 22million
The 2X Bo-Bos are that expensive?? wow. Well shutting those down are a very good move no doublt.

But anyways, ramping down the 9600kw Co-Cos is still a good move though. I don't see how they can improve upon these engines because it is not the design that's at fault, but the limitations of physics.

But question though, why are the HXD1/2 so expensive? They have the same amount of output as the HXD3B/1B only spread across two units. Now I have always assumed that less powerful engines come with lower costs. Why is it so different in this case? Is it because they were fully imported?
__________________
"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed" - President Eisenhower

Last edited by UD2; April 27th, 2009 at 07:46 AM.
UD2 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 27th, 2009, 04:21 PM   #1487
baidu
Registered User
 
baidu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 111
Likes (Received): 7

wuhan-guangzhou hsr & new railway station(u/c)

image hosted on flickr

image hosted on flickr

Last edited by baidu; April 27th, 2009 at 05:07 PM.
baidu no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 27th, 2009, 05:29 PM   #1488
big-dog
Registered User
 
big-dog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 14,080
Likes (Received): 6840

Chinese railway pictures



train near Daqin and Dami lines



(hasea.com)
__________________

Highcliff liked this post
big-dog no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 27th, 2009, 06:28 PM   #1489
octopusop
BANNED
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 107
Likes (Received): 2

Quote:
Originally Posted by UD2 View Post
The 2X Bo-Bos are that expensive?? wow. Well shutting those down are a very good move no doublt.

But anyways, ramping down the 9600kw Co-Cos is still a good move though. I don't see how they can improve upon these engines because it is not the design that's at fault, but the limitations of physics.

But question though, why are the HXD1/2 so expensive? They have the same amount of output as the HXD3B/1B only spread across two units. Now I have always assumed that less powerful engines come with lower costs. Why is it so different in this case? Is it because they were fully imported?
I was amazing about the prices of HXD1(Simens)/HXD2(Alstom) too. Perhaps those locos were only assemblied in China. I never heard news about domestication of those locos. As I have said, those 2 types were customized for Daqin line, the energy lifeline of China, they need reliability than price. Another side, only one key part of HXD3 -- IGBT Converter was made by Hitachi, all the other key parts such as motor and main transformer were made in China.

Daqin line is the most important line for China. The line transported 450000000 tons of coal every year, if the line disappeared, half of China would rush into the stone age.

HXD1/2/3/1C have 1200kW power every axle/motor. Axle power of HXD3B/1B is 1600kW, no such superpower ever existed before, leap forward? it's funny that "leap forward" is LiuZhijun's nickname given by railroaders.
octopusop no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 28th, 2009, 12:57 AM   #1490
foxmulder_ms
Registered User
 
foxmulder_ms's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 262
Likes (Received): 21

Quote:
Originally Posted by baidu View Post
image hosted on flickr
Very nice update. Thanks.

Fuel efficiency can be also an answer for the higher price of the locos.
foxmulder_ms no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old April 30th, 2009, 11:58 AM   #1491
baidu
Registered User
 
baidu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 111
Likes (Received): 7

Hefei-Wuhan hsr

image hosted on flickr

image hosted on flickr


Last edited by baidu; April 30th, 2009 at 12:08 PM.
baidu no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 1st, 2009, 11:24 PM   #1492
Railfan
steamer
 
Railfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Guayaquil
Posts: 14,808
Likes (Received): 93

Nice pic!
Railfan no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 2nd, 2009, 04:08 PM   #1493
octopusop
BANNED
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 107
Likes (Received): 2

octopusop no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 2nd, 2009, 04:27 PM   #1494
gramercy
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,823
Likes (Received): 799

that's a crappy comparison

it tries to compare alpine basetunnels to saudi desert-rail both in cost and speed
gramercy no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 2nd, 2009, 06:11 PM   #1495
foxmulder_ms
Registered User
 
foxmulder_ms's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 262
Likes (Received): 21

I think this is a nice snapshot comparison. Of course, price will be different among countries... They just put approximate estimated numbers as information. They dont conclude anything.
foxmulder_ms no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 6th, 2009, 03:32 PM   #1496
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,929
Likes (Received): 18195

China to build its biggest high-speed train factory in NE province

CHANGCHUN, May 6 (Xinhua) -- Construction of China's biggest manufacturing base for high-speed trains is to be completed in the northeastern Jilin Province in June next year, local sources confirmed Wednesday.

It will also become China's biggest research and development center, according to Han Fengwu, deputy general manager of the Changchun Railway Vehicle Co., Ltd (CRC).

The base, which cost 2.5 billion yuan (about 0.36 billion U.S. dollars), is capable of producing 500 cars for ordinary passenger trains, 800 cars for high-speed trains which run at a speed above 350 kilometers per hour and 800 cars for inter-city express trains above 120 kilometers per hour.

Construction on the base began last May.

CRC, a share-holding enterprise registered in March 2002, produced China's first underground train, magnetic levitation train and high-speed train.

The Ministry of Railways launched a major overhaul of the rail system on April 1, the seventh since 1997, featuring faster trips and more seats.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!

Highcliff liked this post
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 6th, 2009, 03:38 PM   #1497
gramercy
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,823
Likes (Received): 799

HOLY COW

that would probably come to 100 high speed EMU-8 units per year

thats more than Siemens's FULL ICE 3 / Velaro production for the last 9 years
gramercy no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 7th, 2009, 06:01 PM   #1498
gramercy
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,823
Likes (Received): 799

Quote:
Originally Posted by Papagei View Post
Siemens has produced more than 100 ICE3/Velaro. But you are right, it is extremely much!
On the other hand, they will produce some Siemens Velaros in this factory.

I counted on railfaneurope.net, between the german ICE3, the dutch ICE3, the spanish Velaro and the Russian Velaro, thats 101 trainsets over 9 years

Plus they have a contract for 60 sets with china, but as far as I know, they only produced 3 in europe, the rest were produced together with the chinese partners, in china.


Even if I add together all the Talgos, Pendolinos, Velaros and TGVs, I doubt europe has produced 100 sets / year
gramercy no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 8th, 2009, 12:52 AM   #1499
Papagei
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 26
Likes (Received): 0

Siemens has produced more than 100 ICE3/Velaro. But you are right, it is extremely much!
On the other hand, they will produce some Siemens Velaros in this factory.
Papagei no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 8th, 2009, 01:02 AM   #1500
gramercy
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,823
Likes (Received): 799

wow, timewarp
gramercy no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
china, high speed train, rail, tgv

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 03:38 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium