Seattle Sound Transit Light Rail Link

[guinessbeer55]

7 years!!! thats unbelievable... what the fuck are these people doing... why dont they just build the thing... why cant Seattle ever figure out anything... I mean look at any other city in the world of our size or even smaller and they are far ahead of us!!

Its kinda sad.

[kub86]

Instead of doing everything one slow step at a time, we could've overlapped a few steps (final designing while doing preliminary engineering/construction) and saved a few years like what Houston is doing with their ambitious 5 lines in 5 years plan.
http://blogs.ridemetro.org/blogs/wri...-Deadline.aspx

[citruspastels]

soooo jealous. seattle's transportation is its tragic downfall. i can't believe the amount of time we waste debating the subject.

[taiwanesedrummer36]

Where's UrbanBen when you need him?

Maybe we should be more like Vancouver's Translink, where they don't care about the vote of the people (not saying that the idea of democracy is a bad thing, it's just bad in terms of fixing transportation in Seattle). They got the tunneling through Downtown Vancouver pretty fast, I believe also using a boring-machine, plus they also had to tunnel through False Creek.

[Tcmetro]

Here is what I think the priorities are:

Phase 2: North Link, South Link, East Link
Phase 3: Snohomish Link, 520 Link, West Seattle (via White Center, Burien). Second Subway in Downtown, Renton Extension via Skyway
Phase 4: Ballard Link, Crosstown Subway (between Beacon Hill and Capitol Hill), Issaquah Link
Phase 5: Marysville or Edmunds Link, Ballard-U Dist Subway, Lakewood/DuPont Link
Phase 6: Sounder South LINK Conversion, Sounder East Link Conversion, Lake City Way Link, Mid Link (Express via Georgetown and South Park, to reduce conjestion on the MLK Line)

[kub86]

Where does Translink funding come from? Could Translink raise taxes without a vote?

I remember someone saying there's not enough in Seattle money to construct both a W. Seattle and a Ballard line at the same time. I have no idea which one is needed more??

[taiwanesedrummer36]

Originally Posted by kub86

Where does Translink funding come from? Could Translink raise taxes without a vote?

I remember someone saying there's not enough in Seattle money to construct both a W. Seattle and a Ballard line at the same time. I have no idea which one is needed more??

It's hard to say; both West Seattle and Ballard have only one way into Seattle, mainly a congested bridge. West Seattle has residents and commuters from the Southworth/Vashon Island ferry, while Ballard just has residents (with a lot more to come). Maybe flipping a coin will help...

[clooless]

Originally Posted by kub86

Where does Translink funding come from? Could Translink raise taxes without a vote?

Yes. Translink has the power to raise fuel taxes, property taxes, set parking taxes and set tolls on all but provincial highways within Translink's jurisdiction without specific public authorization. There was a planned vehicle registration tax, like the car tab tax debacle Seattle went through, but that was scrapped by the province.

Unlike most cities in the U.S., cities and municipalities in Canada have taxation powers that are specifically limited to collecting some form of property tax (thank god). Translink was only authorized to raise specific taxes by the provincial government because like all cities in B.C., they would otherwise only be able to levy property tax.

I won't go into the politics of recent administrative changes to Translink that were made by the province, largely in response to Tranlink's waffling over the approval of the Richmond-Airport-Vancouver rapid transit line, but there are obvious advantages to this system over taking every issue and major project to a referendum (and obvious disadvantages).

[jam5]

Originally Posted by Tcmetro

Here is what I think the priorities are:

Phase 2: North Link, South Link, East Link
Phase 3: Snohomish Link, 520 Link, West Seattle (via White Center, Burien). Second Subway in Downtown, Renton Extension via Skyway

What do you mean by a Second Subway? Do you mean connecting between Queen Anne and Ballard, before connecting with the existing tunnel?

Phase 4: Ballard Link, Crosstown Subway (between Beacon Hill and Capitol Hill), Issaquah Link
Phase 5: Marysville or Edmunds Link, Ballard-U Dist Subway, Lakewood/DuPont Link
Phase 6: Sounder South LINK Conversion, Sounder East Link Conversion, Lake City Way Link, Mid Link (Express via Georgetown and South Park, to reduce conjestion on the MLK Line)

Conversion to what? Double-tracking the Sounder line, or converting from Sounder to light-rail?

[Tcmetro]

For the Second Subway in Downtown, there would have to be another subway, on another street or below the existing one on 3rd Ave, because there would be too many trains entering if the system is extended beyond Phase 2. The Souder conversions as I see them, would use EMU's and tracks would be rerouted to conect into Link. This could mean a connection into the downtown tunnel from King Street Station, and the East Sounder could connect into the Downtown Bellevue light rail line, to provide better access to Downtown Bellevue.

[uwhuskies]

More money and jobs for those with a vested interest may be the answer. Ever wonder why Sound Transit did not appear to have a sense of urgency to build the Link rail project until there was political discussions in the media regarding whether or not to cancel the project? When Sound Transit officials felt that the project could be cancelled, many politicians both local and congressional stepped in to make promises that suddenly the project would commence within a matter of months. Until the threat of cancellation, Sound Transit was content with endless studies and community meetings. It appears that many civic projects such as Sound Transit and even the Seattle Monorail project are designed to pay back supporters with lucrative contracts and keep stakeholders employed with hefty salaries as long as possible (if the project is finished, then their high-paying jobs are also finished).

[taiwanesedrummer36]

Either way, we really suck.

[citruspastels]

yeah i'm REALLY sick of the lack of light rail progress. everyone knows we need one. i think what uwhuskies is saying may have some truth. they know we need it and could very well be sucking us dry for it.

[Bond James Bond]

I think the major reason why the Link is being built so slowly is because . . . . that's what the voters wanted. If I recall correctly, it wasn't until the 2nd or 3rd time on the ballot that Sound Transit was finally approved. The first one or two times it was too big, ambitious and expensive, and thus was voted down.

[WaTransportation]

Ah, I'm a first time poster, new on the blog scene and full of information regarding transit.

First Answer - The tunneling projects takes such a long time because the Tunnel Boring Machines are only capable of 25 to 50 feet a day. We currently have one TBM that is finishing the last 120 feet of the Beacon Hill Tunnel, the first tunnel was completed in June 2007. As far as my knowledge extends, there is not a TBM capable of boring anything faster. Our TBM's also put up the wall and flooring while boring so the entire process is pretty automatic.

Sounder between Seattle and Everett at this point in time is restricted to 4 trains per day. 90% of the track is double track excluding 4 sections, 5 if you want to include the tunnel under Downtown Everett but the restriction is such that it does cause a delay to freight traffic. They are also on a time schedule just as much as we passengers are but delays cause them millions vs a few minutes out of our daily lifes.

After the track and signal improvements are completed in 2012/2013, Sound Transit will be allowed 6 trains per day and until funding can be acquired for the second tunnel through Everett, that is where it will remain. The projects right now is Double Tracking the four 1 mile segments that are currently single track. MP 3-5.6(Interbay), MP 7-8(Golden Gardens/Blue Ridge), MP 17-18(Edmonds), MP 27-28(Mukilteo), and Everett tunnel. If the new tunnel is approved, it would take 8 to 12 months to build the tunnel, lay rail from Everett Jct up to the Tunnel and connect it to the mainline on the other side. ST would have to build additional storage tracks at Everett for the additional trains were added. September 2008 will add an additional North Sounder.

Sounder to Seattle - Tacoma track and signal improvements are just about finished with the last 1.2 mile segment starting construction in 2008. 3 more Seattle - Tacoma trains will start up and also a possible reverse commute that would be the first "full corridor" train, meaning it would serve Tacoma/Lakewood to Everett as one train. WSDOT has an option (not Sound Transit) to add a third main from James Street in Kent to Pacific at Ellingson (South Auburn) This would in effect add 3 main tracks between King Street Station in Seattle to South Auburn.

Anywho, I have a ton more information I go more in-depth on in my blog. I also post monthly updates of the Central Link Light-Rail construction Check it out at http://watransportation.blogspot.com

P.S. The question regarding Sounder in the Mukilteo picture - That is correct since cab control cars lead going Northbound and locomotives lead going South.

[taiwanesedrummer36]

Whoa wait! There actually is a plan to build/expand a rail tunnel through Downtown Everett?

Good to hear that we're (at least) starting to promote rail in a car-centered Seattle.

[WaTransportation]

I'll add on a couple of items about the Eastside.

The only way anybody is going to get the Eastside would be a private investor, such as the recently revealed Tom Payne. If the rail is torn out, it would never, I repeat in earnest, never be reinstalled. Tom Payne has already announced it could run 6 trains in the morning in the return in the evening.

Sound Transit will never take over the corridor because of being set up with Ron Sims. With this said, after the investor has put the time and effort into the Eastside, Sound Transit could say they want to buy the corridor and operating rights.

Realistically as it stands now, the ST 550 does a perfect job of going to and from Bellevue but as Tacoma proved, Rail has a higher influence on passengers than said buses.

[WaTransportation]

Originally Posted by taiwanesedrummer36

Whoa wait! There actually is a plan to build/expand a rail tunnel through Downtown Everett?

Good to hear that we're (at least) starting to promote rail in a car-centered Seattle.

Yeah but it wouldn't happen anytime soon unfortunately. If on the Everett Station side you can see the additional track there that would be the future rail line.

The only thing that would need to be built up is the Tunnel down past the old station to Everett Jct which would allow to double track up the hill.

[CityView Jim]

Welcome WaTransportation!

Just doing quick math. The tunnel through Capitol Hill will be no longer than 3 miles. At the minimum rate you mentioned and digging twin tunnels like Beacon Hill, it would take about a little over 4 years (assuming a 5 day work week).

I know I've simplified, but its a far cry from that currently estimated.

EXCELLENT INFO THOUGH!!! I'll read your blog.

[mike0898]

WATransportation, welcome to the board!

I just went to your blog and think it's EXCELLENT! Anyone who has any interest in Seattle transportation issues would enjoy it; check it out for yourself.