daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Railways

Railways (Inter)national commuter and freight trains



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old May 17th, 2009, 03:56 PM   #1521
octopusop
BANNED
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 107
Likes (Received): 2

Suburban trains disappeared in China about 15 or 20 years ago, due to rigid timetable, they were replaced by metros and buses. That's why China railway transported more passenger-kilometers than India, and transported only 1/4 passengers of India railway.

High-speed trains are too expensive for chinese people. For example, Beijing-Shanghai 10-hour D-Sleeper trains are called "quilt express", and 24-hour green-skin trains are full of people. Ticket price of D-Sleeper is RMB 700, and green-skin hard seat is RMB 88.
octopusop no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old May 17th, 2009, 05:54 PM   #1522
hkskyline
Hong Kong
 
hkskyline's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 86,889
Likes (Received): 18157

The migrant workers don't opt for HSR anyway, right? I see a lot of footage of them on the hard seat coaches for long journeys of 20+ hours.
__________________
Hong Kong Photo Gallery - Click Here for the Hong Kong Galleries

World Photo Gallery - | St. Petersburg, Russia | Pyongyang | Tokyo | Istanbul | Dubai | Shanghai | Mumbai | Bangkok | Sydney

New York, London, Prague, Iceland, Rocky Mountains, Angkor Wat, Sri Lanka, Poland, Myanmar, and much more!
hkskyline no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 17th, 2009, 06:26 PM   #1523
yaohua2000
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 453
Likes (Received): 7

Workers hit by train D5420 near Wuxi on 2009-05-17 at ~11:40, two killed, three injured

http://www.chinanews.com.cn/sh/news/.../1695431.shtml (in Chinese)
yaohua2000 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 18th, 2009, 04:42 AM   #1524
UD2
A very cool person
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,294
Likes (Received): 31

Quote:
Originally Posted by octopusop View Post
Suburban trains disappeared in China about 15 or 20 years ago, due to rigid timetable, they were replaced by metros and buses. That's why China railway transported more passenger-kilometers than India, and transported only 1/4 passengers of India railway.

High-speed trains are too expensive for chinese people. For example, Beijing-Shanghai 10-hour D-Sleeper trains are called "quilt express", and 24-hour green-skin trains are full of people. Ticket price of D-Sleeper is RMB 700, and green-skin hard seat is RMB 88.

isn't capitalism great...

Now only if business class airfares would be more comparable to coach and that BMWs will sell for the same price as a Ford. My life would be great!!!
__________________
"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed" - President Eisenhower
UD2 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 18th, 2009, 10:15 AM   #1525
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,974
Likes (Received): 388

Quote:
Originally Posted by UD2 View Post
isn't capitalism great...

Now only if business class airfares would be more comparable to coach and that BMWs will sell for the same price as a Ford. My life would be great!!!
Yes, but ever since Concorde was grounded, first class arrives the same time as coach. And Dacia Logan is precisely as fast as Maybach Zeppelin, because both travel at the highway speed limit.

I do not quite see why a high-speed train of China could not have passengers sitting for 15 hours upright in 5 or 6 seats abreast, and maybe in a doubledecker. After all, this is the time people spend sitting in the coach of a 747 or 777. And the same train could also have cars with sleeping compartments and double beds... How would the real cost of a crammed full high-speed train compare against crammed full slow speed train?
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 18th, 2009, 12:29 PM   #1526
cal_t
Transport Advocate
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Brisbane/Melb
Posts: 455
Likes (Received): 22

Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
Yes, but ever since Concorde was grounded, first class arrives the same time as coach. And Dacia Logan is precisely as fast as Maybach Zeppelin, because both travel at the highway speed limit.

I do not quite see why a high-speed train of China could not have passengers sitting for 15 hours upright in 5 or 6 seats abreast, and maybe in a doubledecker. After all, this is the time people spend sitting in the coach of a 747 or 777. And the same train could also have cars with sleeping compartments and double beds... How would the real cost of a crammed full high-speed train compare against crammed full slow speed train?
I think the CHR model is aimed at class segregation, however, in due time, slower services would be abandoned for HSR services.
__________________
Any views expressed are do not represent those of any companies and are personal only. If you are not the intended viewer, you may not disseminate or disclose this information.
cal_t no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 18th, 2009, 01:13 PM   #1527
chornedsnorkack
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,974
Likes (Received): 388

Quote:
Originally Posted by cal_t View Post
I think the CHR model is aimed at class segregation, however, in due time, slower services would be abandoned for HSR services.
Considering the problems accommodating the huge masses of Chinese that want to travel, the HSR services do not seem to carry as much passenger volume as to justify abandoning the slower services.

Plus how many stations do the dedicated high-speed lines have?
chornedsnorkack no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 18th, 2009, 02:31 PM   #1528
snapdragon
Registered User
 
snapdragon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: mumbai
Posts: 1,112
Likes (Received): 368

Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
Considering the problems accommodating the huge masses of Chinese that want to travel, the HSR services do not seem to carry as much passenger volume as to justify abandoning the slower services.

Plus how many stations do the dedicated high-speed lines have?
Dude this is where capitalism comes in. As services don't meet needs demands and requirements .They tend to improve for better (in genral better sometimes worse) and they further keep changing to meet the above 3 mentioned .Historically it has been observed in human kind such sequences of changes over a duration of time is for the good that is why capitalism rocks .
__________________
http://kitchen-nn.ru/2a5e6
snapdragon no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 18th, 2009, 05:10 PM   #1529
ChinaHighspeedRail
Registered User
 
ChinaHighspeedRail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 40
Likes (Received): 0

New GuangZhou Station (Asia Biggest Station) due completion and should start service between WuHan and GuangZhou HSL by the end of the year.

New GuangZhou Station Model: (source from Hasea.com)





Construction site:





ChinaHighspeedRail no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 18th, 2009, 05:20 PM   #1530
ChinaHighspeedRail
Registered User
 
ChinaHighspeedRail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 40
Likes (Received): 0

Mountain Heng new station is one of the new train station between Wuhan and GuangZhou HSL.









ChinaHighspeedRail no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 18th, 2009, 05:26 PM   #1531
ChinaHighspeedRail
Registered User
 
ChinaHighspeedRail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 40
Likes (Received): 0

Construction Site





















The new rail line is build on concrete and specially design for the train to travel on speed of 350KM/H between WuHan and GuangZhou later this year.
ChinaHighspeedRail no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 18th, 2009, 09:44 PM   #1532
YelloPerilo
BANNED
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: 漢堡 Hamburg
Posts: 2,587
Likes (Received): 35

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChinaHighspeedRail View Post
New GuangZhou Station (Asia Biggest Station) due completion and should start service between WuHan and GuangZhou HSL by the end of the year.
What is Mountain Heng? You mean Hengshan? Why do you write Guangzhou with tee capital letters and Wuhan only with one capital letter?
YelloPerilo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 18th, 2009, 11:49 PM   #1533
UD2
A very cool person
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,294
Likes (Received): 31

Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
Yes, but ever since Concorde was grounded, first class arrives the same time as coach. And Dacia Logan is precisely as fast as Maybach Zeppelin, because both travel at the highway speed limit.

I do not quite see why a high-speed train of China could not have passengers sitting for 15 hours upright in 5 or 6 seats abreast, and maybe in a doubledecker. After all, this is the time people spend sitting in the coach of a 747 or 777. And the same train could also have cars with sleeping compartments and double beds... How would the real cost of a crammed full high-speed train compare against crammed full slow speed train?
1. Trains already do seat 5 abreat in coach and 4 abreast in first.

2. HSR Sleepers from Beijing - Shanghai replaces the existing conventional sleepers and is positioned to be the premium first class trains in China. If you can't afford it then there are many less apointed and less expensive options avaliable.

3. Trains are avaliable because the demand is there and these tickets are very resonable for the middle to upper middle class.

4. If the real cost of running a high speed train is simliar to conventional trains, then Everyone in the world would have it instead. But that's not the case, so the answer should be significantly higher.

5. There are Beijing -> Shanghai HSR trains avaliable that have 5 abreast seating.

6. Sleeper trains are a norm for travelling in China. It is only natural that it is offered in a HSR fashion.

7. Nice try.
__________________
"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed" - President Eisenhower

Last edited by UD2; May 19th, 2009 at 05:25 AM.
UD2 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 19th, 2009, 12:23 AM   #1534
london24/7
Registered User
 
london24/7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 10
Likes (Received): 0

Quote:
Originally Posted by snapdragon View Post
Dude this is where capitalism comes in. As services don't meet needs demands and requirements .They tend to improve for better (in genral better sometimes worse) and they further keep changing to meet the above 3 mentioned .Historically it has been observed in human kind such sequences of changes over a duration of time is for the good that is why capitalism rocks .
oo yeah dude capitalism 'rocks', except all rail services in china are run and managed by the chinese government in a state monopoly - so the market has no effect on it. That's why rail services in china and europe are so good - the government isnt interested in making a profit - its there to provided a public service. Whereas the US seems to think the free market is a cure for every social ill and has made virtually no investment in passenger rail.
london24/7 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 19th, 2009, 03:33 AM   #1535
k.k.jetcar
Registered User
 
k.k.jetcar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Sapporo
Posts: 1,811
Likes (Received): 452

Quote:
Originally Posted by london24/7 View Post
oo yeah dude capitalism 'rocks', except all rail services in china are run and managed by the chinese government in a state monopoly - so the market has no effect on it. That's why rail services in china and europe are so good - the government isnt interested in making a profit - its there to provided a public service. Whereas the US seems to think the free market is a cure for every social ill and has made virtually no investment in passenger rail.
Amen, "dude"!
k.k.jetcar no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 19th, 2009, 06:27 AM   #1536
octopusop
BANNED
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 107
Likes (Received): 2

Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline View Post
The migrant workers don't opt for HSR anyway, right? I see a lot of footage of them on the hard seat coaches for long journeys of 20+ hours.
Yes, RMB 700 (US$103) is 2 weeks salary for migrant worker, in their homeland -- interior China, a month salary.
octopusop no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 19th, 2009, 09:36 AM   #1537
yaohua2000
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 453
Likes (Received): 7

Quote:
Originally Posted by octopusop View Post
Yes, RMB 700 (US$103) is 2 weeks salary for migrant worker, in their homeland -- interior China, a month salary.
It's ¥730 (US$ 107), not ¥700.
yaohua2000 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 20th, 2009, 09:20 AM   #1538
snow is red
Vicky Pollard lol
 
snow is red's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 5,078
Likes (Received): 119

Harbin Electric Expands into Linear Motor Based Freight Trains

May 19-2009

Harbin Electric, Inc. ("Harbin Electric" or the "Company"; Nasdaq: HRBN), a leading developer and manufacturer of a wide array of electric motors in the People's Republic of China, today announced that the Company has signed an agreement with a domestic Maglev technology company to co-develop a linear motor-driven freight train system for coal transportation. Under the agreement, the initial phase of the project is to build 850 meter long testing line in a coal mine in inner-Mongolia.

Once the testing line is validated, the project is expected to expand to a 32 km long coal transportation line in inner-Mongolia. Harbin Electric will be responsible to provide linear motor driving systems including the motors' primary and secondary components for the entire transportation line. For the initial testing line, the Company will deliver 5 linear motors to be integrated with the train along with a total of 850 meter long secondary components to be installed on the train track before the end of June 2009.

"I am very excited about this project," said Tianfu Yang, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of Harbin Electric. "Not only because it is the first of its kind in the mining industry and in the electric motor industry in China, but also because it opens a new market potential for us and we believe that the potential is substantial."

Yang continued, "Energy plays a fundamental role in China's economic development and coal is a dominant component. It is used in all sectors of China's economy and in particular in coal-fired electricity generation. With rapid economic growth in China, increasing electricity consumption continuously drives the demand for coal higher. However, due to lack of efficient coal transportation systems in the mining industry, particularly from coal mines to shipping ports, power plants, freight hubs, etc., the cost for coal transportation in China has been steadily increasing, driving up coal prices continuously. The Chinese government has plans to control coal prices, one of which is to build efficient, automated, and modern coal transportation systems at mines in major coal producing provinces."

Yang added, "Linear motor technology can be customized for fast, safe, clean, efficient, unmanned, and low cost freight transportation. I am very pleased that the Company has been chosen to be a key player in building this system in inner-Mongolia. Inner Mongolia is a province with an abundance of natural resources such as coal. There are many provinces in China such as Shanxi and Yunnan that have abundant coal reserves. I believe that those provinces will also need this technology once this technology is validated."

Mr. Yang concluded, "This project is another demonstration of our ability to expand and penetrate new markets thanks to our strong R&D, flexible manufacturing platform and expertise in specialty electric motor technology. I am confident that we are well positioned to capture many opportunities like this in the future."

http://news.prnewswire.com/DisplayRe...5028712&EDATE=
snow is red no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 20th, 2009, 11:05 AM   #1539
octopusop
BANNED
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 107
Likes (Received): 2

Quote:
Originally Posted by yaohua2000 View Post
It's ¥730 (US$ 107), not ¥700.
Beijing-Shanghai D-Sleeper lower berth cost RMB730 and upper berth cost RMB655.
I don't kown why you prefer a conversation full of vacuities, count me out if you're going on.
octopusop no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old May 20th, 2009, 11:14 PM   #1540
UD2
A very cool person
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Toronto
Posts: 1,294
Likes (Received): 31

Quote:
Originally Posted by octopusop View Post
Yes, RMB 700 (US$103) is 2 weeks salary for migrant worker, in their homeland -- interior China, a month salary.
And a person working two full time jobs at McDonald's and Wendy's wouldn't be travelling first class either.

this discussion is pathetic.
__________________
"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired, signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed" - President Eisenhower
UD2 no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
china, high speed train, rail, tgv

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 08:12 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium