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Old December 18th, 2012, 10:33 AM   #281
ElviS77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowdog View Post
Okay, so you're for a speed limit of 30km/h on all roads ?
( yes I exaggerate to make my point, my line of freedom vs safety is a bit less towards safety than average...)

My opinion is still:

2+1 is better than 1x2 with prohibited overtaking.
1x2 with overtaking allowed is fine, provided it doesn't have much traffic.
If traffic is to heavy on a 1x2 road to comfortably overtake, then 2x2 is necessary...
My point is, as quite clearly made out in the paragraph you neglected to quote, that reducing speed limits and introducing overtaking bans is the easy fix to dangerous (i.e. busy) wide 2-lane roads. I'm also implying that I think such measures will be introduced more often in an increasing number of countries.

Motorways are of course the best and safest solution, but they will not happen everywhere overnight. 2+1 is a very cheap and reasonably effective solution which is also safer, 2+1 with a fixed central barrier is more expensive, but far cheaper to build than a motorway and almost as safe.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 11:07 AM   #282
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I wonder, perhaps it would be better if the profile of this road would be 2x2 without these 1.5 m wide hardsholders?
These 1,5 m wide strips aren't hard shoulders but verges. They are necessary regardless of the width of the road.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 02:20 PM   #283
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Originally Posted by flierfy View Post
These 1,5 m wide strips aren't hard shoulders but verges. They are necessary regardless of the width of the road.
If so, than google translate is guilty! yderrabat (danish) = hardshoulders (english)
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Old December 27th, 2012, 11:38 AM   #284
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image hosted on flickr

Road 35: a 2+1 road at some hilly sections


image hosted on flickr

This road is also full of speed cameras, most of them are not in use though.

image hosted on flickr

Some parts of the road are narrow

image hosted on flickr

image hosted on flickr


Other parts are wider
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Old December 29th, 2012, 04:05 PM   #285
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That looks so much like the southern part of belgium that region! the roads, the landscape...
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Old July 2nd, 2013, 07:31 PM   #286
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In Sweden 2+1 roads are very common. Some may see them as a temporary alternative for a full motorway, but I consider them to be satisfactory, they keep the speed down.
The 2 lane sections are long enough for overtaking.

Road 40 Ulricehamn-Jönköping is a 2+1 road


image hosted on flickr

Road 40 with wire barriers west of Jönköping.
image hosted on flickr

9km to Jönköping and 5km to Axamo Airport. This part of the road 40 is also shared with road 26 from Halmstad.
image hosted on flickr

End of the 2 lane section. Could be a stressfull moment.
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Old July 2nd, 2013, 07:53 PM   #287
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In Brazil its very common




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Old July 2nd, 2013, 10:16 PM   #288
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no barriers ? Why not divide the lanes with wires ?
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Old July 2nd, 2013, 10:45 PM   #289
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Yes. Low Traffic volume. Barrier isnt necessary there.

More one example:





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Old July 6th, 2013, 09:06 PM   #290
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NordikNerd View Post

image hosted on flickr

Road 40 with wire barriers west of Jönköping.
image hosted on flickr

9km to Jönköping and 5km to Axamo Airport. This part of the road 40 is also shared with road 26 from Halmstad.
image hosted on flickr

End of the 2 lane section. Could be a stressfull moment.
Why most 2-lanes roads in Europe there is not hard shoulder?
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Old August 28th, 2013, 03:26 AM   #291
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Hungary, main road 8 westbound after Veszprém
- photos taken August 2013 -



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Old August 30th, 2013, 05:38 PM   #292
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Why most 2-lanes roads in Europe there is not hard shoulder?
I noticed no-one has commented on this, so I'll try to give a reasonable answer. First, "Europe" is not a single entity and the situation differs considerably from country to country. In many countries, most two-lane roads have been replaced with motorways built in a separate corridor. Thus, the old two-laner is much quieter and there is no need to widen it. In other places, wide two-lane roads have been made into 2+1 roads or 2+2 expessways/motorways. Further, many roads in rural parts are not very busy, meaning that the governments don't really see the point in spending the extra money on wide shoulders and mountain or semi-urban roads are often very expensive to realign and/or widen. Still, you will find quite a few wide two-lane roads around the continent, some are even grade-separated.
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Old August 31st, 2013, 03:49 AM   #293
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElviS77 View Post
I noticed no-one has commented on this, so I'll try to give a reasonable answer. First, "Europe" is not a single entity and the situation differs considerably from country to country. In many countries, most two-lane roads have been replaced with motorways built in a separate corridor. Thus, the old two-laner is much quieter and there is no need to widen it. In other places, wide two-lane roads have been made into 2+1 roads or 2+2 expessways/motorways. Further, many roads in rural parts are not very busy, meaning that the governments don't really see the point in spending the extra money on wide shoulders and mountain or semi-urban roads are often very expensive to realign and/or widen. Still, you will find quite a few wide two-lane roads around the continent, some are even grade-separated.
The real reason is the lack of space or the high expense of space to be precise. Europe is far denser populated than both Americas. Space is valuable over here. Hence it is necessary to use space well and design roads sleek and slender. Shoulders on 2-lane-roads add very little and they simply cost too much to justify its construction.
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Old August 31st, 2013, 04:25 AM   #294
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In fact in Europe the 2+1 is seen as a solution to specific limited problems instead of a general design for complete routes.

2+1 roads are pretty rare, but we have some short segments where needed, usually on steep stretches with an important traffic flow. I'm thinking about the Fernpass road, for example.
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Old June 2nd, 2014, 04:30 PM   #295
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A short (ca. 5 km) stretch of 2+1 in B27 federal road in Germany, near Buchen (Odenwald). There are first 2 lanes in direction ahead, then it changes to two lanes for the opposite traffic.

May 2014

1.


2.


3. Here it ends already ... but A81 is not far away!
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Old June 2nd, 2014, 04:34 PM   #296
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Yes. Extra lane going uphill to avoid being stuck behind a crawling lorry. They're all over Germany.
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Old June 3rd, 2014, 08:04 PM   #297
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V512 (soon to be A12/E22) 2+1 road in Latvia. AFAIK the only 2+1 road (except some hill climbs) in the country.
https://www.google.com/maps/@56.3926...8nETCkWBeQ!2e0

There is no barrier and it's a broken white line so you can overtake. The extra lane is to accommodate lorry queues, not to accommodate high AADT which on this road, when it is complete, will probably be only 1825 - like on the road that this will replace.
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Old June 7th, 2014, 10:44 PM   #298
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Ivan Sedlo pass on Sarajevo-Mostar M17 road, Bosnia

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Old August 9th, 2014, 02:00 PM   #299
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British example.
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Old August 10th, 2014, 07:53 PM   #300
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I was in Ireland last month and noticed some Swedish-style 2+1 roads, with at-grade junctions and cable barriers such as this. They couldn't be better -the extra lane is handy to overtake slow traffic, yet when you do it and find you were almost alone you notice there's no need for a dual-carriageway road there. Later, playing with Street View I noticed more roads like that in the country (example).

I'd love to see more of this in my country. It would speed up the upgrade of many corridors that will need to wait a lot because a motorway is too expensive and not justified by traffic volumes.
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