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Old October 13th, 2014, 02:19 AM   #1341
csd
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Eh what now? You're joking, right? It's a tunnel operations car! And I'm not from London.
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Old October 13th, 2014, 01:25 PM   #1342
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Looks like an ARU vehicle
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Old October 13th, 2014, 02:55 PM   #1343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by verreme View Post
Aren't there any plans to close M50? I recall reading about it on Wikipedia.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sponge_bob View Post
God No, the country would collapse within a week.
Sponge, I think he meant "close the loop" i.e. build the Dublin Port - Sandyford stretch.
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Old October 13th, 2014, 03:12 PM   #1344
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sponge_bob View Post
Looks like an ARU vehicle
Nah, that's a Focus. The ARU boys have Volvo XC70s!

/csd
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Old October 13th, 2014, 03:29 PM   #1345
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spacetweek View Post
Sponge, I think he meant "close the loop" i.e. build the Dublin Port - Sandyford stretch.
That will never happen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by csd
Nah, that's a Focus. The ARU boys have Volvo XC70s!
Thought it was a V50 myself but yes you are right. It would be a good spot for a permanent ARU encampment given that Darndale and Coolock and Ballymun are within a quick rev up.
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Old October 13th, 2014, 06:12 PM   #1346
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That will never happen.
Is a tunnel really that inconceivable? The M50 will be at breaking point once the M11 is completed to the south, and the only other sensible alternative would be to build a route from around Naas to somewhere north of Swords.

I know the wealthy southsiders won't be so keen on a tunnel, but I don't see much of an alternative. Having said this, the Port Tunnel always seemed like it stopped short of being useful - why wasn't a spur built to the other side of the Liffey?
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Old October 13th, 2014, 09:01 PM   #1347
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Half the legal profession in the country is along that route, the whinging and the nimbyism will simply be too much to bear. Remember how long it took to finish the dual carriageway in Foxrock to an acceptable standard???? 40 years was it??? They have been on about the eastern bypass since the early 1980s or so.

And then, for luck, half the bloody greens in Ireland live in that part of the world too.

Remember the €300m odd already spent on an incinerator that does not even exist yet in that self same part of the city ..thanks to all the nonsense these people came up with. Interminable reports commissioned from their various consultant mates, green and legal both.

It will never happen, in any form, in my lifetime. Nobody has the stomach to spend the inevitable €1.5bn+ that the motorway would cost.
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Old October 14th, 2014, 12:31 PM   #1348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spacetweek View Post
Sponge, I think he meant "close the loop" i.e. build the Dublin Port - Sandyford stretch.
Yup that's what I meant -I don't think closing the road to all traffic would be a good idea .

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Half the legal profession in the country is along that route, the whinging and the nimbyism will simply be too much to bear. Remember how long it took to finish the dual carriageway in Foxrock to an acceptable standard???? 40 years was it??? They have been on about the eastern bypass since the early 1980s or so.

And then, for luck, half the bloody greens in Ireland live in that part of the world too.

Remember the €300m odd already spent on an incinerator that does not even exist yet in that self same part of the city ..thanks to all the nonsense these people came up with. Interminable reports commissioned from their various consultant mates, green and legal both.

It will never happen, in any form, in my lifetime. Nobody has the stomach to spend the inevitable €1.5bn+ that the motorway would cost.
Wow. I'm sorry for you guys. The M50 looks built to cope with heavy traffic anyway. There are auxiliary lanes between most junctions, so it's more like 4+4 instead of 3+3. And interchanges are neatly designed. In my city we have the same traffic (150,000+ vehicles per day) in a 3+3 urban expressway with non-existant acceleration lanes nor shoulders -and there are no plans to do anything about it.
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Old October 16th, 2014, 07:52 PM   #1349
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M50 - possible future developments

Folks,

There are a number of possible traffic and demand management measures that could be put in place to alleviate congestion on the M50. A report was published outlining these, and is available from the NRA's website here.

There is no appetite for further lane additions, so other measures are instead considered. These include:

  • Additional tolling points
  • Better information to users via VMS, web, and SMS
  • Variable speed limits
See the report for full details. The decision as to which ones will be implemented will be political, as any extra tolls won't be popular!

On the question of the Eastern Bypass, a 2007 feasibility study concluded:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Feasibility Study
Substantial work has been completed in examining and assessing possible solutions for, and implications of, the development of an Eastern Bypass. Arising from the studies undertaken, it can be concluded that the provision of an Eastern Bypass would be:
  • Technically feasible, with three viable route options identified;
  • Economically viable, with benefits which are more than twice the costs, and
  • Strategically beneficial to both the City and the Region.
However, given the state of the country's finances, it was recommended that scheme would not go ahead in the short term, but the alignment be protected. Two reports here outline the current status of the protected corridors.

The feasibility study appears to have been removed from the NRA website, but I have a copy; if anyone wants it PM me your email address and I'll send it.

/csd
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Old October 16th, 2014, 08:13 PM   #1350
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Is there any ramp metering on M50?
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Old October 16th, 2014, 08:15 PM   #1351
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Dublin Eastern bypass route

The southern section of the proposed Eastern bypass looks like this (purple is overground, yellow is tunnel):

Eastern bypass southern section by csd75, on Flickr

The reservation is quite obvious while driving. For example, looking south towards the M50 from the existing road at the "I" of Stillorgan Industrial Park looks like this. Further south, closer to the existing M50 and immediately west of Sandyford Industrial Estate looks like this. Here in particular there is plenty of room to the right (west) of the existing dual carriageway, which would be needed for junction slips.

It gets pretty tight near UCD (University College Dublin), but it all looks doable from an engineering perspective. However, as Sponge Bob alluded to, the section between Goatstown and the R138 (former N11) is likely to generate significant objections from local, well-connected residents.

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Old October 16th, 2014, 08:23 PM   #1352
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Is there any ramp metering on M50?
There are signals installed here and here near the northern portals of the Dublin Port Tunnel. These are designed to allow unimpeded exit from the tunnel in the event of an emergency, by controlling the flow of traffic onto the M50 mainline from adjacent local access roads.

I've only ever heard of them being used once. It certainly doesn't seem to be a regular traffic management feature as far as I know.

Apart from these, there are no other ramp metering signals on the M50, or indeed any other Irish motorway I'm aware of. There were proposals to install them on the M11 southbound access at junction 5, but these were never followed through.

/csd
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Old October 16th, 2014, 08:43 PM   #1353
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Apart from these, there are no other ramp metering signals on the M50, or indeed any other Irish motorway I'm aware of.
They aren't very popular in Britain or Ireland.

Certainly a trial scheme on the M3/M27 in England failed to do much other than make the congestion on the local road network in Eastleigh worse, so was discontinued. A couple of other locations have tried it without success too, IIRC.
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Old October 16th, 2014, 08:51 PM   #1354
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I wouldn't expect much congestion relief of ITS measures. Variable speed limits are nice, but do not materially reduce congestion. Additional tolling is just a way to cash in on the shortcomings of infrastructure.
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Old October 16th, 2014, 10:55 PM   #1355
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Currently a low volume 'outer ring' is being built around 3km outside the M50 and in small stages.

It is a roundabout ridden mess with half the road given over to buslanes though and is probably 10 years away from completion. I think an M49 will have to be built around 12km outside the M50 from Kill to south of Balbriggan via Celbridge and Dunboyne ....in the end.

The 2010 era Outer Orbital is too far out ( another 20km at least) to provide redundancy for the M50 or to facilitate rerouting. As for a real outer orbital they should complete the upgrade of the N52 and N80 to a proper standard ( mainly as 1+1) ....they are pretty dismal goat tracks in spots nowadays with only the central bit done to modern standards overall.

As a southern section of an M49 from say 7 o clock to 5 o clock an outer ring is not feasible as there are mountains/protected areas along there.

The tunnel shown by CSD in yellow would come up on a beach by the way and the missing link would be built N from there on the beach to howls and screams by the Nutjobrati.
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Old October 17th, 2014, 05:10 PM   #1356
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Amongst many other issues, the Eastern Bypass segment from Goatstown to the M50 could not be an online upgrade - the existing road would still be needed for non-motorway traffic. And it would be impossible to make a freeflow junction with the new road and the existing M50 at Sandyford as the Sandyford junction is already highly complex.

It's also unclear if the part through UCD would be at-grade, severing a strip off the southern part of the university campus, or elevated. Unlikely to be elevated due to bad experience abroad with these.

Generally , I'd say it's a pipe dream and runs counter to moves to make the city more public transport-oriented.

The "M49" proposal sounds far more useful and realistic. As for the "Outer Ring Road", this is merely a distributor and can't be seen as any kind of rival to the M50.
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http://www.irishmotorwayinfo.com/inex/roads/futures
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Old October 17th, 2014, 08:26 PM   #1357
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spacetweek View Post
Amongst many other issues, the Eastern Bypass segment from Goatstown to the M50 could not be an online upgrade - the existing road would still be needed for non-motorway traffic. And it would be impossible to make a freeflow junction with the new road and the existing M50 at Sandyford as the Sandyford junction is already highly complex.

It's also unclear if the part through UCD would be at-grade, severing a strip off the southern part of the university campus, or elevated. Unlikely to be elevated due to bad experience abroad with these.
The feasibility study has the proposed alignment in a cutting between the M50 and Booterstown, with a 1 km cut and cover tunnel under the Luas line near Kilmacud, and another tunnel between St Helen's and the coast.

The alignment in UCD is supposedly protected for the cutting and tunnel portals.

Quote:
Generally , I'd say it's a pipe dream and runs counter to moves to make the city more public transport-oriented.
Probably true!

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Old October 20th, 2014, 01:49 AM   #1358
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Hi guys.
I have question about the signage of the offline motorway service areas.

Particularly the newly opened Birdhill Service Area just off the junction 27 on the M7 and the service area in Mayfield just off the junction 14, also on the M7.

Are they clearly signed on the motorway? Or, as they are not official NRA areas, do you have to simply know about their existence?

Oh and the same question about the one on M11 near Wicklow.

Is there any official policy for such developments?
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Old October 20th, 2014, 02:54 AM   #1359
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They are signed periodically (and well in advance) and at at their junctions. The signage is less prominent than for official rest areas with their own off and on ramps.

On the M7 from Limerick to Portlaoise there are two offline services recently built and one through planning near Birdhill so I would question the business logic somewhat but on the Long run from Enfield to Galway the offline services signed are preexisting ones along the old N6 mainly and the last time I was at this one it was heaving with customers late on a sunday evening.

It is only 500m off the motorway. I have come across Online services hidden in a forest at a greater distance from 'their' motorways in Europe.

There is a great website ( and apps) for finding them, pumps.ie > http://www.pumps.ie/
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Old October 20th, 2014, 03:31 PM   #1360
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Quote:
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They are signed periodically (and well in advance) and at at their junctions. The signage is less prominent than for official rest areas with their own off and on ramps.
Any chance of photos of that signage?

I'm just curious how is it solved in Ireland.

Oh, and question about recently upgraded grade separated junctions on Cork's Southern Ring Road.
Are all the works finished? I'll be driving there in a few weeks. Any delays or problems in that location?
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