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Old August 25th, 2009, 07:25 PM   #81
onetwothree
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Great maps, Schliemann, and I can only agree that we need to build more Metro in Copenhagen (fast, not some time in the 2040's ), but I think it's a problem if the dark blue line (M5? One can dream ) only has that single non-transfer station just inside the lakes (inden for søerne) and then Østerport... I would say it needs to be connected to one of the other stations, but I admit I don't see exactly where... I was toying around with the same map myself yesterday and tried to come up with something, but Photoshop crashed and I didn't save, so I don't have anything (and I'm too lazy to redo it right now )

And no matter how awesome a Metro through Hvidovre would be (I live here ) it's just nowhere near dense enough (yet?). I agree we need something out to Avedøre Holme, but it's just too far away for a Metro imo.

Oh and yes please to a station at Sluseholmen, would be awesome to have a connection between there and Ørestad without having to go through the inner city
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Old August 25th, 2009, 10:54 PM   #82
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Onetwothree, I'm a bit confused: why would you want the dark blue line to connect with M1/M2 in the centre of town? I'm asking because I don't imagine that a lot of people would travel from, say, Bronshoj to the outer Frederiksberg or Vanloese via metro. If they travel to the inner city then they are well served by the change at Osterbro. And, if they travel to Amager (which represents, let's not forget, most of the stations on M1/M2) then they can continue to Christianshavns Torv and change there. I admit as a first thought it sounds appealing that a new line through the city centre SHOULD cut the two existing lines there, but I'm not sure that thought is borne out by actual travel patterns.
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Old August 26th, 2009, 03:03 AM   #83
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The nerd in me got loose.

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Old August 26th, 2009, 11:56 AM   #84
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This is awesome!
btw. what program have u used?
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Old August 26th, 2009, 03:04 PM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schliemann View Post
The nerd in me got loose.
Hum... ten points for a vivid imagination, Schliemann, but two questions. First, why do you foresee a prolongation of M5/M6 to Herlev? All the public discussions I have read to date have focused on a line to Husum Torv from which it MIGHT be prolonged west-around Utterslev Mose to Gladsaxe. Does your drawing reflect your personal preferences, or do you know something I do not?

Secondly, how much of this major metro network you are sketching do you imagine would be underground? I ask because as far as I can see big chunks of what you now suggest are in areas that are not much more populated than eastern Amager. - But, there as well, I could be mistaken.
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Old August 26th, 2009, 04:18 PM   #86
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When I see Schliemann´s fantasy map I think of it more as a realistic tram map than a underground metro map.
Are you aware that when the first metro line was contructed, the 2 running tunnels north of Nørreport were built on different levels in order to facilitate a junction branching off to the right towards Fælledvej, Rigshospital, the University Park and Vibenhus Rundel?

This would have made great sense as regards serving a densly populated section of the city.
It would have resulted in 2 northern and 2 southern branches with a common central section between Nørreport and Christianshavn, which is the busiest section.

Wonder why it was shelved and could it not be built now with moderate disturbence to the existings lines.
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Old August 26th, 2009, 04:21 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Falubaz View Post
This is awesome!
btw. what program have u used?
Adobe Illustrator

Quote:
Originally Posted by hans280 View Post
Hum... ten points for a vivid imagination, Schliemann, but two questions. First, why do you foresee a prolongation of M5/M6 to Herlev? All the public discussions I have read to date have focused on a line to Husum Torv from which it MIGHT be prolonged west-around Utterslev Mose to Gladsaxe. Does your drawing reflect your personal preferences, or do you know something I do not?
That is only based on the rought sketch that was posted here earlier. I only extended it by two stations (Novembervej and Herlev), so it could connect with what i thought would be a fitting rought for the M2. I don't have any insider news on that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hans280 View Post
Secondly, how much of this major metro network you are sketching do you imagine would be underground? I ask because as far as I can see big chunks of what you now suggest are in areas that are not much more populated than eastern Amager. - But, there as well, I could be mistaken.
Yes that might be the case. My research didn't get farther than what i could see on Google Earth. The reason for the routs I planned was aiming at "cores" that I thoght might be there and intergrating the system with the S-tog when possible. Many of these places are what looks to be industry and commers. As for what could be overground. I mostly followed roads so it could be mostly overground. But i didn't get very deep into that issue.
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Old August 26th, 2009, 08:58 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Never give up View Post
Are you aware that when the first metro line was contructed, the 2 running tunnels north of Nørreport were built on different levels in order to facilitate a junction branching off to the right towards Fælledvej, Rigshospital, the University Park and Vibenhus Rundel?

This would have made great sense as regards serving a densly populated section of the city.
It would have resulted in 2 northern and 2 southern branches with a common central section between Nørreport and Christianshavn, which is the busiest section.

Wonder why it was shelved and could it not be built now with moderate disturbence to the existings lines.
I'd like to say "I know the answer to that question". Obviously I don't, but I do know the answer that was given to me by the company when they were still drilling and inviting questions via their website. I too found it weird that they split the line on Amager but not in western CPH. However, whoever answered my email told me that "there's no technical reason not to make a side branch west of Norreport, but the number of passengers here is about 2:1 relative to the passengers on each of the two Amager branches, so a distribution with one line in the west and two in the east is the most efficient in terms of load factors in the trains".

True of false? I don't know. But... it's an explanation.
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Old August 26th, 2009, 10:47 PM   #89
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It´s ridiculous spending all that money on a new metro and then saving small change on something so necessary as escalators up to street level.
At least I hope that the stairs are not as steep as they are on the present metro. They are almost not legal, if you study the rules about accessability.
Photo is from the future Trianglen station in Malmö, due to open in December 2010.
The Swedes seem to consider escalators to street level important, even in a city much smaller than Copenhagen.

[IMG]http://i26.************/x4onya.jpg[/IMG]
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Old August 27th, 2009, 11:48 AM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schliemann View Post
The nerd in me got loose.

Absolutely fantastic
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Old October 15th, 2009, 08:24 PM   #91
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Here is an interactive map of the new Ring Metro and the position of the different station. Just touch the station and the plan pops up.

http://multimedia.pol.dk/archive/003...09_357318a.swf
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Old October 15th, 2009, 09:41 PM   #92
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There many sacrifies for this metro I think.
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Old December 26th, 2009, 08:46 PM   #93
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December 1st was the last station names published. All the stations are:
  • København H
  • Rådhuspladsen
  • Gammel Strand (prev. v/Christianshavn)
  • Kongens Nytorv
  • Marmorkirken (prev. v/Frederiks Kirke)
  • Østerport
  • Trianglen
  • Poul Henningsens Plads
  • Vibenshus Runddel
  • Skjolds Plads (prev. v/Rådmandsmarken)
  • Nørrebro
  • Nørrebros Runddel
  • Nuuks Plads (prev. v/Landsarkivet)
  • Aksel Møllers Have
  • Frederiksberg
  • Frederiksberg Allé (prev. v/Platanvej)
  • Enghave Plads
  • København H

Link to graphics: http://www.berlingske.dk/nyheder/int...metrostationer

Contructions of Nørrebros Runddel and Kongens Nytorv stations has started, and conductivity changes has started in the Bremerholm area.

On Rådhuspladsen will the hated busterminal be torn down to make place for the new station in January 2010.
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Old December 27th, 2009, 06:09 PM   #94
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Why isn't this thread renamed "Copenhagen's New..."? It seems a bit too stubborn to use the Danish name when we're in the international section
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Old May 18th, 2010, 03:19 PM   #95
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This map was posted on the 'Fantasy Network Maps' thread. I hope Onetwothree doesn't mind me reposting it. This thread died a long time ago so it is as good as any to discuss the map.

Quote:
Originally Posted by onetwothree View Post
Copenhagen in 1000 years


click it for the full map
I like it. Although there seem to be very few stations within Cityringen for all those tracks. Mostly three interchanges. If there are plans for this inner city s-tåg extension could that be confirmed by anyone.

(I know the inner city quite well, but the outer areas not as much. So I've mostly looked at that inner area)

-Why stop the M6 at Øresund? I would suggest going via Lergravsparken down Amagerbrogade.
-I'm not sure the 'F-train' would go to the airport since it would need a separate rail and the area is well served already. I like the idea of the s-tåg to continue into Amager but perhaps further north. Perhaps via Sundby to Femøren. (And there between connect to the M6 on Amagerbrogade)
-I seem to remember someone telling me that there is already a 'chamber' west of Nørreport to connect rail to. Ofcourse another chamber would have to be added on the east side side aswell.
-If four lines were to use the same platform at Nørreport, that station would have to be altered. Wider platform, since it's already overcrowded during rushhour. (That would make Nørreport a mega-station to say the least). A new platform is not possible for those two lines since there simply isn't enough space. My first thought was that so many lines on a single platform would create huge delays but since it's all controlled by computers it could work.
-If you're suggest having a M7 like that i would suggest you drop the new s-tåg and continue that line through the inner city.

I slightly altered your ideas for the s-tåg and the new metro in the inner city. I felt that it was better to have the new metro line totally separate from Cityringen. And bypassing Hovedbanegården would fill up the only gap that would be left (I drew the map so i could better understand the routes)


I had a bit of a hard time figuring out how to connect the new s-tåg rail by Ryparken. So in the end i figured it would be much easier and cheaper to make a simple cross. (Ofcourse that would limit the the possible routs significantly, even make current routs not awailable)



Like I said, I really like the map. I hope you don't mind me posting some thoughts about it.

Cheers,
Gunnar

Last edited by Schliemann; May 18th, 2010 at 03:37 PM. Reason: better phrasing
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Old May 18th, 2010, 03:57 PM   #96
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I started thinking a little bit better about how the M7 would replace the new S-tåg (like i suggested in the previous post). It could continue from 'Forum' through 'Hovedbanegården' over to Amager. Connect to the M1 at Islands Brygge (or DR byen) and then from Amagerbro it would replace the M2 towards the airport. Instead M2 would be changed and continue down Amagerbrogade. The current Amagerbro station would continue to be part of the M2 (since it lies in a north-south direction) but the tunnel be altered to connect to a new east-west station.

The reason for the change would be to make a connecting station between M2 and M6.
Otherwise the M6 would not connect to the M2 but from Islands Brygge go Sundholmsvej before continuing down Amagerbrogade.

If you added the F-train to connect those three lines further south that would make amager set.

Keep in mind i'm thinking very far into the future

edit: ofcourse the new station on amagerbro could lie along-side the current one and a "hook" shaped track connect it to Islandbrygge.

(so many possibilities... enough to go crazy)

Last edited by Schliemann; May 18th, 2010 at 04:14 PM.
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Old May 18th, 2010, 10:58 PM   #97
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You're optmistic though..

How did you make those maps ? :-)
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Old May 20th, 2010, 02:39 PM   #98
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I don't mind at all

The new S-tog line through the city is a vision at most, you can read about it here, but I have to say I find it one of the most ambitious visions for Copenhagen so far. That tunnel would do wonders for the S-tog network as a whole and close that gaping hole left behind by the Cityring. I guess you could close that hole with a new Metro line, but I just find the benefits much larger with an S-tog tunnel (not to mention it seems to fit perfectly right there).
Also the junction at Ryparken would be the complicated first one you posted it. It's the only way to do it if we want to do it right.

- M6 is actually one of the things I was most unsure about so I totally get your point. I did consider continuing down Amagerbrogade, but then I found the whole detour via Refshaleøen and the stuff out there too long. So what I've since come up with would be branching M6 off at Operaen going directly to Kløvermarken, Lergravsparken or Amagerbro then down Amagerbrogade.

- I chose that alignment for the F train because it's what's already there. I imagine building seperate tracks next to already existing tracks would be easier than building a new route entirely. That way you could also have S-tog at Tårnby instead of Øresund trains like today (does anyone use that station?), plus a new station at Sjællansbroen down by Sluseholmen. I've read the tracks from the city to the airport are really congested, so I was thinking the S-tog line would take some of the pressure off. You could make it follow Vejlands Allé after Sjællandsbroen as you said, then turn up to Sundby, Sundbyvester Plads, Femøren, but somehow I think it would be a shame to bypasss Ørestad, seeing as it's the new CBD of Amager. I also imagine Ørestad as a new Copenhagen main station (along with Ny Ellebjerg, they would be renamed København Ørestad and København Ellebjerg (or "Syd"))
But the main reason for the F extension: We need a connection to Amager that doesn't involve going through the inner city. This would make getting to Amager from Vestegnen and the South Coast (lines B and A/E) a breeze.

- The Nørreport issue... M5 and M6 would use a seperate platform and I admit I have no idea where they would put it. I deliberately didn't think about it when making the map but looked at it afterwards and considered both Israels Plads and the street a block north from the existing station, but I think both of those are too far away. The only solution I could come up with was a deep level station beneath the existing tracks with connections to the underground concourse and stairs up to the plaza that will come when they close the road between Nørreport and Købmagergade. That would mean a different sort of station to the other Metro stations (no natural light) but I couldn't think of anything else

- The M7 honestly annoys me because it's so short, but I guess leaving it at Østerport leaves the possibility of a future line through the city (I don't see where right now, but let's see in the future). It's sort of needed because you can't leave Nordhavnen without anything, yet it's so short it almost seems pointless. I didn't want to give it the S-tog line, because I think that tunnel is far more important. In fact I would sacrifice pretty much any vision in this map for the S-tog tunnel (except maybe a line towards Brønshøj, which is sorely needed). It makes me seem fanatical, but I think it's a really good proposal
That said, your second M7 proposal is actually really good. It would make a nice clean curve from Hovedbanegården all the way down to Lergravsparken before turning south again. I just still don't see the city part of the M7 as a better solution than the S-tog extension.

So many posibilities indeed! I'm just glad I'm not the only geek around here that enjoys fantasizing about these things

edit:

a horribly horribly bad illustration of my Nørreport concept. Extend the lower level concourse to Fredensborggade and from there make a connection to the new platform. For security reasons there'd probably need to be a second way out from the platform, which could be at the opposite end with street level access to the other side of Nørre Voldgade. A direct link between the new station and the existing S-tog platform might be possible, but I wouldn't recommend it.
[IMG]http://i48.************/dpa5wo.jpg[/IMG]

Last edited by onetwothree; May 22nd, 2010 at 08:24 PM. Reason: added a pic
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Old May 29th, 2010, 10:57 PM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Never give up View Post
It´s ridiculous spending all that money on a new metro and then saving small change on something so necessary as escalators up to street level.
At least I hope that the stairs are not as steep as they are on the present metro. They are almost not legal, if you study the rules about accessability.
Photo is from the future Trianglen station in Malmö, due to open in December 2010.
The Swedes seem to consider escalators to street level important, even in a city much smaller than Copenhagen.

[IMG]http://i26.************/x4onya.jpg[/IMG]
According to Helge Erlandsen from the Metro company, escalators up to street level were ommited in order to ensure quiet squares in Sundays

Found in http://groups.google.dk/group/dk.fri...c178fa6e9ad50b

"Det har været en målsætning for Ørestadsselskabet, dets rådgivere og Københavns Kommune at indpasningen af tunnelstationerne i den eksisterende by skulle repræsentere en tilførsel af kvalitet til de torve og pladser, hvor stationerne blev indpasset. Det er en direkte følge af denne holdning, at det er besluttet at undgå overdækninger af nedgangene, fordi sådanne ville virke dominerende i bybilledet. Det er ligeledes en følge af nævnte holdning, at det er besluttet at undgå rulletrappeløb helt op til gadeplan, fordi de karakteristiske lyde fra rulletrappeløb på et nattestille eller søndagsstille torv ville irritere."

"Undervejs i forløbet har det vist sig at Frederiksberg Kommune ikke fuldt ud delte holdningen til disse spørgsmål. Fsa Solbjerg station gælder der endvidere det særlige forhold, at stationen iht Ørestadsloven skulle have været en overfladestation og at ændringen til tunnelstation derfor særfinancieres af Frederiksberg Kommune. Rulletrapperne på Solbjerg station er derfor sammen med en endnu ikke fastlagt, let overdækning rekvireret af Frederiksberg Kommune under særfinancieringen."

Last edited by Peter999; May 30th, 2010 at 05:29 PM.
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Old May 30th, 2010, 12:59 AM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter999 View Post
According to Helge Erlandsen from the Metro company, escalators up to street level were ommited in order to ensure quiet squares in Sundays
I am sure that the Aesthetics were more important than quiet squares :P Tbh, I think the current entrance blends perfectly in with the surroundings on a square like Kgs. Nytorv, where Escelators to street level would have made the station stick too much out. The stairs ARE too steep, I must admit.

Anyway, I just passed through Kgs. Nytorv today, and I saw that half the square (towards the metro station) was dug up, and the construction was plastered with ads for the new metro ring. Does anyone know exactly what they are doing? To me it looked like they were digging canals around the square :P
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