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Old December 9th, 2012, 07:46 PM   #3221
Comfortably Numb
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This article is a few months old, but worthy of mentioning:

http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-18913663

Up to £1.5b seems like a lot of money to "upgrade" just one section. Making it a toll road might work. For that money though, I think it should be brought up to motorway standard, complete with hard shoulders and motorway regulations between Cambridge and the M1. Instead of widening it to 3 lanes, the 3rd lane would be the hard shoulder, which would allow broken down vehicles to move over and would improve safety.

A14(M) or M45 extension?
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Old December 9th, 2012, 08:09 PM   #3222
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A14 connects with the M6 and M1.
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Old December 9th, 2012, 08:17 PM   #3223
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK View Post
A14 connects with the M6 and M1.
But you could downgrade the current M45 as was done with the former M10 and reuse the M45 number.

Or call it the A14(M) Toll?
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Old December 9th, 2012, 11:57 PM   #3224
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Comfortably Numb View Post
Up to £1.5b seems like a lot of money to "upgrade" just one section.
Offline route for part of it (high land costs), a very extravagant junction modification on a live junction and some serious widening for several miles (high traffic management costs)
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Making it a toll road might work.
Not really, unless you make shunpiking very hard.
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For that money though, I think it should be brought up to motorway standard,
There's not really such a thing. I know what you mean, but it's just not really a thing.
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complete with hard shoulders and motorway regulations between Cambridge and the M1.
The M1? This is just the A1-M11 section (and about the only bit that warrants motorway upgrade).

Upgrading 100km of D2 to D3M+LAR would cost about £1.6billion without major structures or offline stretches (based on Dishforth to Leeming costs). However there will be quite a few offline stretches and some major junction reworkings. You'd be lucky to get it in for under £4 billion, based on the costs of M11-A1.
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Instead of widening it to 3 lanes, the 3rd lane would be the hard shoulder, which would allow broken down vehicles to move over and would improve safety.
Except it wouldn't deal with the actual safety issue - that there's way too little capacity between the A1 and M11 (as N-S and E-W routes are on the same bit of road). Providing a third lane and bypassing/upgrading the closely spaced junctions between Cambridge and Huntingdon would solve all of the safety issues with that section.

And good luck getting a road widened but no additional running lanes (would totally fail any sensible cost-benefit analysis) - you'll only get a hard shoulder if you widen to three lanes and other than at Kettering, the road west of the M1 simply doesn't need that.
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A14(M) or M45 extension?

M11 extension? Otherwise, surely M14?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Comfortably Numb View Post
But you could downgrade the current M45 as was done with the former M10 and reuse the M45 number.


Please explain to me:
1)motorway status (like how do you downgrade the M45 without wasting hundreds of millions just to get at a number...)
2)motorway numbering (...a number which is not only wrong, but completely unnecessarily wrong)
In this one sentence you show total and utter ignorance of both.

I despise the idea of extending the M6 west of Catthorpe, but it's a billion times better than downgrading the current M45 and recycling the number for the A14.
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Old December 22nd, 2012, 02:26 AM   #3225
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Government considering privatizing the motorways: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/...oll-roads.html

The article's more...complex...than the headline (or my paraphrase of it). Other options being considered...private operators could add tolls to any new capacity they build such as new lanes...I just happened on it but it's worth reading.

EDIT: PS: Telegraph comments are always a trip....
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Old December 22nd, 2012, 02:43 PM   #3226
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Won't happen
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Old December 22nd, 2012, 04:17 PM   #3227
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Glad to hear it, but why do you say that?
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Old December 22nd, 2012, 07:48 PM   #3228
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No way they'll ever get elected again if they put tolls around
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Old December 22nd, 2012, 08:16 PM   #3229
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Got it. (Should have been obvious, reallly....)

Cheers!
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Old December 22nd, 2012, 08:27 PM   #3230
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In other news, Britain has just renamed a bit of Antarctica after Her Nibs. Foreign Secretary gave her a plaque. But are there any motorways or primary routes there?
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Old December 22nd, 2012, 09:35 PM   #3231
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No, Antartica route 1, linking two US bases, and the only 'road' of any length goes through the New Zealand claim and unclaimed territory.

If the UK made a road in our bit of Antarctica, it wouldn't be a primary route, let alone a motorway. It wouldn't go through the massive desert of ice and penguins that Queen Elizabeth Land is.

And Buenos Aires will get all argy-bargy over it (which alone would be worth spending the money on such a road)!

I'm not sure there's even secret A roads in the Falklands (there are in St Helena, so it's not that crazy), which would be the closest one.
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Old January 18th, 2013, 09:34 PM   #3232
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Do you know why A16 from Peterborough to Spalding was built as a single carriageway? It's pretty nice and high standard road, however not adequate to the traffic rolling on it. I have no doubts what the answer would be, but does it make any sense to invest in cheaper road, which needs to be improved "tomorrow", just to avoid higher cost "today"?


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Old January 18th, 2013, 09:40 PM   #3233
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sotonsi View Post
I'm not sure there's even secret A roads in the Falklands (there are in St Helena, so it's not that crazy), which would be the closest one.
I've been to the Falklands and I don't think there could be any secret roads there. Most of it is bog, so roads are difficult to conceal. Wonderful place though and I encourage visiting. Outside the capital, nearly all roads are unpaved.
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Old January 18th, 2013, 11:17 PM   #3234
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Doesn't he mean roads that are assigned a number but aren't posted as such?

I saw these number things in the City a few weeks ago

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Old January 19th, 2013, 12:17 AM   #3235
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There are a few of those countdown timers on pedestrian crossings in London now. There is certainly one at the Oxford Circus lights, and they're really convenient so you can judge if you've got time to dash across before the traffic starts again. None outside central London though, to my knowledge.
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Old January 19th, 2013, 09:42 AM   #3236
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Looking at the A3 in the snow reminds me of the time growing up in Norwich we were going to have a weekend in London but we cancelled as it would take too long to get there. From our house to the A47 bypass it took nearly an hour (usually ten minutes)...too long...so we turned back and spent the weekend at home....our big Friday night was to the A47 and back!!
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Old January 19th, 2013, 09:53 AM   #3237
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Comfortably Numb View Post
But you could downgrade the current M45 as was done with the former M10 and reuse the M45 number.

Or call it the A14(M) Toll?
Why not upgrade and extend M45 south of Coventry to join with M42 and Birmingham Airport?

Why not major upgrade of A428 Cambridge-Bedford-Northampton to major highway to take pressure off A14. It provides an additional cross country route. At Northampton the highway can cross M1 and join with A43 south to Oxford?
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Old January 19th, 2013, 10:50 AM   #3238
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Quote:
Originally Posted by essendon bombers View Post

Why not upgrade and extend M45 south of Coventry to join with M42 and Birmingham Airport?
Because when it turns A45 it goes right through the city and residential area's.
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Old January 19th, 2013, 09:06 PM   #3239
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Quote:
Originally Posted by essendon bombers View Post
Why not upgrade and extend M45 south of Coventry to join with M42 and Birmingham Airport?

Why not major upgrade of A428 Cambridge-Bedford-Northampton to major highway to take pressure off A14. It provides an additional cross country route. At Northampton the highway can cross M1 and join with A43 south to Oxford?
Probably because that is what the A14 was intended to do. It's a more direct route, going directly east from the bottom of the M6 and avoiding Northampton and Bedford which are big towns (and the heavily used M1). They also built the A421 from Milton Keynes past Bedford to St Neots which provides an alternative, and will probably be used more in the event of a toll being slapped on the A14.

The Highways Agency seems to be under the misapprehension that traffic from the Midlands bound for Harwich uses the A14 (hence the signs for Harwich which start as soon as you hit Kettering, or even the A14 at Catthorpe, I'm not sure which). In fact, there are much shorter routes there, such as via the M1, M25 and A12, as any sat-nav or navigation app will show. Even when you hit Cambridge on the A14, a sat-nav will direct you via the M11 and A120. The A14 via Ipswich is a huge detour.
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Old January 19th, 2013, 10:35 PM   #3240
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IndigoJo View Post
In fact, there are much shorter routes there, such as via the M1, M25 and A12
Birmingham - Harwich is 185 miles vs 173 via Cambridge and Stansted and 179 for via Cambridge and Ipswich
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as any sat-nav or navigation app will show.
Get a better sat nav?
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Even when you hit Cambridge on the A14, a sat-nav will direct you via the M11 and A120. The A14 via Ipswich is a huge detour.
It is about 5 miles. However via Ipswich is all decent roads to Colchester, rather than the S2 bit of the A120. Google is suggesting no time difference. Certainly both routes are viable options, but obviously they would want you to take the higher capacity route via Ipswich at the moment - when they finish the A120, then we shall see about the via Stansted route being signed for Harwich.

The EU, with their Trans-European Network - Transport (TEN-T) system have the Harwich - Midlands traffic using either/both the A120 and the A14 to get between the port and Cambridge.
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