TORONTO - Rogers Centre (52,230)

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by KingmanIII

Have they ever contemplated lowering the playing field? It would greatly improve sightlines for those in the front row.

The problem is also that you can't see the entire end zone from some of the seats. Lowering the field would make a horrible sight line even worse. The Argonauts need a football specific stadium that holds 35,000 to 40,000.

Originally Posted by JYDA

5) The threat of the NFL coming makes it a big risk. Ted Rogers is trying to line up a purchase of the Bills now that Ralph Wilson has said he's going to sell to the highest bidder when he dies rather than pass the team down to his family. CFL folks around here are very concerned about the detrimental effect it would have on the CFL because the Argos would struggle to stay alive.

I doubt the NFL will come to Toronto when there is no team in Los Angeles. The Skydome (Rogers Centre) doesn't meet NFL standards either. The Bills need to stay in Buffalo, and Ted Rogers needs to contribute to pro football in Canada rather than trying to destroy it. If he buys the Bills and moves it to Toronto, my cable, cell phone, and internet contracts will be cancelled immediately. No way that company will ever see another dime from me.

[Taller, Better]

I love the stadium and very much enjoy ball games there. Seems everyone whines about it, but to me it is a great place to watch a game. Sure beats the hell out of sitting in freezing winds or pouring rain. No games have to be cancelled here because of weather.

[go_leafs_go02]

It's a decent place. I go to 3-5 jays games a year, and I enjoy the place. Good sightlines, good scoreboard, etc.

I've been to Wrigley for a game, sat in the outfield bleachers, but no way am I going to compare the two.

One thing I've noticed, painting the interior concrete to blue along the ledges has a wonderful effect on the ballpark. Look at older pictures where it's white/grey. Absolutely better in blue.

Would love to see grass in there, but I know that is totally unrealistic and impossible to achieve with the Argos in there. And not to mention the vast other events in there as well.

[isaidso]

It's great for baseball. My favourite seat is actually upper bowl behind home plate.

[en1044]

Originally Posted by isaidso

Oldest? I'll compromise. The Toronto Argonauts are the oldest continually running team in North American pro sport. The Hamilton Tiger-Cats are the oldest team in North American pro sport.

the Atlanta Braves are the oldest continuously operating pro team in north america

[KingmanIII]

Originally Posted by isaidso

The problem is also that you can't see the entire end zone from some of the seats. Lowering the field would make a horrible sight line even worse. The Argonauts need a football specific stadium that holds 35,000 to 40,000.

I doubt the NFL will come to Toronto when there is no team in Los Angeles. The Skydome (Rogers Centre) doesn't meet NFL standards either. The Bills need to stay in Buffalo, and Ted Rogers needs to contribute to pro football in Canada rather than trying to destroy it. If he buys the Bills and moves it to Toronto, my cable, cell phone, and internet contracts will be cancelled immediately. No way that company will ever see another dime from me.

The CFL, as a whole, really needs to look into either replacing or drastically remodeling a lot of these decrepit stadiums (especially Ivor Wynne, Mosaic, Canad Inns, Frank Clair, etc.). How can blowhards like Larry Campbell be so quick to introduce legislation to protect one of the country's cultural institutions but be so unwilling to invest government dollars into stimulating its growth?

And no, the Bills should not be cruelly ripped away from a city who has supported them through thick-and-thin. Spend a couple hundred mil to renovate Ralph Wilson, problem solved. If anything, the NFL should expand by two teams, putting one in each conference--with 34 teams, you can eliminate the divisional format and replace it with a 16-game round-robin, which would also eliminate complaints about strength of schedule.

[nyrmetros]

Originally Posted by JYDA

The Jays owner owns the stadium and would never go for it. The only way it would happen is if he gets the NFL team he wants so badly and the NFL forces him to improve the sightlines. The Argos have considered moving to BMO Field which is where Toronto FC plays but they'd have to pay for an expansion and the owners don't have the money for that.

Here's a pic of BMO Field

I'd love to see a full roof around that place.

[JYDA]

Originally Posted by KingmanIII

The CFL, as a whole, really needs to look into either replacing or drastically remodeling a lot of these decrepit stadiums (especially Ivor Wynne, Mosaic, Canad Inns, Frank Clair, etc.). How can blowhards like Larry Campbell be so quick to introduce legislation to protect one of the country's cultural institutions but be so unwilling to invest government dollars into stimulating its growth?

A new stadium in Saskatchewan is very likely to happen in the next few years. The Roughriders are HUGE in Saskatchewan and sell out every game. Additionally, the government is awash with cash with the booming Saskatchewan economy so government dollars will be available. The Premier has even mentioned this.

Renderings have been release for new stadiums in Ottawa and Winnipeg but who knows when/if that will happen.

Ivor Wynne desperately needs work. Problem is that the owner knows a new stadium would likely mean moving to the suburbs with a *gasp* running track and would rather remain in the same spot. They just need to rebuild the two main stands. It's a good location in the heart of the city and sholdn't move.

[ExWNY'er]

I think NFL football could thrive in Toronto for sure. The Rogers Centre is a little too small for an NFL stadium. I think that there will be an ongoing partnership between the two metros of Toronto and Buffalo moving forward and beyond the current 5 year agreement. Perhaps an expansion beyond the 1 game a year in Toronto? Maybe 2-3? Buffalo gets about 100K a year for a box at Ralph Wilson. You could 100k or more a game in TO. You cannot buy a history though and it is vital that the team maitain the strong tie to it's roots in Buffalo. I would hate to see it, but I think it would make the team viable in that area for the long term. That would ensure that one of the largest North American markets remains served by the NFL. LA can get and expansion team or get a team from a place like JAX where the team is struggling. Toronto is way way to wealthy to not have a greater role in the NFL.

[JYDA]

I'd much rather the team stay in Buffalo. Best for the Argos and I'd much rather go to a Bills game at the Ralph than in Toronto. However, there's a lot of people in Buffalo with their head in the sand on the potential for losing the team. Everyone in Buffalo I talk to and even some of the complete idiots on the radio there keep saying "well every game is sold out so what's the big deal." None of them seem to understand that Joe shmo paying 30 bucks a seat to fill the last few seats in the upper bowl has very little to do with the team's viability. It's the corporate dollars that Buffalo just doesn't have. It's a shrinking city with a depressed economy with big business leaving. The team's sponsors consist of ambulance chasers and local car dealerships. Now in a recession with slumping car sales it's going to be even more of a stretch. In the modern NFL that's just not going to cut it. The corporate dollars in places like LA and Toronto are enormous in comparison. Astronomical luxury box prices with sponsorship from national and multinational corporations. I'm hoping Buffalo stays exactly where they are but I'm definitely getting worried.

[ExWNY'er]

Put a good team on the field and you can raise prices and people will still fill the stadium in Buffalo. Ralph has to grasp this. I agree, there needs to be a good balance between the die hard fan base in Buffalo and the corporate dollars in Toronto. In the long run, you can't stay status quo in Buffalo, but running for Toronto is not the answer either. I'd say 5 games in Buffalo and 3 in TO is realistic. Or a 80,000 seat stadium in Ft. Erie Ontario or St. Catts a real compromise for both metros. You would actually be closer to Buffalo than OP is. You would need the new bridge over the Niagara and you must have to have good tailgaiting.

[isaidso]

The NFL needs to stay out of Canada. We're talking about the potential destruction of pro football across an entire nation, because some people in 1 Canadian city think they're too good for the rest of the country. And Torontonians wonder why there's so much animosity towards them nationally. Gee, I wonder why?

Torontonians need to start contributing to pro football in Canada instead of destroying it.

Originally Posted by KingmanIII

The CFL, as a whole, really needs to look into either replacing or drastically remodeling a lot of these decrepit stadiums (especially Ivor Wynne, Mosaic, Canad Inns, Frank Clair, etc.).

And no, the Bills should not be cruelly ripped away from a city who has supported them through thick-and-thin.

Agree 100%. All 4 of those stadiums above look likely to be replaced soon.

Ivor Wynne in Hamilton will rest on a successful Toronto Pan Am Games bid. Saskatchewan is football mad and the population will be very supportive of pouring money into Mosaic which is always sold out. The Bombers look very close to sealing a new stadium for the Bombers, while Frank Clair also seems likely to get over hauled.

The Bills must stay in Buffalo. It's their team. The NFL needs to stay out of Canada altogether.

[nomarandlee]

As an American NFL fan it would be somewhat sad to see Buffalo lose a team. However if they were to move it would make a lot of sense and Buffalo natives could at least be near their old team and have a regionally loyalty towards them. It would be nice to have an NFL team in a different country and Toronto is a major NA city and if they could get a new stadium to host then why not? I think Canada needs one large state of the art "national" stadium of sorts. Configure it so that seats could be pulled out for the larger Canadian game.

[isaidso]

We have 2 stadiums in Canada of that stature already. Montreal Olympic Stadium and Edmonton's Commonwealth Stadium.

I understand the sentiments about Buffalo losing pro football. This potential loss pales in comparison to my entire nation losing pro football because of the monetary interests of re-positioning one NFL team in one Canadian city.

My entire nation might end up with no pro football outside of Toronto if the Bills move here. Can you imagine no pro football in your country except in New York City? Can you imagine losing the Packers, Bears, etc?

Does the NFL really need to destroy a century of pro football tradition in this country to fatten its already bulging wallet? It's no wonder people around Canada are so worried. That's what we're facing from one end of Canada to the other all so that some NFL gazing Torontonians can entertain their business clients in some luxury box.

This can't be allowed to happen. Torontonians will never live it down.

[nomarandlee]

You think Montreal's or Edmonton's stadium is of the same caliber as the new Dallas, Houston, Phoenix, NYC, or Chicago NFL stadiums?

[JYDA]

Obviously Olympic in Montreal and Commonwealth in Edmonton aren't as good but that's not the point. They both sit empty most of the year so the need for a state of the art national stadium isn't really there. An NFL team in Toronto would likely require a new stadium but the government's not going to dish out hundreds of millions of dollars for 8 games a year.

[Jim856796]

Originally Posted by weava

One of the worst looking stadiums in the MLB. Only Tropican and Oakland can compete with it for the ugliest outfield.

Are there any plans for a new baseball stadium for the Blue Jays?

You crazy! The Blue Jays will never get a new baseball stadium! Although they do share the stadium with a CFL team.

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by nomarandlee

You think Montreal's or Edmonton's stadium is of the same caliber as the new Dallas, Houston, Phoenix, NYC, or Chicago NFL stadiums?

No, I don't. They both need a lot of money poured into their refurbishment in the same way as happened with Wembley in London. It should be noted that these are both significantly extravagant stadia. The one in Montreal, specifically.

Montreal Olympic Stadium has many problems, but I consider it one of the most spectacular structures ever built on earth. It cost over $1 Billion and is still a building millions of people photograph whether they have an interest in sport or not.

In 2 weeks it will play host to the 96th Grey Cup game and close to 70,000 spectators. It may not be as modern as a long list of stadiums around the world, but it's definitely a stadium worthy of being called Canada's national stadium. You spoke about Canada having a 'national' stadium, not whether they were of a similar calibre to any particular list of yours.

Toronto will have to construct a large stadium with an athletics track if the dream of hosting the Summer Olympics is to be realized. The problem then becomes what to do with the stadium after wards. Apart from the Leafs and TFC, Toronto is a big event town more than it is a big sports town. If something is considered a big deal, they will support it. It is why they don't draw more than 35,000 to football in this town despite a massive population. Torontonians aren't football fans, they are big spectacle fans. If they really loved football, they'd support their local team and build it into something better, like is done everywhere else on this continent.

[Alx-D]

Originally Posted by isaidso

No, I don't. They both need a lot of money poured into their refurbishment in the same way as happened with Wembley in London. It should be noted that these are both significantly extravagant stadia. The one in Montreal, specifically.

Montreal Olympic Stadium has many problems, but I consider it one of the most spectacular structures ever built on earth. It cost over $1 Billion and is still a building millions of people photograph whether they have an interest in sport or not.

In 2 weeks it will play host to the 96th Grey Cup game and close to 70,000 spectators. It may not be as modern as a long list of stadiums around the world, but it's definitely a stadium worthy of being called Canada's national stadium. You spoke about Canada having a 'national' stadium, not whether they were of a similar calibre to any particular list of yours.

too bad the inside has been bastardized over the years by the Expos, it looks terrible in football mode now

[isaidso]

With the Expos gone, improvements will surely follow. The upcoming Grey Cup will likely provide glimpses into certain upgrades that have been made. Baseball had reduced football capacity to about 59,000. They're expecting about 68,000 for the Grey Cup which is close to the original capacity when the Summer Olympics were staged in Montreal.