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Old March 23rd, 2015, 04:45 PM   #1401
csd
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Originally Posted by Kanadzie View Post
It's reasonable, numerical limits on such roads (well I would argue, on any road) are silly

but I think the use of the "end all restrictions" when a numerical limit is still legally in force is a bad / confusing idea, you just give drivers confusion.
Ah, but in Ireland the sign doesn't mean "end all restrictions", it means "rural speed limit applies"!

/csd
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Old April 2nd, 2015, 04:02 AM   #1402
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How is it now with the Athlone bypass? Is it still called N6 or have they renamed it to M6 now? And why not have motorwy sign on Athlone bypass? It is motorway standard there.
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Old April 2nd, 2015, 03:39 PM   #1403
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How is it now with the Athlone bypass? Is it still called N6 or have they renamed it to M6 now? And why not have motorwy sign on Athlone bypass? It is motorway standard there.
It is not motorway standard because the curves are too tight on the mainline. So it is still N6.
However all other features of the road are motorway standard.
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Old April 2nd, 2015, 06:45 PM   #1404
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It is not motorway standard because the curves are too tight on the mainline. So it is still N6.
However all other features of the road are motorway standard.
I know the Athlone bypass is older than the rest om the M6. But when did they built the Athlone bypass?

And I think Athlone bypass looks like it was meant to be a part of a longer motorway/dual carriageway from the begin. But it took some years before the really built the rest om M6.
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Old April 2nd, 2015, 09:05 PM   #1405
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I know the Athlone bypass is older than the rest om the M6. But when did they built the Athlone bypass?.
1990, and it was not planned as other than a 2+2 standalone. They were still improving the N6 east and west of Athlone as 1+1 up to the late 1990s ( early 1990s near Moate and late 1990s west of Aughrim) .

In 2000 the plan to replace the 1+1 with 2+2 from Galway to Dublin by 2006 was announced. After this the remaining grossly substandard sections of N6 ( c.25km of it, mainly west of Kinnegad ) were then left as they are today.

This 2+2 Galway - Dublin was finally delivered in early 2010 and a mid life rebuild of the Athlone Bypass was undertaken in 2011 and 2012 to make the road a tad more suitable for 100kph running, especially at the corner east of the bridge. It cannot be upgraded to 120kph motorway unless they fully rebuild some junctions and close at least one.

But it was never originally designed as a part of a greater 2+2 plan....there was no bloody plan in Ireland in the 1980s as we were bankrupt at the time.

HTH.
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Old April 19th, 2015, 05:01 AM   #1406
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1990, and it was not planned as other than a 2+2 standalone. They were still improving the N6 east and west of Athlone as 1+1 up to the late 1990s ( early 1990s near Moate and late 1990s west of Aughrim) .

In 2000 the plan to replace the 1+1 with 2+2 from Galway to Dublin by 2006 was announced. After this the remaining grossly substandard sections of N6 ( c.25km of it, mainly west of Kinnegad ) were then left as they are today.

This 2+2 Galway - Dublin was finally delivered in early 2010 and a mid life rebuild of the Athlone Bypass was undertaken in 2011 and 2012 to make the road a tad more suitable for 100kph running, especially at the corner east of the bridge. It cannot be upgraded to 120kph motorway unless they fully rebuild some junctions and close at least one.

But it was never originally designed as a part of a greater 2+2 plan....there was no bloody plan in Ireland in the 1980s as we were bankrupt at the time.

HTH.
That was interesting! Athlone Bypass looks to me older than from 1990. It looks more like a road from the 1970s or possibly the 1980s. I think Athlone Bypass looks like an old bypass in Sweden built around 1975.

In Sweden they built roads like Athlone bypass in the 1970s around several cities. But the difference was that these short sections actually was signed as motorways, even though they were identical to the Athlone bypass. Many years later they built the new long motorways that was built up with these old short sections in exactly the same way as the Athlone bypass became part M6. But because these old episodes had motorway signs long since, today it is quite difficult to see which part of the motorways in Sweden that that looked like Athlone bypass
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Old April 20th, 2015, 02:49 PM   #1407
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This video is quite interesting. When they were extending the Athlone Bypass to the west with the M6, they had to demolish the old dual carriageway bridge over the railway line at Monksland. This bridge actually consisted of 3 bridges - an old 19th Century stone arch bridge, a newer part from the 1960s when they modernised the road but it was still single carriageway, and the part from 1991 when they widened the road to a dual carriageway. All this is gone now as the road follows a different alignment.

To fix Athlone Bypass to make it a motorway you could not remove the curves (but could leave a 100 km/h speed limit) but you could add the missing frontage roads and close the junctions with minor roads.
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Old April 28th, 2015, 01:03 AM   #1408
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This video is quite interesting. When they were extending the Athlone Bypass to the west with the M6, they had to demolish the old dual carriageway bridge over the railway line at Monksland. This bridge actually consisted of 3 bridges - an old 19th Century stone arch bridge, a newer part from the 1960s when they modernised the road but it was still single carriageway, and the part from 1991 when they widened the road to a dual carriageway. All this is gone now as the road follows a different alignment.

To fix Athlone Bypass to make it a motorway you could not remove the curves (but could leave a 100 km/h speed limit) but you could add the missing frontage roads and close the junctions with minor roads.

Yes thats very interesting! They made a lot of work to made Athlone Bypass to be a part om M6

But I think its possible to sign the Athlone Bypass with motorway signs to. Just to have it a little bit slower speed on it. But in other countries there are many roads similar to Athlone Bypass with motorway signs. For example in Sweden it is like that
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Old April 28th, 2015, 02:18 AM   #1409
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It ain't feasible in Athlone The non motorway ( restricted) traffic would be routed through the single bridge and main street which is already congested with local traffic.

No new east-west capacity was added in the town since the bypass was built and the town itself has grown quite a bit since the bypass was built. 'M' designating the bypass would result in slurry tankers trundling along the main street and other unfortunate side effects.

Athlone was a horror before the bypass, one continual 10km long traffic jam. It is still a bit tight even with the bypass. Lets not look for a blue line on the map as we regulars don't mind slowing down for a few km. The rebuild in 2011/12 finally cambered the existing road for safe 100kph travel .....which was not a feature of the original bypass geometry not that Ireland knew anything about geometry in the 1980s or could afford to find out about it.

We finally learnt how to build proper 2+2 roads in the late 1990's....eg not that awful thing on the N4 east of Mullingar, designed in the mid/late 1990s and finally fixed in 2013.

Most future 2+2 roads in Ireland will be specifically built to the more 'modern' Swedish 2+2 100kph Expressway standard and with some Motorway thrown in there too. The rebuilt Athlone bypass is finally close to Swedish 2+2 but with a legacy hard shoulder.

Last edited by sponge_bob; April 28th, 2015 at 02:30 AM.
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Old April 29th, 2015, 03:24 AM   #1410
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It ain't feasible in Athlone The non motorway ( restricted) traffic would be routed through the single bridge and main street which is already congested with local traffic.

No new east-west capacity was added in the town since the bypass was built and the town itself has grown quite a bit since the bypass was built. 'M' designating the bypass would result in slurry tankers trundling along the main street and other unfortunate side effects.

Athlone was a horror before the bypass, one continual 10km long traffic jam. It is still a bit tight even with the bypass. Lets not look for a blue line on the map as we regulars don't mind slowing down for a few km. The rebuild in 2011/12 finally cambered the existing road for safe 100kph travel .....which was not a feature of the original bypass geometry not that Ireland knew anything about geometry in the 1980s or could afford to find out about it.

We finally learnt how to build proper 2+2 roads in the late 1990's....eg not that awful thing on the N4 east of Mullingar, designed in the mid/late 1990s and finally fixed in 2013.

Most future 2+2 roads in Ireland will be specifically built to the more 'modern' Swedish 2+2 100kph Expressway standard and with some Motorway thrown in there too. The rebuilt Athlone bypass is finally close to Swedish 2+2 but with a legacy hard shoulder.
Thank You! Now I understand. Its for the slow traffic they need to keep the Athlone bypass without motorway signs

We have a similar situation with a bridge at the eastern side outside of Stockholm in Sweden. There is a motorway called 222 or Värmdöleden. But there is a bridge at one place there, and the bridge is not signed like motorway. And its only the bridgem the rest of the road is signed like a motorway. And there is same reason at this bridge like the Athlone bypass. Look here:

https://www.google.se/maps/@59.31410...kc8w!2e0?hl=sv
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Old May 11th, 2015, 09:42 PM   #1411
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Does Limerick to Cork need a motorway? yes 94%
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Old May 12th, 2015, 01:43 AM   #1412
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Does Limerick to Cork need a motorway? yes 94%
The Cork Limerick motorway was cancelled or long fingered by the minister of Transport in order to free up funds for the 'essential' N5 Ballaghaderreen to Longford scheme which will serve the constituency of the junior Minister for Transport.

That scheme was given €1.5m for planning this year on top of a million last year.
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Old May 12th, 2015, 01:47 PM   #1413
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The Cork Limerick motorway was cancelled or long fingered by the minister of Transport in order to free up funds for the 'essential' N5 Ballaghaderreen to Longford scheme which will serve the constituency of the junior Minister for Transport.

That scheme was given €1.5m for planning this year on top of a million last year.
Not only is that scheme unimportant, I cannot believe they are routing it that way. It could have been shortened greatly by running Bdereen-Carrick instead.
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Old May 12th, 2015, 03:49 PM   #1414
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Not only is that scheme unimportant, I cannot believe they are routing it that way. It could have been shortened greatly by running Bdereen-Carrick instead.
I am entirely agreed, and with a 2+2 eastwards from Carrick to Mullingar pencilled in for a future date.

However it is important to Messrs Ring and Kenny ....far more so than a motorway from Cork to Limerick.

2 schemes have been commenced and completed on the N5 in the past 4 years alone, the remaining 2 schemes ( Longford - Ballaghaderreen and Turlough - Castlebar) are both in planning and are lined up for the shovel in late 2016 or 2017. Completion of those two schemes will bring the entire N5 to a very high standard.
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Old May 13th, 2015, 10:09 PM   #1415
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Honestly, I struggle to understand why improvements no the N5 are given so much priority over the N20/M20
Clearly the second road is much more important linking three largest urban areas in the Republic outside Dublin (Cork, Limerick and Galway)
This must be be priority in terms of motorways/dual carriageways construction in Ireland.
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Old May 14th, 2015, 02:10 AM   #1416
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The Prime Minister is thrown around on the leather seats in the back of the Merc S500 on the N5 every week....is why. The junior minister for Transport sometimes gets a lift with the boss and hears the complaints in real time.

The local politicians in Cork are busier groping each other in public (IN Parliament) than doing any work on the M20, sadly.

Last edited by sponge_bob; May 14th, 2015 at 02:20 AM.
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Old May 14th, 2015, 11:54 AM   #1417
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The Prime Minister is thrown around on the leather seats in the back of the Merc S500 on the N5 every week....is why. The junior minister for Transport sometimes gets a lift with the boss and hears the complaints in real time.

The local politicians in Cork are busier groping each other in public (IN Parliament) than doing any work on the M20, sadly.
To some degree that happens in most countries, powerful politicians push for some pork barrel for their districts. So I can understand some small bypasses here and there along the N5 (if, as you say, PM is from there) or a new school gym etc.
But omission of M20 in any planning process in near future is really striking. Especially if major improvements to the N5 can be founded. Planning process for the M20 can't cost that much money.
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Old May 14th, 2015, 01:07 PM   #1418
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. Planning process for the M20 can't cost that much money.
The M20 was fully planned and went to the public hearing which is the end of the planning process. It was pulled after the hearing but before the inspectors decision. .

That was 5 years ago. Now they have to start all over again at route selection

Had the inspector decided and published recommendations, and the road was clear through planning in 2011, the planning would probably have expired by now anyway.

http://www.independent.ie/regionals/...-27078515.html
http://croomnews.blogspot.ie/2010/07...merick_29.html
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Old May 14th, 2015, 02:40 PM   #1419
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The M20 was fully planned and went to the public hearing which is the end of the planning process. It was pulled after the hearing but before the inspectors decision. .

That was 5 years ago. Now they have to start all over again at route selection

Had the inspector decided and published recommendations, and the road was clear through planning in 2011, the planning would probably have expired by now anyway.

http://www.independent.ie/regionals/...-27078515.html
http://croomnews.blogspot.ie/2010/07...merick_29.html
Yes but for strategic infrastructure I think you can simply renew it anyway.
Not for non-strategic.
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Old May 14th, 2015, 04:19 PM   #1420
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The application was withdrawn in late 2011, after Varadkar cancelled it earlier this year. I'm afraid it needs to be started from scratch, hopefully I am wrong. Maybe they can reboot from the selected route corridor and update the policy framework and traffic changes in recent years.

http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/MA0010.htm
http://www.pleanala.ie/casenum/HA0027.htm

Had the inspector given a go ahead in 2011 the CPO order activates then and does have a finite shelf life and would have to be actioned in a few years or else it would expire, max 5 years comes to mind. But it never got to that.
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