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Old November 20th, 2008, 09:29 PM   #41
Republica
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Quote:
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In London's case i blame the authorities for fuelling the fare evade people. Just the other day i was on the super long busses from Camden town to Finsbury park, the buss had no conductor and people got in and out through the back door without paying. put conductors in and they will recoup the 300 that transport for london is losing every year. Also use the plastic, sorry the toothless community officers to board the buss and see how many people swipe their oyster cards and make payment. In a nutshell the fraud takes place because the authorites let them

Conductors would recoup only a portion of that 300m and would cost millions to introduce.
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Old November 20th, 2008, 10:41 PM   #42
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i know someone who did it for a week with an unscratched day pass
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Old December 7th, 2009, 04:51 PM   #43
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I guess that is usually less expensive in the long term to put physical barriers in place - then fine harshly those who jump/underpass them - than relying in dozens or thousands of fare controllers.

Here in The Netherladns, where I'm now living, this is a problem especially in night suburban trains: some teenagers just seem to think that is ok to ride an almost-empty train without paying for it.
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Old December 7th, 2009, 05:28 PM   #44
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Wonder whether overall revenues have gone down as a result of the honour system? Are there any such studies of late around the world?
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Old December 7th, 2009, 11:02 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hkskyline View Post
Wonder whether overall revenues have gone down as a result of the honour system? Are there any such studies of late around the world?
Well in Vancouver, there fare evasion rate is estimated at 3%, but this number itself is quite off as it only accounts for the people who have been caught under the Proof-of-Payment system. Here's an excerpt from a local newspaper:

Quote:
In 2008, 14,400 tickets were handed out and 11,300 went unpaid, for an unpaid-fine total of $1.95 million.

The scofflaws were even worse in 2007, when 24,200 tickets were issued and just 2,400 offenders paid up.
(Luba of The Province, 2009)

And to note, even if you are caught, some of the transit police (and/or attendants) ask the evaders to go back and purchase a ticket and not hand out a ticket. To a point, it's understandable for attendants as they do not have the right to issue tickets (this is the system on the Canada Line), but really, the transit police have no excuse. More attendants and transit police members will certainly help the issue, but the Ministry of Transportation has decided to install fare gates, monitored by attendants.
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Old December 7th, 2009, 11:34 PM   #46
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I guess tourists like to play the out-of-town card. At least when I lived in Italy it was utterly common: tourists - usually those who could speak basic Italian at least, argued with transit police in Rome and Milando that "oh, I didn't know, I thought on weekends I could use the system for free".

True, if you are on weekends, it is hard to find ticket machines, and drives cannot accept fare payment no matter what. But asking them in Central Rome, where there are dozens of ticket machines scattered around... is just fool, like "I want to travel for free".
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Old December 8th, 2009, 08:12 AM   #47
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Not exactly fair evasion.

I am a university student and i can prove it by showing identification. In my hometown of Adelaide, Australia this allows me to get cheaper "concession" tickets instead of paying the full fare. However, If i were to travel Interstate to another city like Sydney and purchase a concession ticket, the ticket inspectors will not accept another state's concession card and attempt to issue me with the maximum fine for fare evasion. the "at least i've got a ticket and ID" line usually gets rid of them. Its the same country, so it shouldnt matter.

But here's the joke of it all; i can actually travel to ANOTHER COUNTRY like anywhere in Western Europe for example and use that same concession card to buy university-student tickets, with no issues.
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Old December 8th, 2009, 11:19 AM   #48
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I hate this subside policy of rail travel for international students in Europe. I don't think it is fair, they should pay as everyone else. But that is another discussion.

I still think barrier systems work the best. They might be costly to install, but once it's done, it's done.
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Old December 8th, 2009, 11:23 AM   #49
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In the Barcelona Metro every day many people are jumping the barriers and do not pay the ticket. A single ticket costs €1.35 and €40 fine is not very expensive, many people prefer to pay a fine once a year rather than every day.

Some examples of this impunity:




And ... FAIL:

XD

Last edited by Sr.Horn; December 8th, 2009 at 12:08 PM.
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Old December 8th, 2009, 03:05 PM   #50
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In London I really almost never see it on the Tube. 98% of stations are gated and all gates have guards, so it's pretty impossible to evade fares. On bendy buses you do have it though, but they'll be getting rid of all of those in the next two years.
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Old December 8th, 2009, 06:55 PM   #51
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Quote:
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In London I really almost never see it on the Tube. 98% of stations are gated and all gates have guards, so it's pretty impossible to evade fares. On bendy buses you do have it though, but they'll be getting rid of all of those in the next two years.
You should tell that to the dozen or so RPO who did a blitz at Notting Hill Gate tube station the other day. In fact I get stopped at this station about once every 3 months for a ticket check. I think the main issue is people coming from the DLR or Stratford, but I always thought if you got on and didn't swipe then when leaving you would be charged the maximum fare, so not sure what they are doing.
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Old December 8th, 2009, 11:53 PM   #52
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Is Vienna the only major city that hasn't barriers anywhere (rail, subway, trams, buses)? Sometimes you can use the system for a year or even two without getting controlled once (and then you get controlled 2 times within a week). An exception are only night buses which are pretty thoroughly controlled. Getting caught costs if payed within 3 days 67,80 € (don't ask me who made up that number) if you pay later it costs you 130€. A regular single ticket is 1,80 €.

From my own experience however the vast majority does not evade fares, judging from the controls I have experienced so far. Only a relatively small number uses single tickets however.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 06:35 AM   #53
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On the HBLR, people give others their ticket all the time, sometimes you just pop it in the information display's bezel on the TVM and people can grab it because it has a 1.5 hour time limit. Not fare evasion, just being kind to fellow humans!

I also swipe people into the subway and PATH all the time when i can afford it. Nothing wrong with helping folks with a dose of kindness!

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Old December 9th, 2009, 08:40 AM   #54
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In Stockholm if you get caught not having a valid ticket, you'll be forced to pay a fine of approximately 110 (1200 SEK). Think about it next time you visit Stockholm and use its public transport.

Cheers.
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Old December 10th, 2009, 01:10 PM   #55
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In Bratislava (Slovakia) it's similar as in Vienna, just casual controls, depends on what line you are riding how often you will meet non-uniformed cops - on touristy lines to airport, main train and bus station is high potentional of control, on less touristy you man not meet control whole year. If you don't have valid signed ticket fine is 40EUR, basic ticket for 60min ride costs 0.70EUR.
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Old December 10th, 2009, 01:32 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chilenofuturista View Post
In Stockholm if you get caught not having a valid ticket, you'll be forced to pay a fine of approximately 110 € (1200 SEK). Think about it next time you visit Stockholm and use its public transport.

Cheers.
Does that insurance thingy still exist? You pay them a small monthly fee and they pay for any ticket you might get while faredodging... It's a ridiculous set-up but I know it existed back when I was living there.

Edit: there they are! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planka.nu
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Old December 10th, 2009, 02:55 PM   #57
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Quote:
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Does that insurance thingy still exist? You pay them a small monthly fee and they pay for any ticket you might get while faredodging... It's a ridiculous set-up but I know it existed back when I was living there.

Edit: there they are! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planka.nu
I think planka.nu still exists, but I wouldn't go there. May I remind you that it is illegal and it's not worth the hassle.
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Old December 10th, 2009, 03:03 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slartibartfas View Post
Is Vienna the only major city that hasn't barriers anywhere (rail, subway, trams, buses)?
Hamburg hasn't barriers as well. You are just required to show your ticket to the bus driver after 9pm. However many bus drivers don't reaally care.

Also in Berlin are no barriers. You have to stamp your ticket at the metro entrance, but it doesn't hinder you riding the metro without ticket.

I haven't seen barriers in public transport in any german city.
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Old December 10th, 2009, 04:57 PM   #59
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I think planka.nu still exists, but I wouldn't go there. May I remind you that it is illegal and it's not worth the hassle.
If it is illegal, why haven't they shut it down yet? They can't be that hard to find given that they actually make payments to SJ.
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Old January 27th, 2010, 05:30 PM   #60
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Pittsburgh-area transit buses getting new fareboxes that can tell real cash from counterfeit
19 January 2010

PITTSBURGH (AP) - Pittsburgh-area transit buses are getting new fareboxes which will be able to distinguish between real and counterfeit money.

Port Authority of Allegheny County spokesman Jim Ritchie says the old fareboxes aren't very discriminating, saying, "You could stuff a sock in them and it won't go through."

But the new boxes read a magnetic strip imbedded in money, measure its dimensions and scan various features on the surface of bills. If the money is questionable, it will either be rejected or an image of the bill will be displayed on a small screen for the driver to examine.

The new fareboxes are part of a $33 million overhaul of the authority's fare collection process.

------

Information from: Pittsburgh Post-Gazette
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