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Wales / Cymru Cardiff, Swansea, Newport and the rest of Wales



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Old September 7th, 2007, 12:15 AM   #1
cardiff
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Lost architecture of Wales - and old photos

Ater spending bored hours at work i came across some pics of Cardiff that made me think of what we have lost due to progress, war and redevelopment. Now Cardiff was comparatively very luck at avoiding the bombs during WW2 but Swansea and other areas were not and i would love to have Swansea and other forumers post and discuss buildings / architecture lost over time.

Starting with what i know (Cardiff) here are some pics i found

Starting off with Queen street station, its interesting to note that it isnt much different to when there was a covered roof. It seems that it was only over platfroms 1 and 2 and with the removal of the grander entrance building as well we are left with a monstrosity (you can see it to the right of the pic) notice also the site of the CIA. Also notice a market square next to the building thats sainsburys central now.



the station





The old town hall on st marys street. Shame its gone and a nice building is in its place but it preservation would have meant we could apreciate the central market building more wiothout a shadow over it



These pics go to show the de-beautifying of buildings, look at the decoration that has been removed





the top of the arcade entrance is not here anymore



Notice the missing dome above what is now Travelodge and the bird sculptures are missing



and also in this pic the building next to the above is now a modern entrance to Travelodge



just goes to show how different the bay is now!!!!!



Apart from the building on the mermaid quay site this is a better view now IMO


Last edited by cardiff; September 7th, 2007 at 12:23 AM.
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Old September 7th, 2007, 12:33 AM   #2
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In this pic i like the old layout outside City hall, gives a more grand apearance. I also love the canal, just imagine how vibrant an area this could be now when looking at cities like Birmingham and Manchester

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Old September 7th, 2007, 12:37 AM   #3
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Look at what was lossed for the empty site that is now the glass needle (obviosly not for that reason). Looks like this was a time of large development in Cardiff as well. What is that grand building the western end of wood street bridge? Also the embankement looks really muddy like Newports is, i cant remember the embankment before the barrage, was it muddy?

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Old September 7th, 2007, 12:54 AM   #4
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great finds cardiff, and the first set you posted really show that if st mary st was preserved just that little bit better it could have been such a historic and nice street. I mean that dome above the now monstrous walkabout, liquid, travelodge etc was amazing and generally the buildings on st mary st seem to have been stripped of so much character and art...and lets not even get started on the old queen st station!
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Old September 7th, 2007, 12:57 AM   #5
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Another depressing thread

In a morbidly good way
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Old September 7th, 2007, 09:56 AM   #6
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Cardiff - I think the embankment was muddy up until they build the flood defenses in the 80's IIRC. If you go to Bute park, somewhere near where the glasshouses and the foot bridge are there was a plaque to comemorate the official opening or something.

Looking at Churchill way was interesting I always thought the builds where landmark place and BG are would of been more impressive - like the building on the corner by the Capitol Centre.
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Old September 7th, 2007, 11:48 AM   #7
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The decline and fall of St Mary St

The comparison with old photographs of St Mary St unfortunately seem to indicate that 'Progress is indeed a comfortable disease'.
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Old September 8th, 2007, 03:52 AM   #8
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It wasn't one dome on the top of the building. There were in fact two of them. It was such a tragedy that they were lost.

There is so much that was lost:

The canal down Churchill Way
The old Capitol theatre
The Greyfriars ruins that were demolished to make way for the Pearl Tower
The details on the street level of buildings on St Mary's Street is gone too
The old Synagogue on Park Place
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Old September 8th, 2007, 11:02 AM   #9
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Where was the old synagogue on Park Place then, as I can't think of any place apart from where the students union is?

If that was where it was then there is a kind of perverse irony there as a WW2 bomb was dropped on that site. Go to the Park Place entrance of the University's Main Building look above the entrance and you can still see the damage done by shrapnel from the bomb going off (hint the stone walls should be smooth).
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Old September 8th, 2007, 11:35 AM   #10
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I know there was a synagogue on Windsor Place - maybe thats what he means. There is useful information on Cardiff's Jewish community here:

http://www.jewishgen.org/JCR-uk/community/Cardiff.htm

No mention of Park Place.
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Old September 8th, 2007, 03:08 PM   #11
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It was Windsor Place. I'm getting my streets mixed up. My apologies.
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Old September 9th, 2007, 05:30 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cambo_Dai View Post
I know there was a synagogue on Windsor Place - maybe thats what he means. There is useful information on Cardiff's Jewish community here:

http://www.jewishgen.org/JCR-uk/community/Cardiff.htm

No mention of Park Place.
That's interesting - why has the Jewish population fallen so dramatically since the war?
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Old September 9th, 2007, 10:09 PM   #13
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As I understand it there are 3 reasons, in order of importance:

- moving to London/Manchester
- Low birth rates and inter-marriage
- Making Aliyah to Israel.

At one time the population was about 1.25% of the city's population, and there were talks of a Jewish day school being set up. But when Cardiff's economy turned downwards, the generally middle class and educated Jewish young people moved away following university. The community, even at its height, had a reputation as being a bit insular and not hugely integrated and many young Jews found this stifling and moved to London - where there were many more young Jews (e.g. to marry), but also more liberal and open communities.

Today, for instance, out of the 250 seat holders at Cardiff United Synagogue, something like 100 are over 70! But the community is 'hanging on', with 2 synagogues, a house for students, many clubs, and the JLGB - Jewish Lad's and Girls Brigade for their youngsters. They hope the upturn in the economy will attract more graduates to stay.
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Old September 10th, 2007, 12:24 AM   #14
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You forget a large part of it is the same reason for the decline of Christianity, people realising it's all a fairy story and giving up on religion. The number of people with Jewish blood has remained pretty steady in this country for a while now, while the number of Jews has dropped significantly.
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Old September 10th, 2007, 12:54 AM   #15
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In terms of "measurement" though, about 75% write Christian on the census forms. If we assumed that say 50 years ago something like 90% would, and if we assume (I think erroneously) that there has been a similar magnitude fall in ethnic Jews reporting their religion as such we'd only explain about 20% of the fall in Cardiff.

I've been interested in the early "immigrants" to Cardiff for a while; Jews, Italians, the Butetown 'mix, and the Irish. The "roots to Cardiff" exhibit they had a while ago at the Old Library was very interesting and I hope something similar becomes a permanent feature of the proposed Museum, showing the mix of peoples that made Cardiff what it is, and who continue to makes Wales capital much more than the pastiche of Welshness that it appears to be increasingly portrayed as, even by government.
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Old September 10th, 2007, 01:40 AM   #16
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People forget the relative cosmopolitanism of industrial South Wales in its heyday. I remember one of my old friends looking at 19th c. census records for a history project many years ago, telling me how surprised he was that the birthplaces of many residents of Morriston (now part of Swansea) were listed as Herefordshire or Gloucestershire. One book I have cites a figure of 63per cent of newcomers to Glamorgan and Monmouthshire in the 1880s being from 'non-border' English counties, a figure which must have increased in the peak immigration decade of 1900-1910.
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Old September 10th, 2007, 11:23 AM   #17
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And now the Valleys are perhaps the 'least' cosmopolitan - with places like the upper Rhondda being almost 95% Welsh-born. The South West and Midlands provided very much of Cardiff's population. Cardiff always remained "Welsh" but its only in the last 10 or 15 years that it has become resolutely proud of this.
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Old September 19th, 2007, 05:34 PM   #18
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oh how I wish the Newport Lyceum was still here.. *cries*, what a phenomenal building.
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Old September 19th, 2007, 05:51 PM   #19
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wow looks amazing! where in newport was it?
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Old September 19th, 2007, 07:37 PM   #20
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Yes, the Lyceum was definately one of the worst losses in Newport. I don't understand how, even in the 60's they didn't appreciate how excellent this building was.
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