daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Highways & Autobahns

Highways & Autobahns All about automobility



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old December 4th, 2007, 11:29 PM   #181
dhlennon
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 21
Likes (Received): 0

It is almost completely impossible to build anything in the UK now because of NIMBYS and environmentalists. It took us 15yrs to build the high-speed train connection to the channel tunnel.

There's no point discussing improvements to UK in this thread really unless there is a change in planning laws here, at least for nationally important infrastructure. I love roads as much as the rest of you, but I think we're in an era where we're going to lose. (:
dhlennon no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old December 5th, 2007, 12:48 AM   #182
DUMB0
London hater
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: London
Posts: 16
Likes (Received): 0

Quote:
It is almost completely impossible to build anything in the UK now because of NIMBYS and environmentalists. It took us 15yrs to build the high-speed train connection to the channel tunnel.

There's no point discussing improvements to UK in this thread really unless there is a change in planning laws here, at least for nationally important infrastructure. I love roads as much as the rest of you, but I think we're in an era where we're going to lose. (:
Sad but probably very true.

Idea: (along the lines of)
1. why don't we just set up public transport schemes all across the country (demolition in the name of public transport or the environment still works ). Let's deliver an alternative to the car; the environmentalists and other proponents of public transport would then keep quiet.
2. the schemes succeed to reduced traffic on the roads the first few years; but after ~10 yrs traffic is back to old levels. Just like the London congestion charge...
3. By then car would be less polluting and further punitive action against the motorist would not be tolerated by a LARGE MAJORITY of the public. Finally, the British road network is upgraded to a western European standard.

The car revolutionized civilization and a key component of our western lifestyle. I believe private transport is intrinsically far superior in practicality/comfort to any kind of public transport. Let's just give an alternative to the car...fine... we want a whole integrated transport network and each mode will be judge on its merit.

Why take the Eurostar/TGV if it runs at less than half the speed of the plane. You can forget a Glasgow-London high speed rail link; that's dead on arrival. London-Paris takes 45min vs 2hr.15min but it's still ok. That's because airports are so far away from the city centers and involve a lot of time to check-in, waiting for the flight, picking up luggage etc.... Beyond Paris/Bruxelles forget about the train, the plane is king... there is simply no economic alternative shut up and sit down...

the train/metro/bus may be fine for commuting but that's it. Try doing any grocery shopping or going to IKEA without a car...
How about just a 100 mile journey to visit some historic town for the week-end (visiting Oxford from London etc..). Are you going to book a ticked in advance? Are you willing to accept the strict times. The car is so comfortable, practical and works 24/7. Just look at the travel patterns in other countries (except for Japan) with substantial public transport facilities. People will essentially choose the car over public transport any day.

The car has so many strengths, if we block the environmentalists from eroding those strengths (by making it ultra expensive or too congested), the car will always ultimately triumph.

Last edited by DUMB0; December 5th, 2007 at 12:59 AM.
DUMB0 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 7th, 2007, 05:17 PM   #183
davidmkelly
Registered User
 
davidmkelly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 9
Likes (Received): 0

UK Motorway Archive

I haven't seen a link to the following site anywhere on here. It's an archive of information about UK motorways and contains lots of interesting information as well as photographs of motorways in the early days.

http://www.iht.org/motorway/page1.htm

Cheers, Dave
davidmkelly no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 14th, 2007, 11:13 PM   #184
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,594
Likes (Received): 19388

I found this list i made on my computer. I made it last summer with Google Earth. It's about the number of lanes.

M1:
London – M25 2x3
M25 – Hemel Hempstead 4+3
Hemel Hempstead – Flamstead 2x3
Flamstead – Luton-South 4+3
Luton-South – Leicester M69 2x3
Leicester M69 – Leicester-North 2x4
Leicester-North – Derby A42 2x3
Derby A42 – Nottingham A50 2x4
Nottingham A50 – M62 2x3
M62 – M621 Leeds 2x5
M621 Leeds – Garforth A1 (M) 2x3
Garforth A1 (M) – Tadcaster A1 2x4
Tadcaster A1 – Wetherby 2x3
Wetherby – A1 2x2
A1 – Dishfort A1 2x3

M2:
Rochester – Walderslade 2x4
Walderslade – Hempstead 2x3
Hempstead – Canterbury 2x2

M3:
London – North Waltham A303 2x3
North Waltham – Winchester 2x2
Winchester – Southampton 2x3
Southampton – M27 2x2+2x2

M4:
London – Cranford 2x2
Cranford – M25 2x3
M25 – Langley 2x4
Langley – M5 Bristol 2x3
M5 Bristol – Severn Beach 2x2
Severn Beach – Castleton 2x3
Castleton – Coryton 2x2
Coryton – Port Talbot 2x3
Port Talbot – Llanedi 2x2

M5:
Walsall – Exeter 2x3

M6:
Catthorpe – M56 Appleton Thn 2x3
M56 – M62 Warrington 2x4
M62 – M61 Bamber Bridge 2x3
M61 – M55 Preston 2x4
M55 – Carlisle 2x3

M8:
Edinburgh – Baillieston M73 2x2
M73 – M80 Glasgow 2x3
M80 – Glasgow-North 2x5
Glasgow-North – Laurigston 2x3
Laurigston – M77 4x3
M77 – Paisley 2x3
Paisley – Langbank 2x2

M9:
Newbridge – Dunblane 2x2

M10:
Hemel-Hempstead – St Albans 2x2

M11:
London – Bishops Stortford 2x3
Bishops Stortford – Girton 2x2

M18:
Thurcroft – Wadworth (A1) 2x3
Wadworth – Dunscroft M180 2x2
Dunscroft – Goole 2x3

M20:
Swanley – Folkestone 2x3

M23:
Hooley – Crawley 2x3

M25:
Dartford – Hawley 2x4
Hawley – Reigate M23 2x3
Reigate – Denham M40 2x4
Denham – Grays 2x3

M26:
Sevenoaks – Wrotham Heat 2x2

M27:
Cadnam – Portsmouth 2x3

M32:
Hambrook – Bristol 2x2

M40:
London – Beaconsfield 2x4
Beaconsfield – Birmingham 2x3

M42:
Bromsgrove - Appleby Magna 2x3

M45:
Watford Gap – Rugby 2x2

M48:
Olveston – Caldicot 2x2

M49:
Avonmouth – Severn Beach 2x2

M50:
Strensham – Ross-on-Wye 2x2

M53:
Birkenhead – Hooton 2x3
Hooton – Chester 2x2

M54:
Essington – Telford 2x2

M55:
Preston – Blackpool 2x3

M56:
Cheadle – Manchester-Airport 2x4
Manchester Airport – M53 2x3
M53 – Dunkirk 2x2

M57:
Huyton – Netherton 2x3

M58:
Liverpool – Wigan 2x3

M60:
Stockport – M62 2x3
M62 – Worsley 2x4
Worsley – M61 4+3
M61 – M62 2x4
M62 – Stockport 2x3

M61:
Manchester – Bamber Bridge 2x3

M62:
Liverpool – Manchester 2x3
Manchester – Hull 2x3

M65:
Farington – Clayton 2x3
Clayton – Feniscowles 2x2
Feniscowles – Lower Darlen 2+3
Lower Darlen – Blackburn 2x2
Blackburn – Hapton 2x3
Hapton – Colne 2x2

M66:
Edenfield – Manchester 2x2

M67:
Manchester – Mottram 2+3

M69:
Coventry – Leicester 2x3

M73:
Birkenshaw – Baillieston 2x3
Baillieston – Moodiesburn 2x2

M74:
Glasgow – Gretna 2x3

M77:
Glasgow – Fenwick 2x2

M80:
Glasgow – Stepps 2x2

M90:
Inverkeithing – Perth 2x2
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 15th, 2007, 01:00 AM   #185
Des
Traveller
 
Des's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: MUC
Posts: 2,436
Likes (Received): 806

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chriszwolle View Post
I found this list i made on my computer. I made it last summer with Google Earth. It's about the number of lanes.

M1:
London – M25 2x3
M25 – Hemel Hempstead 4+3
Hemel Hempstead – Flamstead 2x3
Flamstead – Luton-South 4+3
Luton-South – Leicester M69 2x3
Leicester M69 – Leicester-North 2x4
Cool! Do you hapen to have a similar list of Germany?
__________________
Car News
Des no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 15th, 2007, 01:10 AM   #186
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,594
Likes (Received): 19388

No, unfortunatly not.

But Autobahn-online has done that. (In German).
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2007, 10:24 AM   #187
Jeroen669
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 787
Likes (Received): 13

You're forgetting the M96, Chris.
Jeroen669 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2007, 12:29 PM   #188
Mateusz
Registered User
 
Mateusz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 6,536
Likes (Received): 235

I know the some sections of A1 in northern England, heading to Scotland in Newcastle direction will be upgraded to motorway So it will be A1(M)
Mateusz no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2007, 03:36 PM   #189
GNU
Gnuru
 
GNU's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Brave GNU World
Posts: 2,749
Likes (Received): 35

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonesy55 View Post
Here's an interesting feature of the M62 between Manchester and Leeds

When the motorway was built in the 1960s, one farmer refused to sell his 18th century farmhouse to the government and so they just built three lanes around one side of it and three lanes around the other side. To reach the outside world, he has a tunnel under the carriageway which leads eventually to a local road.





Around this point in the motorway also happens to be the highest the UK network gets above sea level, 439m

Poor guy
GNU no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2007, 06:30 PM   #190
sotonsi
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,555

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chriszwolle View Post
I found this list i made on my computer. I made it last summer with Google Earth. It's about the number of lanes.
there are many inaccuracies there, mostly due to out of date aerial images (eg, you don't have the D6M bit of the M25). Also you use place names that are hard to locate at times - junction numbers would be easier. CBRD's Motorway Database has up to date data, and uses junction numbers - which is how British people work it out, unless they are local, whereby junction names have very different names to the German-esque ones you have given. An example is given below. Also you use a very confusing system of lane assignments - sticking to engineering descriptions, or spelling it out would be far clearer.
Quote:
M3:
London – North Waltham A303 2x3
North Waltham – Winchester 2x2
Winchester – Southampton 2x3
Southampton – M27 2x2+2x2
should read (for accuracy, and also for clarity):
[LEFT]M3:
Sunbury (j1) - Popham (j8) D3M (or 3 lanes each way)
Popham (j8) - j9 D2M (or 2 lanes each way)
j9 - Chandlers Ford (j13) D3M
Chandlers Ford (j13) - M27 directional split (j14):
northbound 4 lanes
southbound 3 lanes
M27 West slip road:
northbound 2 lanes
southbound 2 lanes, 3 lanes between j13 on slip and A33 offslip
M27 East slip road:
northbound 2 lanes, 3 lanes north of A33 junction
southbound 2 lanes
Notes:southbound M27 directional split occurs halfway through j13 and both slip roads run parallel for a while (and both have an exit to the A33)
the M3 has two lanes northbound and one lane southbound through the M25 junction.
Near Winchester services (just north of j9) there is a southbound climbing lane for a mile
sotonsi no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2007, 08:42 PM   #191
RV
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Porvoo
Posts: 726
Likes (Received): 275

How many cars/day are needed in the UK to built a motorway? (most of Europe 15 000)
RV no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2007, 09:06 PM   #192
ChrisH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 351
Likes (Received): 12

Quote:
Originally Posted by RV View Post
How many cars/day are needed in the UK to built a motorway? (most of Europe 15 000)
For a dual-2 lane motorway, 30,000. For dual-3 lanes, 50,000, and 75,000 for dual-4 lanes!
ChrisH no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2007, 09:22 PM   #193
RV
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Porvoo
Posts: 726
Likes (Received): 275

30 000! A 2-lane road with 30 000 cars/day is fully collapsed!
RV no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2007, 09:26 PM   #194
ChrisH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 351
Likes (Received): 12

I think a non-motorway dual carriageway can be built with lower traffic, but probably not less than 25,000. I'll leave it to you to figure out why motorways are only built with such high traffic requirements...
ChrisH no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2007, 09:49 PM   #195
dios tanatos
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,102
Likes (Received): 4

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrishillcoat View Post
I think a non-motorway dual carriageway can be built with lower traffic, but probably not less than 25,000. I'll leave it to you to figure out why motorways are only built with such high traffic requirements...
"Dual carriageway" is such an old-fashioned term. It is cars & not carriages that travel on them. Why don't you start calling them "two-lane highways"? Just because it is a Yank coinage?
dios tanatos no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 17th, 2007, 10:04 PM   #196
Chris_533976
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 210
Likes (Received): 27

2+2 in Ireland, which is effectively dual carriageway (no hard shoulder) with non GSJ junctions, is being built instead of a lot of new 2+1 projects. Apparently it only costs 10% more to build this 2+2 than 2+1. Some of the roads planned for this have ~6k AADT.

Even some of the interurbans, which connect the major cities, have only an AADT of 9 or 10,000 at their middle bits, but are being built as HQDC/motorway for safety reasons and to provide much needed bypasses of bottlenecked villages en-route.

Puts it in perspective
Chris_533976 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 18th, 2007, 12:40 AM   #197
Nephasto
Enlightened user
 
Nephasto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Porto
Posts: 5,802
Likes (Received): 71

Quote:
Originally Posted by dios tanatos View Post
"Dual carriageway" is such an old-fashioned term. It is cars & not carriages that travel on them. Why don't you start calling them "two-lane highways"? Just because it is a Yank coinage?
Two lane? Well, as far as I know, a regular road is a two lane road: 2x1.
__________________
Long live rail freight!!
Nephasto no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 18th, 2007, 09:31 AM   #198
Jean Luc
BANNED
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Sydney
Posts: 460
Likes (Received): 15

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonesy55 View Post
Here's an interesting feature of the M62 between Manchester and Leeds

When the motorway was built in the 1960s, one farmer refused to sell his 18th century farmhouse to the government and so they just built three lanes around one side of it and three lanes around the other side. To reach the outside world, he has a tunnel under the carriageway which leads eventually to a local road.





Around this point in the motorway also happens to be the highest the UK network gets above sea level, 439m
Why didn't they just build the entire motorway on one side of the farmhouse? Were the roadbuilders just getting back at him for not selling his land? Seems a bit mean to me, although another part of me says "serves him right for not selling"...

BTW, in the second photo there are what appear to be arrowheads (arrows without the stems) painted on the lanes on the left hand carraigeway, at the bottom of the picture. What do they mean?

I guess it snows there too in winter, eh?
Jean Luc no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 18th, 2007, 01:34 PM   #199
Mateusz
Registered User
 
Mateusz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 6,536
Likes (Received): 235

£20 million scheme to widen the M1 in South Yorkshire nears completion

A major scheme to widen one of the busiest stretches of the M1 in Yorkshire is nearing completion.

The new M1 northbound carriageway between junctions 31 to 32 near Sheffield fully re−opens early on Saturday morning (15th December). The new southbound lanes are expected to be finished before Christmas. Both carriageways have been widened from three lanes to four with the aim of increasing capacity and improving safety.

A 50 mph speed limit will remain in place for safety reasons on the southbound stretch until February 2008 to allow completion work on new overhead electronic signs.

The widening work on the M1 junctions 31 to 32 is being carried out by Jackson Civil Engineering Ltd
Mateusz no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 18th, 2007, 02:23 PM   #200
RKC
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Budapest
Posts: 1,462
Likes (Received): 28

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonesy55 View Post
Here's an interesting feature of the M62 between Manchester and Leeds

When the motorway was built in the 1960s, one farmer refused to sell his 18th century farmhouse to the government and so they just built three lanes around one side of it and three lanes around the other side. To reach the outside world, he has a tunnel under the carriageway which leads eventually to a local road.





Around this point in the motorway also happens to be the highest the UK network gets above sea level, 439m
hahaha dumbass, serves him right...
we got the same probs with the M0 in Budapest

also agree about the "enviromentalists" their idea of protecting the environment is not to build anything, better if we suffocate in our gases
RKC no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
highways, motorway, united kingdom

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 09:54 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium