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Old April 28th, 2013, 05:25 PM   #5801
nenea_hartia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
Whow, planning time from January to August (max. 8 month!)
In fact, the feasibility study for that project was started in 2007 (official link; official link of the tender). The winner of the tender was Search Corporation.
Yes, any feasibility study made here defines three or four routes for a future expressway/motorway and underlines the best option/route to be taken, which is eventually selected and approved by the Romanian Company for Motorways (CNADNR).

Then, during the procedures to get the environmental permit, there is a chance for citizens to object to the proposed route or any other part of the feasibility study they dislike. The environmental procedures are theoretically open and transparent, and anyone can attend to. Before the sessions of Environmental Agency, an announcement is issued to the public & press. See here the official announcement for the same expressway Sebeș-Turda. Please note, the announcement was issued in 2008. The last row of the document states that "any comments and remarks from the public are to be received daily, at the office of Romanian Agency for Environmental Protection".

Eventually, after the designer gets all permits and agreements (for instance, the planning certificate for Cluj County was issued in 2011, and so was the certificate for Alba County), he submits the feasibility study to CNADNR (see here an official note that Sebeș-Turda expressway has a feasibility study; the same on Ministry of Transportation's website).

Now, the current procedure for a feasibility study is in fact a normal procedure to update the old one (what's new on field, what changed on the proposed alignment, is it really necessary a motorway or an expressway should be enough? Are new land acquisitions required or slight changes of the initial route? Questions like that). Of course, new field measurements, geotechnical drillings and setting outs are required, so CNADNR has asked land owners to provide free access for all surveillance and geotechnical teams (see CNADNR's request here). All these procedures are to last from 18.04.2013 to 28.06.2013 (link). Only based on these new measurements, an updated feasibility study can be completed. Hence, it is not completed yet.

So, as you see, it takes few years of preparations and the procedures are similar for any other motorway project in Romania.
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Old April 28th, 2013, 05:42 PM   #5802
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Wow, the show-off! Should have been here earlier.
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Old April 28th, 2013, 05:56 PM   #5803
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nenea_hartia View Post
So, as you see, it takes few years of preparations and the procedures are similar for any other motorway project in Romania.
Thanks a lot !

That kind of planning procedure is similar to the German one's. We have a special project management company (DEGES) which plans "urgent" projects like the VDE projects (traffic projects German reunification). If the projects are planned by a state organization, the man power is sometimes very less (e.g. the planning of A6 widening between AK Weinsberg and the Baden-Württemberg/Bavarian border was executed by only one(!) person for a long time - a woman; in the meantime a little group of persons is working on it).

Back to topic:
Do you have any detailed information about the Sebes-Turda motorway? E.g. number of lanes, hard shoulder, number of junctions, plans of interchanges, length of sections, ecoducts, viaducts,...

Do you have a status list or map of all Romanian motorway/expressway projects, where the feasibility study is started or already finished? That means two steps more than Le Clerks' latest map.
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Old April 28th, 2013, 07:25 PM   #5804
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
Thanks a lot !
You're welcome.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
Back to topic:
Do you have any detailed information about the Sebes-Turda motorway? E.g. number of lanes, hard shoulder, number of junctions, plans of interchanges, length of sections, ecoducts, viaducts,...
Not much, I'm afraid. For the moment, the proposal made by the old feasibility study is for a 74,1 km long expressway (65,35 km in Alba County and 8,75 km in Cluj County) having the following characteristics:
- designed for driving speed of 120 km/h;
- cross section: 2x3,75 m lanes in each direction, 2x1,5 m soft shoulders (no hard shoulders), 3 m in the median;
- 121 culverts;
- 29 bridges and overpasses; the longest two are 656 m long, at km 8+200 (over river Mureș) and km 16+430;
- 7 grade separated interchanges;
- 2 tunnels (500 m and 580 m);
- 2 maintenance areas;
- 3 parking areas;
- oil separators and retention ponds;
- 6.825 m of noise barriers;
- fence on both sides of the road, on its entire length;
- no specific ecoducts, but it is written that part of the culverts and overpasses will allow domestic and wild animal crossing;

In conclusion, it is a complete motorway missing hard shoulders.

All these details are taken from here, which is the environmental permit issued in 2009 for the expressway.
Now, what I am sure about:
- the new feasibility will propose a motorway instead of an expressway;
- ecoducts will be proposed as well, since the chosen route is intersecting Nature 2000 biodiversity sites.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
Do you have a status list or map of all Romanian motorway/expressway projects, where the feasibility study is started or already finished? That means two steps more than Le Clerks' latest map.
The only list I'm aware of is here, on CNADNR website, but I do not know any easy way to search through it. I am sorry, the website is a mess.
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Old April 28th, 2013, 07:58 PM   #5805
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nenea_hartia View Post
In conclusion, it is a complete motorway missing hard shoulders.
Thanks .

Quote:
Originally Posted by nenea_hartia View Post
Now, what I am sure about:
- the new feasibility will propose a motorway instead of an expressway;
- ecoducts will be proposed as well, since the chosen route is intersecting Nature 2000 biodiversity sites.
Why are you sure about it?

Why does the new plan contain a 78km long road instead of 74.1km? What has changed?
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Old April 28th, 2013, 08:01 PM   #5806
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Originally Posted by Le Clerk View Post
Anyway, acc to Economica.net, CNADNR plans to open 119 km of new motorway on May 1. Can anyone confirm?

These should be the new segments:

Orastie-Sibiu LOT1: 24 km
Orastie-Sibiu LOT2: 19 km
Orastie-Sibiu LOT3: 22 km
Orastie-Sibiu LOT4: 17 km
Nadlac-Arad LOT2: 10 km
Lugoj-Deva LOT1: 27 km
No one confirmed. So it isn't true? Which sections can certainly be opened in 2013?
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Old April 28th, 2013, 08:44 PM   #5807
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Here you can find the schedule, based on the official news and announcements so far, for each opening section.
http://www.130km.ro/schedule.html

It is possible that the above mentioned openings on May 1st may be just partial openings, like it happened with other motorway sections in the last few years.
It is my opinion that, if the news is true, those sections may open on only one carriageway, with incomplete interchanges or other elements, but just good enough so people can drive on them.
For example a similar opening occurred on the A2, near Medgidia, where there also was a low speed limit, until both carriageways were complete and the overall motorway section was finished.
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Old April 28th, 2013, 09:08 PM   #5808
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
Why are you sure about it?
Oh, I have no arguments, it's just a feeling. It seems our last governments are in favour of building motorways instead of expressways on major routes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
Why does the new plan contain a 78km long road instead of 74.1km? What has changed?
I don't know, but honestly, I haven't seen an official document stating 78 kms.

Btw, the future interchange of Sebeş-Turda motorway/expressway and A1 motorway near Sebeş will be located around minute 1:11 of this video made by our colleague @eurocopter:



Interesting is, the land for this interchange (called Nod rutier Sebeş Nord – km 28+800 = Interchange Sebeş North – km 28+800) has already been expropriated (official link).

Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
No one confirmed. So it isn't true? Which sections can certainly be opened in 2013?
No, nothing will be opened so soon. However, the motorway between Simeria and Orăștie will be probably opened by the end of May or beginning of June. For this year - if everything goes smooth (read: financing secured) - we expect Lugoj-Deva Lot 1 (without the link road) and roughly Orăștie-Miercurea Sibiului. Anything else is very doubtful (Lot 4) to impossible (Lot 3), due to landslides which occurred on Lots 3 & 4 of Orăștie-Sibiu motorway and will force a change of technical solutions.
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Old April 28th, 2013, 09:37 PM   #5809
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roata View Post
Here you can find the schedule, based on the official news and announcements so far, for each opening section.
http://www.130km.ro/schedule.html
Cool . I'd like to have a simple well-arranged list like this of all motorway projects u/c in the world - maybe first step of all u/c motorway projects in Europe .

Does a global list like this already exist?
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Old April 28th, 2013, 10:35 PM   #5810
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No Chinese companies?

Quote:
EC demands Romania to have a “very cautious” approach in identifying private partners

BUSINESS | NINEOCLOCK | APRIL 28TH, 2013 AT 9:00 PM

Regarding the development of motorway projects under public-private partnership (PPP), Johannes Hahn, commissioner for Regional Policies and vice-president of the EC suggested during a meeting last week with Transport Minister Relu Fenechiu that Romania should have a very cautious approach of identifying private partners and the models of partnership, Mediafax reports. “Because the repayment period exceeds 10 years, in the Commission’s opinion the evaluations of the possibility to recover the investment have a low accuracy, especially for road infrastructure projects. It was recollected the situation of Portugal, as an example of the failure of this kind of projects,” the Ministry of Transport mentions in a press release. Authorities announced in the past that they plan starting several projects under PPP, which would allow attracting private funds to support investments.

The two officials also discussed Romania’s requests regarding the immediate and long-term needs in the development of road infrastructure, the absorption of structural funds and the cancellation of the pre-suspension of the Sectoral Operational Programe Transport (POS-T). Premier Victor Ponta said, at the end of January, that the Bucharest-Brasov and Pitesti-Craiova motorways, reactors 3 and 4 of the Cernavoda nuclear power plant, the Tarnita power plant, the Macin bridge and the Siret-Baragan Canal were included on the list of investment projects considered as priorities, which will be achieved through public-private partnership.
http://www.nineoclock.ro/ec-demands-...vate-partners/
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Old April 28th, 2013, 10:55 PM   #5811
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How actual is the site www.130km.ro???
I'll travel on next saturday to Romania via Budapest and Berehove in Ukraine. Where I can buy the Rovinieta?
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Old April 28th, 2013, 10:58 PM   #5812
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Originally Posted by Pascal20a View Post
How actual is the site www.130km.ro???
I'll travel on next saturday to Romania via Budapest and Berehove in Ukraine. Where I can buy the Rovinieta?
Are you sure that you will travel to RO & UA next week?
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Old April 28th, 2013, 10:58 PM   #5813
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Does anybody have a new video of the section Arad - Pecica?
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Old April 28th, 2013, 11:31 PM   #5814
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
No one confirmed. So it isn't true? Which sections can certainly be opened in 2013?
The report claims is backed by statements from the Road Company. But as some people mentioned here, some sections cannot be completed by then, so there will be half-profile openings.
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Old April 28th, 2013, 11:35 PM   #5815
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pascal20a View Post
Does anybody have a new video of the section Arad - Pecica?
Yes. Here it is. I think it's from today

Quote:
Originally Posted by marius_ar View Post
Dupa setul de poze de pe Arad Pecica mai jos aveti autostrada de la Pecica (pasaj cale ferata) la Arad filmata de pe bicicleta (imi cer scuze de pe acum pentru durerile de cap pricinuite de miscarile stanga-dreapta). Drumul a durat aproximativ 30 minute (filmul este la 2x).
Traseul urmat la intoarcere: http://goo.gl/maps/2PsHX

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Old April 29th, 2013, 08:45 AM   #5816
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Lot 3 cannot be opened in 2013, full-profile or half-profile regardless. It won't be probably opened even in 2014.
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Old April 29th, 2013, 02:45 PM   #5817
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
Cool . I'd like to have a simple well-arranged list like this of all motorway projects u/c in the world - maybe first step of all u/c motorway projects in Europe .

Does a global list like this already exist?
I work on the Dutch-language wegenwiki which may be the most extensive database around (virtually all motorways in the world have an article), but believe me, it's incredibly hard to keep something like that up to date.
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Old April 29th, 2013, 06:34 PM   #5818
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
Thanks a lot !

That kind of planning procedure is similar to the German one's. We have a special project management company (DEGES) which plans "urgent" projects like the VDE projects (traffic projects German reunification). If the projects are planned by a state organization, the man power is sometimes very less (e.g. the planning of A6 widening between AK Weinsberg and the Baden-Württemberg/Bavarian border was executed by only one(!) person for a long time - a woman; in the meantime a little group of persons is working on it).
I don't think our planning even compares to the german way . While fesability studies are done relatively fast, they have proven to be of poor quality; works underway on the Sibiu-Deva sections have had numerous problems with unstable hills and banks that should have been predicted. Orastie-Sibiu lot 3 in particular has a major problem due to a shifting hill right at the end of the Aciliu viaduct. The proposed solution is a new viaduct that will blow the budget and delay the project by almost 2 years. Other problems on a smaller scale determined contractors to build tunnels instead of deep gourges, due to the same problem.

So at the moment, we can't really trust the fesability studies, especially not in the Transylvanian countryside. There are deep concerns regarding Lugoj-Deva lot 2 and 3, where there are several very deep gourges proposed and the hills are prone to sliding. We will see next year, I guess.


Regarding the FS for Sebes-Turda and Pitesti-Craiova, the initial ones were for express roads that can be easilly upgraded to motorways using the same alignment. Even the land was expropiated for a full motorway. A fun fact is that Craiova-Pitesti is tendered both as a motorway and an expressway that will be later widened. The documentation for both variants are identical. It is up to the concessioner which one should be build, but even if an expressway is decided upon, it will have motorway-style turning radiuses, interchanges and bridges.
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Old April 30th, 2013, 08:38 AM   #5819
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Lot 3 cannot be opened in 2013, full-profile or half-profile regardless. It won't be probably opened even in 2014.
The problem is with the 6 km section just before Sibiu, which is affected by land slides. From what I understand, this is the only section that will be delayed. The rest of the sections (113 km) will be opened this year, in May or later on.
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Old April 30th, 2013, 09:09 AM   #5820
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Danube Bridge 2 (Vidin-Calafat) will open to traffic on 15.06.2013, Romanian PM says.
Source (in Romanian): http://adevarul.ro/locale/craiova/fo...025/index.html

Also, the tolls have been set as follows:
Cars - 2 euro
Trucks - 12 to 37 euro depending on weight
Minivans from 9 to 23 seats - 12 euro
Buses - 25 euro
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