[CH] Swiss highways and motorways

[Timon91]

I meant the problems of tunnel regulation etc. We don't have any mountains.

[Timon91]

Originally Posted by Verso

^ You may not have these problems in the Netherlands, but you have them if you go to the seaside in Italy. :P

I went to Italy once, using the Brenner pass, so no problems for me

[Jeroen669]

Originally Posted by Timon Kruijk

I meant the problems of tunnel regulation etc. We don't have any mountains.

But we do have a lot of tunnels, and guidelines for building and maintaining a tunnel have become much stricter (see eg the problems on the A73). The only advantage is that we don't have 2-lane tunnels, all of them have 2 or more lanes in each direction.

[Timon91]

Yeah, only the A73 tunnels give problems. For the rest it's quite ok. What is actually the longest 2-lane tunnel in NL?

[ChrisZwolle]

Westerschelde tunnel I assume. However, this is about Switzerland.

[Timon91]

I thought that was 2 tubes of both 2 lanes. But this tunnel is so quiet it almost can't give any problems. And yes, you're right we're getting off-topic.

[ChrisZwolle]

I just planned my holiday in Switzerland. I want to visit Lauterbrunnen (Berner Oberland) and some other places which aren't sure, perhaps Wallis/Valais and make a tour through Graubünden. Can't wait to go. I'll go there by the end of August, so I have to wait a little while.

[Timon91]

I went to Wallis a few years ago. It's really beautiful, but the camping I stayed on was really crap.

[ChrisZwolle]

Luckily, Switzerland has a great amount of campsites. Cost of living is more expensive in Switzerland, however gas is cheaper, which is for me the largest share in my holiday-budget I only take a small tent with me, so I shouldn't pay more than 10 - 15 euro's a night, sometimes even less.

[Jeroen669]

Originally Posted by Chriszwolle

however gas is cheaper, which is for me the largest share in my holiday-budget

Don't forget to fill your tank at Samnaun.

[ChrisZwolle]

Most Swiss gas stations have a € 1,10 to € 1,25 gas price. That's 40 - 50 cents cheaper than in the Netherlands.

[Verso]

Originally Posted by Jeroen669

Don't forget to fill your tank at Samnaun.

I quote! Just look for a crappy little gas station at the end of Samnaun, with a Bosnian selling cheap gas.

[earthJoker]

Originally Posted by Chriszwolle

But the Swiss choose to build a longer Gotthard railway tunnel.

It was a people vote, on both tunnels. So I think it's fair to say we don't want to have a second road tunnel tube.

If you enjoy driving, you should go over the pass anyway.

In the Lauterbrunnen valley you have to see the Trümmerlbach-falls! Jungrfaujoch is also nice, but expensive.

[ChrisZwolle]

I have been to the Trümmelbach about 9 years ago. I haven't been to Jungfraujoch and I'm not planning on doing so, I think it's too expensive, about € 120 for a round trip. Hell, my roundtrip from the Netherlands to Berlin was cheaper than that. No I'm planning on doing some hikes in the area.

[ChrisZwolle]

3 hour delays at the Gotthardtunnel currently.

[thun]

Like on every summer saturday...

Btw. Its also a political decision to build the rail tunnels instead of a second Gotthard road tube. This would cause much more road traffic and henceforth much more noise and environmental polution than putting the goods on trains. With the future increase of transalpine traffic, that's the right way for the future I think. Austria is planning the Brennerbasistunnel to lower traffic on that transit corridor as well, so that seems to be the trend.

[ChrisZwolle]

I think it's a mistake of Switzerland to think all goods will be transferred onto trains for that laughable short distance. Traffic jams will only increase at these tunnels, and other connections, like the San Bernardino, Brenner, Mt Blanc and Simplon.

However, traffic volumes are fairly low over the year, but the tunnel becomes overcrowded during the summer. The problem is that the Gotthard is the most truck-friendly, route, it's much flatter than the Brenner and San Bernardino, hence the lower fuel costs.

[Jeroen669]

Originally Posted by thun

This would cause much more road traffic and henceforth much more noise and environmental polution than putting the goods on trains. With the future increase of transalpine traffic, that's the right way for the future I think. Austria is planning the Brennerbasistunnel to lower traffic on that transit corridor as well, so that seems to be the trend.

On what way Swiss is going to reduce pollution as tunnelqueue's are getting only longer, and there's too little attraction to take trains (passengers as well as freight)? You're not solving those problems by only building rail infrastructure, how good your well known PT system may be.

[ChrisZwolle]

Only 15.000 vehicles use the Gotthardtunnel on an average daily base. How many of that are trucks? 5.000 - 10.000 would already be very much. That's nothing for such an important transportation axe. The Swiss have to accept the fact that transport is growing throughout Europe, also in Switzerland, which has the position as a very important transitcountry.

[Verso]

Originally Posted by thun

Btw. Its also a political decision to build the rail tunnels instead of a second Gotthard road tube. This would cause much more road traffic and henceforth much more noise and environmental polution than putting the goods on trains.

I strongly disagree. There are mostly no queues (or they are short) out of summer, so no one hesitates to use the tunnel anyway. And in summer, people don't care what the length of the traffic jam is, they won't cancel their vacations b/c of that. With so much stand-still traffic in front of the tunnel, you only get more polution. Considering that Switzerland can build a 57-km-long rail tunnel, a second road tube is urgent for summers. Don't the Swiss use it in summer too?