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Old January 24th, 2008, 07:19 PM   #121
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Ireland has absolutely the worst rail network in Western Europe. To say otherwise is simply blasphemy.
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Old January 24th, 2008, 08:07 PM   #122
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Ireland has absolutely the worst rail network in Western Europe. To say otherwise is simply blasphemy.
What about Iceland?
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Old January 24th, 2008, 08:11 PM   #123
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What about Iceland?
Well, given that Iceland has not even a population (only about 300.000) large enough to jusfity a train system if it were a city, let alone a country, I think they can be forgiven. Ireland on the otherhand with 4 million+ people has a horrific railway system.
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Old January 24th, 2008, 11:03 PM   #124
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Originally Posted by sumisu View Post
Ireland has absolutely the worst rail network in Western Europe. To say otherwise is simply blasphemy.
At least Ireland has an excuse for that (unlike Denmark), since their country used to be among the poorest in Western Europe until just recently. I assume they have big plans for future ralway systems.
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Old January 25th, 2008, 11:32 AM   #125
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Well, given that Iceland has not even a population (only about 300.000) large enough to jusfity a train system if it were a city, let alone a country, I think they can be forgiven. Ireland on the otherhand with 4 million+ people has a horrific railway system.
I just checked the Irish national rail website, a journey between the two major cities of Dublin and Cork takes 2H50 and costs €55 for a return trip, that is slow considering the distance is only 250Km.
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Old January 25th, 2008, 05:55 PM   #126
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I just checked the Irish national rail website, a journey between the two major cities of Dublin and Cork takes 2H50 and costs €55 for a return trip, that is slow considering the distance is only 250Km.
Its actually both the same price and time as a simular distance in Denmark.
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Old January 25th, 2008, 06:04 PM   #127
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I just checked the Irish national rail website, a journey between the two major cities of Dublin and Cork takes 2H50 and costs €55 for a return trip, that is slow considering the distance is only 250Km.
Sounds like Amtrak in the US.
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Old January 26th, 2008, 05:25 PM   #128
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No...Amtra would be 7 hours late and take 20 hours. :p
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Old January 26th, 2008, 05:30 PM   #129
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No...Amtra would be 7 hours late and take 20 hours. :p
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Old January 29th, 2008, 02:29 PM   #130
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Only somebody who has never been to Ireland could say that the UK has the worst rail in Western Europe. We don't have the best either but how about countries like Portugal.

The % of delays in the UK sounds similar to Denmark (just under 10%) and we have a small HSR section between London and the Channel Tunnel. There are still many countries that don't have any HSR.

Our non-HSR mainlines are pretty quick with good regular services. The East and West coast mainlines have a top speed of 200kph which is faster than many countries trunk services, London-Newcastle for example takes 3 hours or less, that's an average speed of 155kph, services every 30 minutes. London-Manchester takes just over 2 hours with a service every 30 minutes, average speed 145kph.

As a comparison, the French TGV network has average speed of around 170-220kph but usually the services are less frequent, once every 60-90 minutes is common. In Germany Koln-Stuttgart averages 160kph, services every 60 minutes. Copenhagen Odense averages 110kph.

The network is comprehensive going to most parts of the country and most main routes are electrified. There are plenty of commuter services around most big cities.



The rail system has seen passenger numbers increase by 50% over the past ten years which has caused some overcrowding on busy routes which is now the main problem. But most rolling stock is now pretty modern and in good condition and there has been £ billions of investment in improving track and signalling in recent years. There is room for improvement for sure but the worst in W. Europe? Not by a long way imo.
We are dirty poor ... but 1/2 hour network is electrified and 1/4th is operated at speeds >160kmh ... while our Intercity network operates as 220kmh (200kmh for loco haouled trains of upto 14 coaches)

But the UK Intercity is mainly run with IC225, c390 Pendulinos , v2xx voyager's and IC125 at 200kmh speeds ... don't know why British people complain so much about their HUGE network ...

French for example have only some FEW mainlines at 300kmh and the majority of the rest is curvy track and slow running.

Denmark Intercity network is pretty awesome considering that its a small country ... some "regions" of bigger countries would kill to have a regional fast network in the same level of us smaller countries.
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Old January 29th, 2008, 07:52 PM   #131
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Denmark Intercity network is pretty awesome considering that its a small country ... some "regions" of bigger countries would kill to have a regional fast network in the same level of us smaller countries.
I disagree big time! Almost all the biggest cities in Denmark lies as pearls on a string - Ålborg - Randers - Århus - Horsens - Vejle - Fredericia - Odense - Roskilde - Copenhagen. This means that the main intercity line in Denmark is probably just as important as the west coast main line in the UK. Even so, the tracks are still in the same trace as they were back in the 19th century, and the trains can therefore not drive faster than 160 km/h most of the time. I would say that the intercity main line in Denmark is extremely poor considering how good it could and should be.
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Old January 30th, 2008, 07:02 PM   #132
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The worst rail system in Western Europe is probably the italian one

Trains are very often late and dirty.

They are quite frequent on main routes, thought up to 3 or 4 per hour. 1 fast or (in the future) high-speed train, 1 InterCity (fast), 1 InterRegio (semi-fast) and one or mroe regional or suburban.

Another problem is that there are about 27 different tariff, so it is not easy to change tickets.

In Switzerland you can buy a return ticket and make the return trip when you want, in Italy you have to change the reservation at the ticket office or pay a fine on the train. The problem is that often ticket vending machines are broken and ticket offices closed or with a lot of people queuing for thrm...
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Old January 31st, 2008, 11:58 AM   #133
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We are dirty poor ... but 1/2 hour network is electrified and 1/4th is operated at speeds >160kmh ... while our Intercity network operates as 220kmh (200kmh for loco haouled trains of upto 14 coaches)
Yeah, sorry, the mainlines on the Portuguese network seem pretty good actually.

Portugal was just an example that came to mind because my only experience of Portuguese trains is taking a very slow service from Faro to Vila Real de San Antonio in the Algarve but that isn't really representative I think
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Old January 31st, 2008, 06:15 PM   #134
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Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
The worst rail system in Western Europe is probably the italian one

Trains are very often late and dirty.

They are quite frequent on main routes, thought up to 3 or 4 per hour. 1 fast or (in the future) high-speed train, 1 InterCity (fast), 1 InterRegio (semi-fast) and one or mroe regional or suburban.

Another problem is that there are about 27 different tariff, so it is not easy to change tickets.

In Switzerland you can buy a return ticket and make the return trip when you want, in Italy you have to change the reservation at the ticket office or pay a fine on the train. The problem is that often ticket vending machines are broken and ticket offices closed or with a lot of people queuing for thrm...
It works very well with train tickets in Denmark except for the stupid new ticket machines which are completely idiotic made. However, the italian tracks are usually much better than the danish tracks, and also suitable for higher speeds.

Maybe Switzerland has the best railway system in Europe?
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Old January 31st, 2008, 10:20 PM   #135
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I second that.
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Old February 1st, 2008, 02:25 AM   #136
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I think thath every system has a lot of adventage and disadventage.
For some people the most important is cleanness, for some the most important is is the price (Ireland), for some speed (France), for some modern stations (Germany) etc
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Old February 1st, 2008, 05:51 PM   #137
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Originally Posted by Hubert Pollak View Post
I think thath every system has a lot of adventage and disadventage.
For some people the most important is cleanness, for some the most important is is the price (Ireland), for some speed (France), for some modern stations (Germany) etc
The most important for me is comfort, speed, price, and simplicity. I dont care much about new stations/new trains or their design.
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Old February 3rd, 2008, 05:15 PM   #138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sumisu View Post
Ireland has absolutely the worst rail network in Western Europe. To say otherwise is simply blasphemy.
+1
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Old February 3rd, 2008, 11:47 PM   #139
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+1
Ireland is investing and upgrading their network, though. It is getting better and better, and I hope the Western Corridor gets rebuilt completely.
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Old February 8th, 2008, 05:22 AM   #140
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I disagree big time! Almost all the biggest cities in Denmark lies as pearls on a string - Ålborg - Randers - Århus - Horsens - Vejle - Fredericia - Odense - Roskilde - Copenhagen. This means that the main intercity line in Denmark is probably just as important as the west coast main line in the UK. Even so, the tracks are still in the same trace as they were back in the 19th century, and the trains can therefore not drive faster than 160 km/h most of the time. I would say that the intercity main line in Denmark is extremely poor considering how good it could and should be.
Dunno ... we were just "upgrading" our network with Pendulino trains to "save" on infraesructure expenditures and ended up with some 600km of 220km/h railtrack.

You upgraded to 140/180 km/h and got precisely that ... but upgrading from "classic" lines at 140 km/h in such short distances as most of Danish rails going from 140km/h to 220 km/h don't bring that much gains ... better to mae sure everyting gets upgraded to 140.

As a sidenotice ... how the hell did you and Swedes managed to MISS an entire island on that Oresund Link ???
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