Back from vacation in Greece

[Josh]

Ya sou people!

I just got back from a fortnight in Greece and I had a really good time. The weather was a bit too hot for my liking, especially since I visited a lot of ancient sites and it was too much during the day, but I was told that the temperatures of the past few weeks were too much even for the Greeks. I also saw a few forest fires near Corinth and also near Delphi so I hope everything will be OK again soon.

I stayed in Ξυλόκαστρο a town in the north of the Peloponessos in the prefecture of Corinthia. There weren't many foreign tourists there but it seemed to be a popular destination for Greek tourists, especially from the Athens region. During weekends it was really crowded and cars were parked everywhere. The hotel I stayed in was Sikyon Beach, right next to the Pefkias (I've been told it's a unique pine tree forest in Greece). The beach there is really nice as well and the water is so crystal clear and offered a welcome refreshment from the sun. Anyway, I will post a few pix later if you're interested of course. The pix are mainly from the ancient sites (Olympia, Delphi, Korinthos, Mycenae, Epidauros), a few from Athens (mainly Acropolis), Mystras (a Byzantine city), Nafplio and miscellaneous.

I have a few observations though.

-It seems like Greece is still very religious, judging from the number of priests and nuns I've seen. Also, on the bus to AThens I noticed lots of (older) people making a cross whenever we passed a church, chapel or cemetary.
-Greek drivers are not courteous at all; they would rather run over pedestrians than let them cross the streets, the same with cyclists. There's also a lot of flickering with the car lights and blowing the car horn going on, especially if they want to pass you or if you don't drive fast enough.
-The highway from Athens to Patra is for the most part a 2x1 lane so people would use the emergency lane as a 2nd lane, even the police did this! Some drivers would even pass you will crossing the opposite lane despite the continuous white line. I've never seen this in any other country so is it somewhat legally accepted since the police did it as well?
-How come there's so little people speaking English? In Ξυλόκαστρο there were very few people speaking or understanding English and the ones that did were rather poor at it. Even younger people (teenagers and older) often didn't speak any English at all. I thought it would be better in Athens but when I asked for directions to the bus station it took me quite some time before I found someone who could help me out (a very friendly girl BTW who even called someone on her mobile phone to help us out ).
-I never heard of some of these cold (coffee) drinks served in bars like Frape or fredoccino and stuff. They were delicious though and very refreshing on hot days. Are they typically Greek and can you get them in other countries as well?
-When I went to Delphi I wanted to take the ferry but I arrived too early and had to wait too long so I decided to take the Rio-Antirion Bridge to the other side. It was 10,90€ and I had to pay it again when I came back. Isn't that a bit too expensive?
-I liked the food a lot, especially the salads and the gyros, but you have to eat really fast in restaurants cause if you take an appetizer, they will bring your main course like 5 minutes later when you haven't even finished your appetizer lol. In the end the whole table is full of plates but I learned that you actually have to call the waiter and ask him to clean up otherwise they won't do it. I also noticed that the Greeks do call the waiter a lot so I suppose they give big tips as well?
-In Athens I also visited the site of the 2004 Olympics but I was rather disappointed cause it was so dead and not very well maintained. Weeds grew everywhere, buildings started to get really dirty and overall it left a bit of an abandonned impression. Are there plans to do something with the site in the near future?

Anyway, nice country, interesting culture, (a bit too) hot weather....I'm definitely going back one day, probably more to the north, the area around Thessaloniki.

[mitasis]

I think you are right at most of the points you have noticed!

You are soon welcome to our region also

[GrigorisSokratis]

Originally Posted by Josh

Ya sou people!

I just got back from a fortnight in Greece and I had a really good time. The weather was a bit too hot for my liking, especially since I visited a lot of ancient sites and it was too much during the day, but I was told that the temperatures of the past few weeks were too much even for the Greeks. I also saw a few forest fires near Corinth and also near Delphi so I hope everything will be OK again soon.

I stayed in Ξυλόκαστρο a town in the north of the Peloponessos in the prefecture of Corinthia. There weren't many foreign tourists there but it seemed to be a popular destination for Greek tourists, especially from the Athens region. During weekends it was really crowded and cars were parked everywhere. The hotel I stayed in was Sikyon Beach, right next to the Pefkias (I've been told it's a unique pine tree forest in Greece). The beach there is really nice as well and the water is so crystal clear and offered a welcome refreshment from the sun. Anyway, I will post a few pix later if you're interested of course. The pix are mainly from the ancient sites (Olympia, Delphi, Korinthos, Mycenae, Epidauros), a few from Athens (mainly Acropolis), Mystras (a Byzantine city), Nafplio and miscellaneous.

I have a few observations though.

-It seems like Greece is still very religious, judging from the number of priests and nuns I've seen. Also, on the bus to AThens I noticed lots of (older) people making a cross whenever we passed a church, chapel or cemetary.
-Greek drivers are not courteous at all; they would rather run over pedestrians than let them cross the streets, the same with cyclists. There's also a lot of flickering with the car lights and blowing the car horn going on, especially if they want to pass you or if you don't drive fast enough.
-The highway from Athens to Patra is for the most part a 2x1 lane so people would use the emergency lane as a 2nd lane, even the police did this! Some drivers would even pass you will crossing the opposite lane despite the continuous white line. I've never seen this in any other country so is it somewhat legally accepted since the police did it as well?
-How come there's so little people speaking English? In Ξυλόκαστρο there were very few people speaking or understanding English and the ones that did were rather poor at it. Even younger people (teenagers and older) often didn't speak any English at all. I thought it would be better in Athens but when I asked for directions to the bus station it took me quite some time before I found someone who could help me out (a very friendly girl BTW who even called someone on her mobile phone to help us out ).
-I never heard of some of these cold (coffee) drinks served in bars like Frape or fredoccino and stuff. They were delicious though and very refreshing on hot days. Are they typically Greek and can you get them in other countries as well?
-When I went to Delphi I wanted to take the ferry but I arrived too early and had to wait too long so I decided to take the Rio-Antirion Bridge to the other side. It was 10,90€ and I had to pay it again when I came back. Isn't that a bit too expensive?
-I liked the food a lot, especially the salads and the gyros, but you have to eat really fast in restaurants cause if you take an appetizer, they will bring your main course like 5 minutes later when you haven't even finished your appetizer lol. In the end the whole table is full of plates but I learned that you actually have to call the waiter and ask him to clean up otherwise they won't do it. I also noticed that the Greeks do call the waiter a lot so I suppose they give big tips as well?
-In Athens I also visited the site of the 2004 Olympics but I was rather disappointed cause it was so dead and not very well maintained. Weeds grew everywhere, buildings started to get really dirty and overall it left a bit of an abandonned impression. Are there plans to do something with the site in the near future?

Anyway, nice country, interesting culture, (a bit too) hot weather....I'm definitely going back one day, probably more to the north, the area around Thessaloniki.

-Well you know over 90% of the population is Christian Orthodox but you will mostly see older people making the cross as the younger use to be less religious regarding this point (nevertheless you will find quite many still making the cross, including people who declare to be not religious at all )

-I quite agree with that, especially when we are talking about drivers in Athens, but things are changing to the better, as new strict norms (including the application of the second highest transit fines of Europe after France) are being sanctioned regarding this subject (btw, we had a car accidents reduction in 2006 and a further one is expected this year).

-This point is being solved as a new highway is going to be constructed (works are due to begin in December) The North Peloponnesus highway length will be of 365 kms crossing from East to West almost exclusively the mentioned region (except of 63kms to be constructed here in Attika from Eleusina to Korinthos). The works will take 3.5 years to complete the whole highway. And here we go with the technical specs of the works to be done:

*The completion of current existing and underway parts with a length of 81.7kms
*120 kms from Korinth to Patra with 3 lanes per direction and a central barrier along the whole way and 26.5m wide.
*6kms from the entrance of Patra to Rio with 4lanes per direction and 33.15m wide
*163.7 kms from Patra to Tsakona with 2 lanes per direction plus an emergency one and a central barrier going along.

-Regarding your complain about the language we are not that bad on that point compared to other countries like France or Italy. I'd say that here we don't have as many English speakers as they got in say, the Netherlands, but we are far better than the above two nations, not to mention many other where I've been in and never ran across a single English speaker.

-How unfortunate that the coffee is one of the few things that impressed you postitively, I'd prefer having you say that the coffee here is terrible and all the above gave you a positive impression, but what the heck. We are finding solutions for the above items and hopefully we'll have to give our famous frape in exchange to maintain a cosmic balance , I think that would be a good deal as I'm not a coffee lover.

-I quite agree it's far too expensive and should be lowered, nonetheless I understand those rates are paying off the works burden.

-Our food is of worldwide renown, and the flavors are really better than in other countries just because our land produces food of natural cultive as here the soil has a higher yield than other countries, accordingly not being in need of artificial methods. As for the restaurants, hmphhh.... that sounds like Monastiraki or some parts of Plaka, forget it that's not Greece. I've travelled all around the globe and can assure you that I've never felt as comfortable and relaxed in restaurants as here in Greece, but you should try with real places (and this applies to every country) where the locals use to frequent. Btw, I'm really tired of Gyros, our cuisine is really varied with hundreds of dishes to make a choice of and none of them is related with Gyros, the later being just one of those hundreds of choices.

-Yes there are plans for the whole area, including a new shopping mall to be opened. So just come back in 2 years and you will get the difference

As for the hot weather just blame our government hehehe nahhh just kidding, unfortunately this is something the whole world is being affected by, hopefully the humans will become totally aware of global warming and be able to revert this problem.....I guess.

You're welcome to Greece and I hope you enjoy your stay each time you visit us.

[Josh]

Oh I assure you that the frape is not the only thing that impressed me. The highway to Patra didn't even bother me, I was just a bit surprised at first that everyone was using the emergency lane (even the police) but afterwards I thought it was quite inventive and there were no traffic jams or big trucks holding us up. The already completed parts of highway around athens and the highway to Tripoli were actually of very good quality and looked very clean! Driving on them was very pleasant. I'm looking forward to the completion of the north Peloponessos higway; it's gonna be nice to have the Rio-Antirion Bridge connect to a nice new highway cause it's really a nice bridge and a fast connection to the other side.
About the knowledge of English, it didn't really bother me cause most people tried to help us out even if they spoke little or no English at all. And I also feel that tourists should do an effort to speak some of the local language. But I must admit that I was rather bad at it despite having bought a language guide and having studied ancient Greek for 1 year. It's not entirely the same but to my shame I must admit that I had forgotten most of the Greek alphabet :o. Luckily it came back real quick.
The restaurants had indeed a very relaxed atmosphere around them. It's just that I'm not used to the appetizers and main courses following so quickly one after another. I agree that Greek cuisine is more than gyros and I did try other plates as well but it's just that the gyros I had in Greece was different than the ones I had here in Greek restaurants. I also enjoyed the souvlakia, arni me votana, mprizoles, mousakas,... yeah the food is really delicious in Greece.
I'm glad to hear there're plans for the olympic site in Athens. It's really a nice place to develop.

The only thing I regret is not having visited Monemvasia but I guess that's also something to do next time.

[Sodnal]

The bridge fare is expensive, but you're paying for rapid, convenient crossing. Don't forget the Bridge is owned by a private consortium and they need to pay back their bank loans that were secured for building the bridge.

As usage of the bridge increases the fares will probably go down. The Ferries provide fare competition for the bridge so the prices don't go higher. Free enterprise in action!

[Prometheus]

AFAIK German and French (???) are the most popular foreign languages for students taking language classes.

[Reaper-strain]

Greeks speak better and more english than Spanish, Italians, Turks and French. Most Greek TV, Films, music is in English. I have no idea who you spoke to. Maybe just by fluke you met people who did not speak english. When I was a kid in Orchomenos in the middle of no-where, nearly the whole town could communicate in English to give an example.

As for the religion, we are christians, as for being religious, again, look at Italy they are far more religious than us, they still self flagellate in certain villages. Plus we have more sex outside marriage than Italy and Turky put together.

As for the driving I agree 100%. You are bullied if you drive slow. I am no slow driver, the opposite. But when I driving new roads in Greece with a cliff one side and forrest on another, i do tend to keep it under 40 mph and do get bullied in a way.

[Ares_K]

Although a lot of Greeks speak English quite well, you will not find a lot of them among bus/taxi drivers etc. These jobs do not attract exactly what i would call well educated people, although, if you get lucky you may find a taxi driver who is doing that as a second job to increase his income and may be very well educated.

Which is a problem since a lot of those working in public transportation come into contact with tourists.

Greeks generally will walk the extra mile to help you, so you should never hesitate to ask for directions/help by anyone you may find in front of you. He/she will not be annoyed. Quite the opposite. A small tip most tourists ignore and often suprises them.

[Reaperos]

In regards to the amount of people in Greece who speak English I have found that the Greeks speak the most English amongst the Mediterranean people. However i believe this is as a result of Greece's attempt to reach the levels of well established countries such as Spain, Italy, France and so on in Europe. I think the Brits shouldn't expect English to be spoken unconditionally...."In Rome, do as the Romans do"

Having met many Greeks I must say that the Greeks are the most superstitious in the mediterranean, i believe as a result of their classical roots in religion. Their cultural integration of superstitions can de dated as far back as the ancient times of Hesiod, who wrote 'The Works and Days' which consists of all the 'do's' and 'don'ts' of their time.....An example is the rules of Mount Athos.....In the autonomous region of Mount Athos, the land of Orthodox monasteries and one of the most picturesque areas of Greece, on the most easterly of the three "fingers" of the Chalcidice peninsula, 'no women or unbearded boys' are allowed to step foot on in this area.

And having met many Greeks and Italians i can honestly say that they are equally as traditional but certainly not superstitious like the Greeks. not quite ''stessa facia stessa racia''

[KONSTANTINOUPOLIS]

Reaperos γιατί χρησιμοποιείς 2 λογαριασμούς ;

[Reaper-strain]

This Reaperos is no longer me, it is my ex girlfriend, she owns that account now, I am Reaper Strain, the original Reaperos who always posted here and formerly before that, the famous Reaper. The Spanish/ Greek member with a love a Greece greater than anything.

[Giorgio]

Originally Posted by Reaper-strain

This Reaperos is no longer me, it is my ex girlfriend, she owns that account now

How could you let her take it! I hope you kept the car!

[KONSTANTINOUPOLIS]

Originally Posted by Reaper-strain

This Reaperos is no longer me, it is my ex girlfriend, she owns that account now, I am Reaper Strain, the original Reaperos who always posted here and formerly before that, the famous Reaper. The Spanish/ Greek member with a love a Greece greater than anything.

I check her messages and her IP and propably you are right.

[krainer]

Originally Posted by Josh

Ya sou people!

I just got back from a fortnight in Greece and I had a really good time. The weather was a bit too hot for my liking, especially since I visited a lot of ancient sites and it was too much during the day, but I was told that the temperatures of the past few weeks were too much even for the Greeks. I also saw a few forest fires near Corinth and also near Delphi so I hope everything will be OK again soon.

I stayed in Ξυλόκαστρο a town in the north of the Peloponessos in the prefecture of Corinthia. There weren't many foreign tourists there but it seemed to be a popular destination for Greek tourists, especially from the Athens region. During weekends it was really crowded and cars were parked everywhere. The hotel I stayed in was Sikyon Beach, right next to the Pefkias (I've been told it's a unique pine tree forest in Greece). The beach there is really nice as well and the water is so crystal clear and offered a welcome refreshment from the sun. Anyway, I will post a few pix later if you're interested of course. The pix are mainly from the ancient sites (Olympia, Delphi, Korinthos, Mycenae, Epidauros), a few from Athens (mainly Acropolis), Mystras (a Byzantine city), Nafplio and miscellaneous.

I have a few observations though.

-It seems like Greece is still very religious, judging from the number of priests and nuns I've seen. Also, on the bus to AThens I noticed lots of (older) people making a cross whenever we passed a church, chapel or cemetary.
-Greek drivers are not courteous at all; they would rather run over pedestrians than let them cross the streets, the same with cyclists. There's also a lot of flickering with the car lights and blowing the car horn going on, especially if they want to pass you or if you don't drive fast enough.
-The highway from Athens to Patra is for the most part a 2x1 lane so people would use the emergency lane as a 2nd lane, even the police did this! Some drivers would even pass you will crossing the opposite lane despite the continuous white line. I've never seen this in any other country so is it somewhat legally accepted since the police did it as well?
-How come there's so little people speaking English? In Ξυλόκαστρο there were very few people speaking or understanding English and the ones that did were rather poor at it. Even younger people (teenagers and older) often didn't speak any English at all. I thought it would be better in Athens but when I asked for directions to the bus station it took me quite some time before I found someone who could help me out (a very friendly girl BTW who even called someone on her mobile phone to help us out ).
-I never heard of some of these cold (coffee) drinks served in bars like Frape or fredoccino and stuff. They were delicious though and very refreshing on hot days. Are they typically Greek and can you get them in other countries as well?
-When I went to Delphi I wanted to take the ferry but I arrived too early and had to wait too long so I decided to take the Rio-Antirion Bridge to the other side. It was 10,90€ and I had to pay it again when I came back. Isn't that a bit too expensive?
-I liked the food a lot, especially the salads and the gyros, but you have to eat really fast in restaurants cause if you take an appetizer, they will bring your main course like 5 minutes later when you haven't even finished your appetizer lol. In the end the whole table is full of plates but I learned that you actually have to call the waiter and ask him to clean up otherwise they won't do it. I also noticed that the Greeks do call the waiter a lot so I suppose they give big tips as well?
-In Athens I also visited the site of the 2004 Olympics but I was rather disappointed cause it was so dead and not very well maintained. Weeds grew everywhere, buildings started to get really dirty and overall it left a bit of an abandonned impression. Are there plans to do something with the site in the near future?

Anyway, nice country, interesting culture, (a bit too) hot weather....I'm definitely going back one day, probably more to the north, the area around Thessaloniki.

I'm glad you enjoyed your stay in Greece Josh.
I have to agree with most of you remarks about Greece though. A lot of Greeks are very religious and superstitious. Greek drivers are rude and won't let pedestrians cross the road. They generally refuse to obey any laws while driving plus most of our highways and streets need desperately some serious upgrading.
About the Greek restaurants well I guess it's not some Greek habit bringing main course right after the appetizers, I guess it was a coincidence. Some restaurants have very fast service while others can be irritatingly overdue. It's plain luck.
A lot of the Olympic sites are totally abandoned and are a disgrace to the country, cause the government won't bother. Like it won't for so many other things as you can tell by a single visit to the country.
One of the things that I don't agree with is that people here don't speak English. I honestly think that most people here can hold a conversation in English easier than many other Europeans. Not as good as Dutch people or Swedish people but pretty good compared to an average European. I believe that you just had some bad luck about this.
P.S. I'd love to see some pics of your visit in Greece

[Josh]

Here's a first set of pics, more will follow later cause uploading takes a lot of time.

Sikyon Beach Hotel in Sykia near Xylokastro


Back side


The road to our bungalow


Our rental car


The beach in Sykia


And the other way to Xylokastro


Some schoolkids dancing in the theatre next to the port of Xylokastro


The Moni Mega Spilaio which is believed to be the oldest monastery in Greece. There's a lot of new constructions so not much remains of the original monastery.


A view from the monastery


The entrance of the monastery


View over ancient Korinth with the temple of Apollo and in the back the Akrokorinth


View on the stoa


The fountain of Peirene


And again the impressive Akrokorinth seen from the highway




On to ancient Mycene which is built on a hill


And surrounded by beautiful landscapes...


Grave of Clytaemnestra


The famous "Lion's Gate"


View on a grave cercle inside the walls


More to follow...

[AEK]

Really nice photos!

[krainer]

Thanks for posting the photos, they are very nice

[Raleigh-NC]

Thanks for sharing your beautiful photos, Josh

[pilotos]

I see you really had a nice time here.As for your observations, i must admit that you are almost right on everything.
As for the English speaking people in Greece, i just came back from my vacations, and i noticed that indeed most of the people don't really speak English, they are always offered to help a foreigner though, but even those that are speaking the language have some difficulties if they speak directly to a native English speaker, overall though i can say that you can always find someone who speaks English fluently and can really help you.

[milan78]

I myself have been to Chalkidiki, Pefkohori just last week and I met heaps of Greeks that speak English. Took local buses to Thessalonici and all three bus drivers knew how to tell me what the number of the next bus to Thessalonici centre is.Thessalonici just blew me away- The Gallerius Arch and his palace, the museums,the statue of Alexander O Megas,the old city up on the hill- so much history in one city.Magnificient!