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Old August 17th, 2013, 12:06 PM   #6281
MichiH
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Are there any plans to build a direct motorway connection from Romania to Bulgaria? For instance a motorway form Bucharest to Russe? An expressway is planned on Bulgarian side which would connect Bucharest to Turkey and also to the future A2 towards Sofia.

Is the DN5 already in a sufficient condition thus no need for a motorway?
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Old August 17th, 2013, 12:38 PM   #6282
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Eventually, I would like to see a relatively straight line motorway connection between Bucharest and Sofia, perhaps with a bridge connecting Turnu Magurele with Nikopol (or somewhat to the west), to replace the ferry crossing there. However, there are higher priorities for both countries.
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Old August 17th, 2013, 12:44 PM   #6283
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Originally Posted by mcarling View Post
Eventually, I would like to see a relatively straight line motorway connection between Bucharest and Sofia, perhaps with a bridge connecting Turnu Magurele with Nikopol, to replace the ferry crossing there. However, there are higher priorities for both countries.
I think it is not necessary to build a direct connection Bucharest - Sofia. The Russe route is not much longer but it also connects Romania with Turkey.

A connection of the two capitals is not so important. National city/region connections are more relevant, but also routes for international traffic.
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Old August 17th, 2013, 02:32 PM   #6284
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
Are there any plans to build a direct motorway connection from Romania to Bulgaria? For instance a motorway form Bucharest to Russe? An expressway is planned on Bulgarian side which would connect Bucharest to Turkey and also to the future A2 towards Sofia.

Is the DN5 already in a sufficient condition thus no need for a motorway?
For the moment DN5 is ok, it's 2+2 between Bucharest and Giurgiu. But in 10-15 years probably we will need a motorway there, if the suburban traffic will increase as well.
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Old August 17th, 2013, 02:52 PM   #6285
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
I think it is not necessary to build a direct connection Bucharest - Sofia. The Russe route is not much longer but it also connects Romania with Turkey.
Bucharest and Sofia are 295 kilometers apart. A realistic direct motorway connection could be 330-340 kilometers. The route via Russe is 384 kilometers. Cutting about 50 kilometers off the route would represent a huge benefit in reduced costs, time saved, and reduced pollution.

However, the route via Russe should have higher priority because, as you mentioned, it is important for traffic between Bucharest and Turkey. When the Russe route starts to become congested, a direct Bucharest - Sofia motorway would have the benefits I described and also relieve traffic from the Russe route.

In the meantime, beginning construction of a 2x2 bridge over the Danube in the vicinity of Turnu Magurele and Nikopol might make sense if and when the EU are willing to fund it.
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Old August 17th, 2013, 03:00 PM   #6286
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Some have suggested the current bridge in Ruse is in poor condition and may need replacement anyway. It makes sense to replace it with a 4-lane motorway/rail bridge. The current bridge is almost 60 years old.
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Old August 17th, 2013, 03:06 PM   #6287
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Originally Posted by mcarling View Post
Bucharest and Sofia are 295 kilometers apart. A realistic direct motorway connection could be 330-340 kilometers. The route via Russe is 384 kilometers. Cutting about 50 kilometers off the route would represent a huge benefit in reduced costs, time saved, and reduced pollution.
I don't know much about the relationship Romanian/Bulgaria, but I guess there is only less traffic b/n their capitals. I guess the international routes are more important.
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Old August 17th, 2013, 06:23 PM   #6288
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Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Some have suggested the current bridge in Ruse is in poor condition and may need replacement anyway. It makes sense to replace it with a 4-lane motorway/rail bridge. The current bridge is almost 60 years old.
There is talk that this a new bridge will be built there. Romania seems to be especially interested.
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Old August 17th, 2013, 06:38 PM   #6289
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Come on, guys! The EU is not a monolith of unitary motives. There are many actors in the EU and they don't all have the same motives. Was developing connections between Romania and Bulgaria an important factor in leading the EU to fund construction of bridges across the Danube? Yes, absolutely. Was developing customs-free routes to Turkey an important factor in leading the EU to fund construction of bridges across the Danube? Yes, absolutely. There is no contradiction here.
I agree the bridge was built to encourage regional connections, with Turkey included. What I do not agree is that the whole logic and infrastructure of the bridge should be predicated on shooting at CX. Or that we need somehow race Serbia into completing first CIV south before they complete CX.It was not the case and it is not.
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Old August 17th, 2013, 11:29 PM   #6290
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Corridor CIV and CX indeed complement each other. We'll see over the next years how the road constructions develop. This summer I drove the new highway between Recas and Arad.
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Old August 19th, 2013, 08:39 PM   #6291
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I agree the bridge was built to encourage regional connections, with Turkey included. What I do not agree is that the whole logic and infrastructure of the bridge should be predicated on shooting at CX. Or that we need somehow race Serbia into completing first CIV south before they complete CX.It was not the case and it is not.
I think we are debating too much the sense of the Vidin/ Calafat bridge.
However is very simple. The bridge was built to improve the corridor IV south branch and there you go!
The same, Lugoj- Caransebes- Tr Severin- bridge being part of the Corridor IV has to be updated. With a new motorway co-financed by EU.

I don't know if it will be postponed (up to 2025 as you predicted) or not but if you are saying that the improving of the European corridors crossing Romania is not within EU/ Romanian priorities..

As for Craiova, is very possible to be connected in the future with the motorways network either C IV southern branch, either C IV northern through Pitesti. Or better both. But this doesn't change the fact that Craiova is not a part of corridor IV or any other European corridor and also that's it.

back to the bridge.. at the end, I dont care if the bulgarians/greeks/turks etc are willing to discover Romania following Craiova- Pitesti- Sibiu or just to cross quickly towards west as an alternative of CX.

Checking the map, the location of the bridge (considering also the planning of Hemus motorway) was not towards Craiova but towards west. But our fellows from Bulgaria can tell better what was the aim of bridge and why was positioned in Vidin and not in Nikopol, Oryahovo, Lom or Gigen.
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Old August 19th, 2013, 09:10 PM   #6292
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what was the aim of bridge and why was positioned in Vidin and not in Nikopol, Oryahovo, Lom or Gigen.
Vidin lies along one of the routes between Belgrade and Bucharest.
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Old August 19th, 2013, 09:22 PM   #6293
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I think we are debating too much the sense of the Vidin/ Calafat bridge.
However is very simple. The bridge was built to improve the corridor IV south branch and there you go!
The same, Lugoj- Caransebes- Tr Severin- bridge being part of the Corridor IV has to be updated. With a new motorway co-financed by EU.

I don't know if it will be postponed (up to 2025 as you predicted) or not but if you are saying that the improving of the European corridors crossing Romania is not within EU/ Romanian priorities..
.
Where did you get that?!

I said that CIV south will lose importance as a result of Craiova-Pitesti motorway which is close to having a contract now. And that CIX will become more important therefore, which is, BTW, also a pan-European corridor.

BTW: CIV south does not have a FS, whereas CIX does have a FS. Nor is there a tender for a CIV south FS in sight for now.

PS: Bacau by-pass, part of CIX (un-formally speaking) was just awarded Gov funds for expropriations - so there you go.
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Old August 19th, 2013, 11:54 PM   #6294
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Well roads through Romania and Bulgaria are also important for the CEE countries as Poland, Slovakia, Ukraine etc. I don't think it shuld be counted as a competition for the Serbia. It's alternative road and in some cases it may be main road to the Balkans.
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Old August 20th, 2013, 12:28 AM   #6295
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Where did you get that?!

I said that CIV south will lose importance as a result of Craiova-Pitesti motorway which is close to having a contract now. And that CIX will become more important therefore, which is, BTW, also a pan-European corridor.

BTW: CIV south does not have a FS, whereas CIX does have a FS. Nor is there a tender for a CIV south FS in sight for now.

PS: Bacau by-pass, part of CIX (un-formally speaking) was just awarded Gov funds for expropriations - so there you go.
Frankly, I don't get it how come a pan european corridor may be overshadowed by a regional motorway, even more, serving a different direction..

To clarify, CIV south runs between Dresden- Prague- Bratislava- Vienna- Budapest- Arad- Timisoara- Vidin - Sofia - Thessaloniki/ or Plovdiv- Istanbul, linking central europe and the balkans (Bulgaria, Greece, Turkey).

In this picture I don't see any Craiova- Pitesti. At least on my map, Craiova- Pitesti lies 120-250 km east of this corridor, so actually who wants to travell from Bulgaria, Greece or Turkey to central europe, so to west, doesn't have to deal with Craiova- Pitesti at all. Even from Istanbul you (almost) have full motorway to Sofia so it doesn't have any sense to go through Giurgiu or Constanta.

Ok, Craiova- Pitesti should have a big impact on national level, but is no competition for CIV south, which is a total different direction.

Also I don't get it how CIX could compete CIV. CIX is connecting south europe to north- east, so it is a different story. You say that CIX will become more important than CIV south. Well, is just your prediction. For the moment we have a bridge vs some FS. We have a completed motorway on the bulgarian side and other u/c (to Greece, Turkey). On the corridor IX do you know any concrete planns to link Bulgaria north south by motorway (Ruse- Veliko Trnovo- Stara Zagora) towards Greece? I'm afraid bulgarians paid attention to the corridor IV southern branch not to the IXth. Also further to Chisinau, Kiyv is also nothing. We are talking about pan-european corridors so a short belt motorway would not help too much.
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Old August 20th, 2013, 07:58 AM   #6296
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Frankly, I don't get it how come a pan european corridor may be overshadowed by a regional motorway, even more, serving a different direction..
CIX is a "regional motorway"!?!?

Latelly that regional motorway has more freight/small car traffic than CIV in Romania, as a result of Russian, Ukrainian/Moldovan trucks, and also tourism transition through Romania.

Quote:
In this picture I don't see any Craiova- Pitesti. At least on my map, Craiova- Pitesti lies 120-250 km east of this corridor, so actually who wants to travell from Bulgaria, Greece or Turkey to central europe, so to west, doesn't have to deal with Craiova- Pitesti at all. Even from Istanbul you (almost) have full motorway to Sofia so it doesn't have any sense to go through Giurgiu or Constanta.
We discussed a solution or two which will be implemented, Again, pan-EU corridors should also serve local traffic, and you'll not convince me otherwise. It has happened so far on CIV north, it will hapen on CIV south, when it will be built.

Besides, if the EU went as absurdly on your "principle" that corridors should serve only international traffic, the current CIV north would have never been built, but only CIV south. We all know what happened and what the EU financed in the past 7 year and willl continue to finance by 2020: CIV north, mainly.

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Ok, Craiova- Pitesti should have a big impact on national level, but is no competition for CIV south, which is a total different direction.
Yes, it is. Look how much freight traffic is currently on current CIV north, without a motorway. That is freight traffic coming from Asia/Turkey/Balkans and going into WE, or viceversa. When a motorway will be completed, a lot more freight traffic will be moving on CIV north.

Quote:
Also I don't get it how CIX could compete CIV. CIX is connecting south europe to north- east, so it is a different story. You say that CIX will become more important than CIV south. Well, is just your prediction.
They don't compete.

I just said that it is CIV north which does compete with CIV south, and that is obvious, because they run in similar directions, they are basically parallel motorways, and that construction of Craiova-Pitesti will make that become more obvious, with traffic moving through CIV north.

Quote:
For the moment we have a bridge vs some FS.
Yes, but without a FS you cannot build a motorway, right?!

FS takes at least one year to make, and they are not even tendering it for CIV south.

And besides, CIX construction will begin soon with Bacau by-pass, which means we'll see a motorway running from Bacau to Ploiesti (Dumbrava -on A3) by 2020 or earlier.

Quote:
We have a completed motorway on the bulgarian side and other u/c (to Greece, Turkey).
There is no complete motorway on the Bulgarian side to Vidin, and it will take some time until will be built. If the EU will want that badly to build that corridor, both in Romania and Bulgaria, we'll know from Romania's motorway strategy as approved by the EU. AFAIK, it is not yet available.

Quote:
On the corridor IX do you know any concrete planns to link Bulgaria north south by motorway (Ruse- Veliko Trnovo- Stara Zagora) towards Greece? I'm afraid bulgarians paid attention to the corridor IV southern branch not to the IXth. Also further to Chisinau, Kiyv is also nothing. We are talking about pan-european corridors so a short belt motorway would not help too much.
Again, CIX is not a short belt! The traffic on DN2 is one of a motorway currently, this being caused by the international traffic coming or going into Moldova, Ukraine and Russia. A lot of this is coming from the Constanta Port - I just came from there and there are incredible columns of trucks on A2 from Russia and Ukraine. These all go or come from the port. CIX in Romania closes in the port of Constanta, that's the terminus point of that corridor until more motorways will be built regionaly. As much as CIV also has a terminus point in Constanta port.
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Old August 20th, 2013, 08:11 AM   #6297
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Well roads through Romania and Bulgaria are also important for the CEE countries as Poland, Slovakia, Ukraine etc. I don't think it shuld be counted as a competition for the Serbia. It's alternative road and in some cases it may be main road to the Balkans.
Hello wilczur !

Yes, indeed, they are alternatives, but some people see it as competing motorways, which should remove as much traffic from the other corridor (CX here that goes through Serbia), and therefore this motorway through Romania should be built on a straight line if that's possible to assure the Turkish and other trucks that they are going the shortest way through Romania and not through Serbia. Crazy!
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Old August 20th, 2013, 01:11 PM   #6298
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A new alpine road completed in Romania: Transbucegi. This is the 3rd alpine road in Romania after Transfagarasan and Transalpina.



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Old August 20th, 2013, 02:13 PM   #6299
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Where is Transbucegi?
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Old August 20th, 2013, 04:51 PM   #6300
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Here
I have shown you also how to get there from Sinaia railway station.
Transbucegi is the last bit, after the curves on national road 71.
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