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Old September 22nd, 2009, 07:28 AM   #3101
TdotTdot
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10... u gotta be kidding me... plus the length of the platform should be able to fit the train.
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Old September 22nd, 2009, 07:46 AM   #3102
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Originally Posted by dhim100 View Post
I have been wondering about something for a while now. I have seen number of pictures/videos of Delhi metro train. Usually the trains have only 3-4 cars and most of the time they are extremely (especially during rush hour) crowded. Why can't they add more cars? Let's say 8 or 10. Adding cars take about a min or two. Where I live, the metro (BART) runs 10 car trains during rush hour and 3-6 car trains during non-peak hours. In a city where the population is more than 15 million, 4 car train is a joke.
Yes, increasing train length to 6 cars is in the works already, see eg. this article. No timelines given, but 2010/2011 seems likely.

All stations in the current network are sized for 8-car trains, although the new standard gauge lines are dimensioned for only 6.

IU: WTF? Reply if you think I'm wrong, don't edit my posts. Yes, that pic was from Pakistan, but you know perfectly well that trains in India can get just as bad and -- my original point -- while Delhi Metro trains may be "extremely crowded" by San Francisco standards, they're still entirely acceptable by Indian ones. For comparison, here's a train in Lucknow, UP, India on July 11, 2009:

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Last edited by jpatokal; September 23rd, 2009 at 04:10 AM.
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Old September 22nd, 2009, 07:52 AM   #3103
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Originally Posted by dhim100 View Post
I have been wondering about something for a while now. I have seen number of pictures/videos of Delhi metro train. Usually the trains have only 3-4 cars and most of the time they are extremely (especially during rush hour) crowded. Why can't they add more cars? Let's say 8 or 10. Adding cars take about a min or two. Where I live, the metro (BART) runs 10 car trains during rush hour and 3-6 car trains during non-peak hours. In a city where the population is more than 15 million, 4 car train is a joke.
They have 4 car trains but the frequency is high, ranging from 3 to 4 minutes depending on the line, which is going to get even higher in an year when the other Phase II lines open (while BART has a frequency of 15 min per line). Many of the trains on busy lines will be converted to 6 car configuration in few months. Most of the lines have been designed for 8 car trains. DMRC has ordered 484 broad gauge cars from Bombardier and many (I guess around 150) standard gauge cars from Rotem/BEML (for a comparison, Delhi metro has 280 cars as of now). So you can get an idea of the new capacity added.
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Old September 22nd, 2009, 08:17 AM   #3104
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Thanks for your answer guys.
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Old September 22nd, 2009, 08:45 AM   #3105
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Originally Posted by TdotTdot View Post
10... u gotta be kidding me... plus the length of the platform should be able to fit the train.
10 car train is the longest (metro) in the US.
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Old September 22nd, 2009, 11:09 AM   #3106
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Originally Posted by bhargavsura View Post
Indeed they are. How lovely it must be to ride in a Metro and see things like Qutub Minar, Akshardham Mandir, and the Hanuman Statue. Amazing pictures.

Looking at the post number 3086, I am just astonished about how much engineering, architecture, and planning is involved in this mammoth network construction. DMRC has pulled off a great deal of efforts. Cheers to them.

inus2663, where did you hear the news from? I want to read it too. It's going to be cool if that happens.
Airport express will have full platform screening doors. Half screens to be put on the busy flatforms. That was the plan.
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Old September 23rd, 2009, 06:47 PM   #3107
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Originally Posted by jpatokal View Post
Yes, increasing train length to 6 cars is in the works already, see eg. this article. No timelines given, but 2010/2011 seems likely.

All stations in the current network are sized for 8-car trains, although the new standard gauge lines are dimensioned for only 6.

IU: WTF? Reply if you think I'm wrong, don't edit my posts. Yes, that pic was from Pakistan, but you know perfectly well that trains in India can get just as bad and -- my original point -- while Delhi Metro trains may be "extremely crowded" by San Francisco standards, they're still entirely acceptable by Indian ones. For comparison, here's a train in Lucknow, UP, India on July 11, 2009:

I am not able to understand what you want to say or prove by showing crowded IR trains. Metro is different from railways. What's the point in comparing them ?
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Old September 23rd, 2009, 06:51 PM   #3108
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wheres the girls?
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Old September 23rd, 2009, 08:53 PM   #3109
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Old September 23rd, 2009, 10:37 PM   #3110
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jpatokal - The edit had nothing to do with your point. Members are allowed to post their views, no matter how ludicrous they may sound. But substantiating a point with images from other countries and passing it off as Indian is something that I won't allow.

PM me if you disagree.
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Old September 24th, 2009, 04:42 AM   #3111
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I am not able to understand what you want to say or prove by showing crowded IR trains. Metro is different from railways. What's the point in comparing them ?
Two points:

First -- Metro is not fundamentally different from railways, both are trains carrying people. If the Delhi Metro doesn't increase capacity, it's only a matter of time until we start seeing Mumbai-style "super dense crush loads" on it. Fortunately DMRC is already working on this, but I stand by my earlier prediction that, due to the network design, CP/Rajiv Chowk will become a major choke point within a few years.

Second -- India is not the United States and Delhi is not San Francisco. In San Francisco, it would absolutely unacceptable to cram 5000+ people into a train rated for 1700, or for 10 people to die on the tracks everyday. In Mumbai, this is unfortunately normal, and in Delhi people also have a much higher tolerance for crowding than the US.
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Old September 24th, 2009, 05:02 AM   #3112
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First of all, it is a Metro and not suburban railways like in Bombay/Mumbai/whatever. Increasing capacity is possible by two ways, either increase the coaches or increase the frequency of the train, where the latter seems more feasible. Capacity in terms of carrying more people per coach (if that's what you mean) is not at all feasible due to blockage of circulation of air in a closed train.

I honestly don't see what you want to prove here.
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Old September 24th, 2009, 07:39 AM   #3113
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but I stand by my earlier prediction that, due to the network design, CP/Rajiv Chowk will become a major choke point within a few years.
I think DMRC is planning for many Interchange stations within the network in Phase 3 whereby lines would be interconnected to undo the load on Rajiv Chowk station.
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Old September 24th, 2009, 07:44 AM   #3114
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but I stand by my earlier prediction that, due to the network design, CP/Rajiv Chowk will become a major choke point within a few years.
I think DMRC is planning for many Interchange stations within the network in Phase 3 whereby lines would be interconnected to undo the load on Rajiv Chowk station.
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Old September 24th, 2009, 08:07 AM   #3115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jpatokal View Post
Two points:

First -- Metro is not fundamentally different from railways, both are trains carrying people. If the Delhi Metro doesn't increase capacity, it's only a matter of time until we start seeing Mumbai-style "super dense crush loads" on it. Fortunately DMRC is already working on this, but I stand by my earlier prediction that, due to the network design, CP/Rajiv Chowk will become a major choke point within a few years.
Then you need to see this. I have posted this a few pages back as well. Doing it once again.

Source: DMRC

You can yourself see the no. of interconnections between red and blue line (and others as well). Currently yellow line (Kashmere Gate - Rajiv Chowk section) is the only North - South line that connects these 2 major East - West lines. But by 2020, there will be 6 more lines (in brackets is the section which lies between the red and blue lines) -

1. Barwala - Najafgarh
2. ORR line/ Mukundpur - Palam (Pitampura - Janakpuri)
3. Ring road line (Netaji Subhash place - Rajouri Garden)
4. Inderlok/Kirti Nagar - Mundka line (Inderlok - Kirti Nagar)
5. Central Sectt. - Nawada line (Mandi House - Welcome)
6. ORR line/ Sarai Kale Khan - Sonia Vihar (Anand Vihar - Dilshad Garden)

Now with these and many more interconnections between other lines do you believe Rajiv Chowk will be chocked ?

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Originally Posted by jpatokal View Post
Second -- India is not the United States and Delhi is not San Francisco.
True, that's why not even a single city except New York has a truly large and busy subway system. That country is automobile crazy, others are not. Delhi is not San Francisco, that's why it is building a subway larger than the largest existing systems (see the route length planned in above shown map), which San Francisco can only dream of.
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Old September 24th, 2009, 08:51 AM   #3116
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Abhishek , do you have the link to that map where I could see a zoomed in version
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Old September 24th, 2009, 09:03 AM   #3117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dhim100 View Post
I have been wondering about something for a while now. I have seen number of pictures/videos of Delhi metro train. Usually the trains have only 3-4 cars and most of the time they are extremely (especially during rush hour) crowded. Why can't they add more cars? Let's say 8 or 10. Adding cars take about a min or two. Where I live, the metro (BART) runs 10 car trains during rush hour and 3-6 car trains during non-peak hours. In a city where the population is more than 15 million, 4 car train is a joke.
Yes you are absolutely right. Currently, each train runs with 4 cars only and the Delhi Metro platforms can accommodate upto 8 cars. So they can add cars accordingly at any point of time to ease the crowd
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Old September 24th, 2009, 09:15 AM   #3118
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Last edited by dreadathecontrols; September 24th, 2009 at 09:21 AM.
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Old September 24th, 2009, 09:16 AM   #3119
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Good
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Old September 24th, 2009, 06:29 PM   #3120
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Originally Posted by Abhishek901 View Post
Delhi is not San Francisco, that's why it is building a subway larger than the largest existing systems (see the route length planned in above shown map), which San Francisco can only dream of.
I don't think the point of discussion should be who has a bigger metro system. The DMRC should not be looking at London, NY or SF metro systems. They should be looking at their own current and future needs. That's all. Considering the population of Delhi (and India), the DMRC is doing what they are supposed to be doing, that is building a massive interconnected system to ease the traffic on the road.

Regarding BART, did you know that they built BART in 60s? They also put a 7-8 mile long transbay tube on the ocean floor to connect SF with the East Bay. Even after these many years it still remains as an engineering marvel. They have not added any lines (because they took into consideration the future needs) since it's commencement in 1972. Now that's what I call planning. However, they have proposed to add a 20 miles (over 30 kms) line to San Jose (south bay). Also, the south bay has it's own network of metro trains as well as a connecting line between south bay and BART. The last but not least, it is one of the safest metro in the country. There are no major accidents (and not a single death) in it's almost 40 year history.
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