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Old November 5th, 2008, 02:25 AM   #501
sotonsi
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I think that even with the 'high quality' dual carriageways (mostly they aren't) the network is far from complete.

Here's a 30 year plan. Blue is current and funded motorways, red is my plans (though a couple of them have been proposed). I'm mostly filling in gaps, and upgrading routes from scratch, though a few major dual carriageways are there, upgraded. Some routes would be tolled, and most would be D2 (two lanes each way), though some things would be D3. This may seem extreme, but most of it is instead of large bits of widening. There'd still be some dual carriageways to also carry traffic.

What's missing is NI - M1 to Omagh, M22 to Londonderry, A8(M) to Larne (renumber M8?) plus a Belfast ring road type thing between Bangor and Lisburn, and a bypass from Banbridge to the A8 to Larne (via the Airport), with a link to Antrim. Also a Londonderry-Coleraine motorway and a Derry-Strabane one too. Also A1(M) from the border to Lisburn. All of these can be D2, and tolls don't bother me.



In terms of 20 years, the M30, M34 between M3 and M40, M11, M42, M51, M56, A555(M), A556(M), M18 to York, M19 north of York, M9, M90 to N of Dundee, M14, M34 between M11 and Newmarket, M3 to Poole, M4 Newport Bypass, A1(M) to Newcastle (and round it), M12 and M68 should be built. I'd be surprised if we get more than the M4, A1(M), M42 to the M1, A556(M) and a Dundee outer bypass (as A90) by 2028.
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Old November 5th, 2008, 10:11 AM   #502
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I don't think that you really need the M22. AFAIK the traffic intensities are quite low and the A6 is mostly a wide two-laned road, that works out pretty well. Correct me if I'm wrong - only been there once.
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Old November 5th, 2008, 03:20 PM   #503
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The M22 plan is about make that route a lot better - it's actually got quite a bad twisty bit through the mountains. Traffic volumes of this level south of the border would warrant a motorway easily, even with the old road in the fairly decent state it's in (look at the M17 plan, which comes alongside plans to upgrade the old N17, traffic volumes are about the same on both routes). The A6 route suppresses demand - as many people seem to go to Derry via Coleraine, because that road is better.

The Northern Irish Roads Service are planning on making a grade-separated dual carriageway for Londonderry-Dungiven, as well as another GSDC extending from the end of the M22 the other way. Sadly these won't be motorway, though it won't be that hard for them to become so.

I guess I would like this scheme as much to say to the Republic "yea, we can have a motorway network like yours" as it is for traffic reasons. Londonderry is rather small, however it's bigger than Waterford, bigger than Galway, yet both of these will have motorways to Dublin. The Republic went nearly as far as wanting to build a motorway across NI to get to Derry, though they seem to have gone for a dual carriageway of unspecified type.

The original plans had the M2 going to Coleraine and about halfway between Ballymena and Coleraine a spur, the M23 going to Limavady and Londonderry. The M22 was just going to be a route to Castledawson/Magerafelt. What I'm doing is having a Belfast-North Coast route in the A26/M2 route, and a Belfast-Derry & Donegal route, as well as a Derry-North Coast route.

Last edited by sotonsi; November 5th, 2008 at 03:29 PM.
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Old November 5th, 2008, 07:50 PM   #504
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Wow, great plan, it seems like UK will significantlly expand road network
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Old November 5th, 2008, 07:57 PM   #505
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Hopefully they do that, because it's necessary in some places.
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Old November 5th, 2008, 08:02 PM   #506
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I don't know, I need to see some traffic data before I can make a good judgement. Most motorways are 2x3 but it makes a difference if they carry 120.000 or 180.000 vehicles/day.
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Old November 5th, 2008, 08:24 PM   #507
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Is it realted to road consultancy job ? I was always woundering what is is about UK might need it if they want to expand their network, to be honest you could expect more roads in such country
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Old November 6th, 2008, 01:40 AM   #508
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mateusz View Post
Wow, great plan, it seems like UK will significantlly expand road network
Thanks - the plan is entirely mine, save a small number of schemes that come from HMG and subsidiaries. I have used some old plans, IIRC, but they've long been sent to the "lose it" section of archives.

Here's the current, through as much as possible onto it 30 year plan for the motorway network expansion (though there will be lots of widening)


That's the M4 Newport Southern Bypass scheme proposed by the Welsh Assembly, the New Forth Crossing giving a short spur (perhaps M9), proposed by the Scottish Executive or whatever they call themselves, completion of the A1(M) in North Yorkshire proposed, and fairly definite to go ahead, by the Highways Agency, completion of the A1(M) in Yorkshire - not officially proposed by the HA yet, though it's looking likely and some studies have proposed it IIRC. A1(M) extension to meet the A14 CHUMMS scheme - proposed by the Cambridge-Huntingdon Multi Modal Study (CHUMMS) in one of the options (IIRC might not happen) and the East of England regional body, which also proposes the Peterborough-Stamford bit of A1(M) in it's Greater Peterborough study.

I also added the A556(M) and M6 Expressway, simply as schemes that were scrapped in the last 5 years, as the map was looking rather empty.

You are looking at very little, and that's effectively the 30 year plan - there isn't, of course, a 30 year plan. After all, this is Britain! Even TfL only have a 19 year plan (running to 2025).

Last edited by sotonsi; November 6th, 2008 at 03:00 AM. Reason: to get picture to work
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Old November 7th, 2008, 07:19 PM   #509
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lets see if this works
[img][/img]
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Old November 7th, 2008, 07:22 PM   #510
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It didn't !

I have bare pictures of British roads... I took them in late 2005 and 2006 on my crappy old camera so there not that great.

M32 (Bristol City Centre - M4)
<a href="http://img243.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dscf3049hk4.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/1648/dscf3049hk4.th.jpg" border="0" alt="Free Image Hosting at www.ImageShack.us" /></a><br /><br /><a href="http://img604.imageshack.us/content.php?page=blogpost&files=img243/1648/dscf3049hk4.jpg" title="QuickPost"><img src="http://imageshack.us/img/butansn.png" alt="QuickPost" border="0"></a> Quickpost this image to Myspace, Digg, Facebook, and others!
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Old November 7th, 2008, 07:23 PM   #511
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nope that didnt work either

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Old November 7th, 2008, 07:46 PM   #512
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thats better :-D

Like I was saying... these were taken on the M32, heading out of Bristol.

http://img394.imageshack.us/img394/6926/dscf3049hv2.jpg

Sorry about the glare: it says 'LONDON & S.WALES, MIDLANDS (M4, M5)
http://img394.imageshack.us/img394/1058/dscf3050xx8.jpg

http://img394.imageshack.us/img394/5116/dscf3051xr8.jpg

http://img394.imageshack.us/img394/8837/dscf3052dz7.jpg

my exit :-)
http://img388.imageshack.us/img388/2342/dscf3054uz9.jpg

http://img388.imageshack.us/img388/4818/dscf3055uv0.jpg

http://img388.imageshack.us/img388/9996/dscf3056pi0.jpg

anyway got to go, tea's ready lol!

Last edited by ChrisZwolle; November 26th, 2008 at 08:21 PM.
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Old November 8th, 2008, 08:48 AM   #513
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Great pictures mate, but you might want to use the resize picture option on Imageshack next time.
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Old November 26th, 2008, 08:21 PM   #514
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The Channel Tunnel (Chunnel) was closed in September. This was the result on truck traffic along the Motorway.

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Old November 27th, 2008, 12:09 AM   #515
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This is well known as police 'operation stack', as it tends to happen quite a lot (75 times in 20 years apparently!) due to brisavoine et al going on strike

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Stack
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Old November 27th, 2008, 01:05 AM   #516
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Operation Stack uses some of the M20 as a lorry park (for those too lazy to click the link). Hence the lorries in lane 3 (illegal normally) in the video, and the sheer number of them. Often happens because the French lorry drivers, etc blockade and strike - so we kindly move the place where the lorries get stuck to this side of the Channel. This time it was a Channel Tunnel fire.
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Old November 27th, 2008, 01:28 AM   #517
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Republica View Post
This is well known as police 'operation stack', as it tends to happen quite a lot (75 times in 20 years apparently!) due to brisavoine et al going on strike

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Stack
Happens a bit more often than 75 times in 20 years, try every time it's windy and ferries are delayed, any strike opportunity etc. Was in use every week a couple of months back for various reasons.
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Old November 27th, 2008, 01:41 AM   #518
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Question to British forumers (or perhaps others too):

Which motorways do you think are essentially to construct the next 20 years? Or perhaps by upgrading existing roads?
We're not generally too bad at North South directions but when heading across country we're poor here. The A14 is a pleasant car park for much of it's time and here in sheffield the main routes to Manchester either the Snake pass (A57) or the Woodhead (A628) are romantically named but poor for the traffic levels. The M67 as proposed in the 1960s would solve this one but will never happen due to environmental considerations, even though the route has a rail track (disused) and a high voltage electricity pylon corridor straight along it. apparently road improvements would be seen as disturbing the (un) natural countryside here

Many of the much promised widening schemes are under review to cut cost, so what will come to fruition is generally hard shoulder running - a dubious improvement as they are really just longer slip roads. Current economic conditions are leading to a review of expenditure so I expect many more projects to be cancelled/delayed or just lost in time.
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Old November 27th, 2008, 01:50 AM   #519
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I hear M6 Birmingham is notorious for bottlenecks. Are they doing anything to try to alleviate this problem?
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Old November 27th, 2008, 03:40 AM   #520
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It's more Wasall-Wolverhampton, rather than Birmingham: M5 to M54. It'll get ATM, along with other parts of the network around there. There's not really any chance of widening the M5 and M6 in the West Midland Conurbation, due to being on viaducts for much of it. Building collector-distributor roads on separate viaducts would work, but the cost would be too high for the Government to do it.

A sensible option would be to make the M6 Toll free and also build the Western Orbital. This would mean that traffic for other areas can easily bypass the central area. There's the problems of suppressed demand, and the through routes being shorter to deal with still, but having the alternatives would help no end.
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