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Old November 14th, 2013, 08:47 PM   #2421
Coccodrillo
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An Ukrainian driver of a truck carrying hazardous materials, seeing that the San Bernardino tunnel was forbidden to hazardous materials, decided to open the barrier leading to the pass (closed because winter) and got stuck in a sharp bend. Even a smaller vehicle would have been blocked probably anyway because of the snow. The pass is forbidden to such long and heavy trucks anyway.



Source: http://www.cdt.ch/ticino-e-regioni/c...so-chiuso.html

Beside that, according to the polls the vignette price increase referendum has an uncertain result: around 45% of people support it, 50% are against, the rest is unsure.
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Old November 14th, 2013, 08:58 PM   #2422
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What is the alternate route for hazmats?
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Old November 14th, 2013, 09:47 PM   #2423
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St Gotthard?

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Old November 14th, 2013, 10:19 PM   #2424
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Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
What is the alternate route for hazmats?
Basically the Simplon pass and the railway. The St. Gotthard pass and tunnel are both forbidden to hazmats, although I read the Gotthard pass will accept them in the future, but only during daytime (7 to 17). However, on the Gotthard pass trucks with trailer are forbidden.

The San Bernardino tunnel is also closed to hazmats, but I don't know if there are limits on the pass (except those on weight, length and trailers). The Great St. Bernard tunnel is also forbidden to hazmats.

Lucomagno/Lukmanier is usually opened in winter, but in this season it is forbidden to vehicles heavier than 3.5t.

Note that there is only a piggyback train for trucks on the Gotthard, running once a day per direction between Lugano and Basel, so hazmats going from Deutschschweiz to Ticino mostly travel directly by rail, not by road nor by piggyback trains.
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Old November 16th, 2013, 02:38 AM   #2425
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post

Beside that, according to the polls the vignette price increase referendum has an uncertain result: around 45% of people support it, 50% are against, the rest is unsure.
The truck driver has a lot of explaining to do and may probably lose his job.

As for the referendum, I would say that the attempt to increase the cost of the vignette, is defeated by a simple majority.
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Old November 16th, 2013, 07:34 AM   #2426
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The truck driver has a lot of explaining to do and may probably lose his job.
That's what I also had in mind since somebody will have to come up for the cost of towing the truck from the site. I wonder if authorities will simply confiscate the vehicle until the company regulates the bill?

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As for the referendum, I would say that the attempt to increase the cost of the vignette, is defeated by a simple majority.
I hope so. The increase would not go entirely into road funding anyway. Part of it would be used for public transport ....
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Old November 16th, 2013, 10:07 AM   #2427
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I hope so. The increase would not go entirely into road funding anyway. Part of it would be used for public transport ....
The money coming from the vignette would entirely go to roads.

As for the other road taxes, people forget that:
1) the destination of their revenue and their introduction has been approved by voters (for example, the truck tax going 2/3 to rail and 1/3 to cantons has been approved by voters, and the related Alpen-Initiative that was proposed and approved by citizens, not by the government which didn't support it)
2) their are government taxes, not tolls of a private road, so there is nothing wrong if they are used to finance whatever is needed. Otherwise it's like saying that VAT on vegetables should only be used to help farmers
3) most (>50%) of the taxes from roads (including VAT) go neither to roads or public transport, but to the general budget
4) the state doesn't ask for taxes because it is evil, but because it needs the money to make something for the citizens. Sure, it would be possible to cancel all fuel taxes to halve fuel price, but then either other taxes (on work, on property, etc) would have to be increased, or public services (schools, hospitals, subsidies for handicapped people, public transport, etc) would have to be cut
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Old November 16th, 2013, 11:38 AM   #2428
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The huge vignette price increase is not in correlation with the small increase in new lane mileage to be maintained. They transfer a small amount of secondary roads to the national road network to justify a factor 2.5 increase in vignette price from 40 to 100 CHF.
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Old November 16th, 2013, 12:58 PM   #2429
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
The huge vignette price increase is not in correlation with the small increase in new lane mileage to be maintained. They transfer a small amount of secondary roads to the national road network to justify a factor 2.5 increase in vignette price from 40 to 100 CHF.
There are some big projects coming up, though. The widening between Zürich-Nord and Limmattal, the relocation of A1 near Morges, the completion of A53, and the Glatttalautobahn between Zürich-Nord and Brüttisellen are all rather short, but VERY expensive projects. The Swiss motorway system already behind its requirements due to lack of funding, which will only get worse. As the vignette earnings go directly into road construction, I think an increase is justifiable.
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Old November 16th, 2013, 06:41 PM   #2430
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The vignette price hasn't been increased from 1990 or so (when it passed from 30 to 40 CHF), considering inflation now it would be around 60 CHF.
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Old November 16th, 2013, 07:20 PM   #2431
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Not a single country can maintain and built its infrastructure on vignette income anyway. Vignettes are a farce.
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Old November 16th, 2013, 07:47 PM   #2432
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A 100 CHF vignette would give 450 million CHF/360 million EUR (or something around that), which is not that bad (also considering the 2-month, 40 CHF one).

Dropping the vignette would mean loosing that money, and creating a normal toll system (even an electronic one, without toll stations) would hardly pass in a referendum.

If there will ever be a standard European toll system things might change. What is the EU position about that? It is creating a toll for trucks, the Eurovignette, so extending it to private vehicles shouldn't be impossible.
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Old November 16th, 2013, 09:33 PM   #2433
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
If there will ever be a standard European toll system things might change. What is the EU position about that? It is creating a toll for trucks, the Eurovignette, so extending it to private vehicles shouldn't be impossible.
They want full interoperability of electronic toll collection by 2016.
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Old November 17th, 2013, 12:38 AM   #2434
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There are some big projects coming up (...) the relocation of A1 near Morges (...)
Are they really going to build that bypass, or is it still just an idea?
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Old November 17th, 2013, 11:26 AM   #2435
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Are they really going to build that bypass, or is it still just an idea?
They at least included it in the network and claim that plannings will be continued.

http://www.astra.admin.ch/themen/nat...x.html?lang=fr

When or if it is built, who knows nowadays...
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Old November 19th, 2013, 10:56 PM   #2436
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Gotthard Road Tunnel second bore

I have a basic question concerning the Gotthard Road Tunnel:
why only one tunnel has been built; while one can see on those 2 pictures of the north and south portals, that it was clearly designed and intended to be a second tunnel (2 entrances)?





This picture of the southern portal taken during inauguration in 1980, shows blatantly a second entrance; so it was intended to be a second tunnel since the beginning:



Why and who decided, during construction period of 1970-80, not to drill the second bore?
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Old November 19th, 2013, 11:30 PM   #2437
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Two tubes were considered too expensive and useless. Initially the tunnel wasn't planned at all, that's why the pass road is partly an autostrasse.

Actually there are already two tubes, but the second one is very small and used only as safety tunnel.

If built, now a second traffic tube would follow a different alignment and the existing safety tunnel would be remain as it is (because of safety and because it is full of cables and other infrastructures).
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Old November 20th, 2013, 05:32 PM   #2438
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Something can be found here: http://www.litra.ch/de/Zahlen-und-Fa...Verkehrszahlen (pages 10 to 12 of the PDF, also in French selecting that language on the top of the page)
I notice that number of car trips peaked around 1998 but car distance has gone up a lot since then. Is there any explanation of this?

I compared the car distance travelled per year per capita with the UK and Netherlands:

CH: 90 billion km/8 million residents = 11,250 km
NL: 137 billion km/16 million residents = 8,563 km
UK: 556 billion km/64 million residents = 8,683 km

(2011)

Sources:
http://www.bfs.admin.ch/bfs/portal/d...11/01/key.html
http://www.kimnet.nl/en/publication/...ty-report-2012
https://www.gov.uk/government/public...t-britain-2012

Obviously the Swiss economy is by far the strongest but I still found it surprising given that Switzerland has the best rail and local public transport system in the world but has a high per capita distance travelled by car.

How much of the Swiss traffic is personal transit traffic, say people driving from Germany to Italy? (Of course, transit freight is very big). Is there dissatisfaction with the railways? Or is it simply that the car offers the fastest journey time for trips in Switzerland?
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Old November 20th, 2013, 05:39 PM   #2439
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Perhaps the Swiss drive more per capita because of the geography (more mileage due to mountain ranges) and the fact that employment in many valleys is limited to tourism and agriculture. For example in Wallis / Valais canton there are many side valleys which take a long time and distance to get out of into the main valley where all the employment and shopping is. In my experience grocery shopping in many mountain villages is really limited.
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Old November 21st, 2013, 08:37 PM   #2440
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I guess the reason is that Swiss like to travel by car (anywhere in Europe). I don't think that the five or six mountain farmers have an influence on the statistics. (oversimplified)
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