daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Highways & Autobahns

Highways & Autobahns All about automobility



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old September 4th, 2010, 11:53 AM   #641
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,631
Likes (Received): 19427

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fender56 View Post
Yesterday, the Danish goverment presented a new plan, called "Denmark in better balance", which included two major upcomming road projects.

The first will be an extension of the A18 motorway from Herning to Holstebro, details so far not known.

And the other will be a new or upgrated road from Esbjerg to Tønder at the Danish/German border. This A11 could be a new motorway, according to the plan. The costs for the pre-studys will be 10 mio dkr, and will take approx one year.



By the way, as you're living in Esbjerg, I'm sure you've driven Primærrute 11 more than once. I have so too. It's a quiet route, for most sections traffic volumes barely exceed 5.000 vehicles per day, apart from some sections near towns, such as Tønder and Ribe.

I think a full motorway is probably not necessary. If I was in charge, I would make a more cost-efficient solution and build a grade-separated 2+1 road with 2+2 sections around larger towns (such as Ribe). This could save some significant amounts of money as a full-profile motorway tends to be much more expensive. You can build a 2+1 grade separated road for around € 3 - 5 million per kilometer in rural areas, while a motorway can easily top € 10 million per kilometer.

Overall this could save several hundred million euros, which could be used to widen parts of E45, for example between Kolding and Århus (I believe it's already planned).
ChrisZwolle está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old September 4th, 2010, 12:11 PM   #642
Fender56
Registered User
 
Fender56's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Esbjerg, Denmark
Posts: 1,376
Likes (Received): 528

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Do you have a link with more detailed information about this?
Yes, but it´s only in danish.:

http://www.stm.dk/multimedia/Danmark...bal_verden.pdf

__________________
Always look at the bright side of life....
Fender56 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 4th, 2010, 12:18 PM   #643
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,631
Likes (Received): 19427

Thanks, no problem, I understand the basics of written Danish.

This is also important:

Quote:
Igangsætte et forsøg med en hastighedsgrænse
på 90 km/t på en række landevejsstrækninger.
A trial of 90 km/h on country roads. It is 80 km/h now, right? If successful, it could be implemented throughout Denmark.

I really like how efficient road transport is in Denmark. You can get everywhere, and cities are not that anti-car, yet not as desolate as American car park city centers. They are still very attractive. A good balance imo.
ChrisZwolle está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old September 4th, 2010, 12:32 PM   #644
Fender56
Registered User
 
Fender56's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Esbjerg, Denmark
Posts: 1,376
Likes (Received): 528

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
By the way, as you're living in Esbjerg, I'm sure you've driven Primærrute 11 more than once. I have so too. It's a quiet route, for most sections traffic volumes barely exceed 5.000 vehicles per day, apart from some sections near towns, such as Tønder and Ribe.

I think a full motorway is probably not necessary. If I was in charge, I would make a more cost-efficient solution and build a grade-separated 2+1 road with 2+2 sections around larger towns (such as Ribe). This could save some significant amounts of money as a full-profile motorway tends to be much more expensive. You can build a 2+1 grade separated road for around € 3 - 5 million per kilometer in rural areas, while a motorway can easily top € 10 million per kilometer.

Overall this could save several hundred million euros, which could be used to widen parts of E45, for example between Kolding and Århus (I believe it's already planned).
Chris, you´re one among many who looks alone at the present traffic numbers. To understand this new upgrade of the A11, you have to see it in a bigger perspective.

1. The E45 from Kolding and towards south, has for along time been planned extended, from 4 lanes to 6. At the same costs, you can build a parallel highway instead.

2. In Denmark the present goverment, ruled by V and K, is having very big problems, holding their voters in Western-Denmark, due to low investments by the state and other things where they failed. So in an attempt to save their asses, they now comes up with plans like this.

3. A new bordercrossing A11 towards the Bundesstrasse 5, will guaranteed make a huge traffical jump from E45 to an upgraded A11/B5.!

4. Much of the present traffic from Western-Jutland, today is pressed towards the motorway around Vejle/Kolding, which allready is jammed daily. And why push more traffic towards East-Jutland, if a new A11/B5 can solve the problems, at the same costs as extending the E45.?

5. The Danish Minister of Traffic, where in the regional TV yesterday, and from what he said, its only a matter of time before this road is upgraded.

__________________
Always look at the bright side of life....
Fender56 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 4th, 2010, 12:41 PM   #645
Fender56
Registered User
 
Fender56's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Esbjerg, Denmark
Posts: 1,376
Likes (Received): 528

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Thanks, no problem, I understand the basics of written Danish.

This is also important:



A trial of 90 km/h on country roads. It is 80 km/h now, right? If successful, it could be implemented throughout Denmark.

I really like how efficient road transport is in Denmark. You can get everywhere, and cities are not that anti-car, yet not as desolate as American car park city centers. They are still very attractive. A good balance imo.
You know earlier they also planned this, but to go 90 km/t on ordinary country roads, the municipalities had to build bikers roads along such 90 km/t roads, and in these days, which kommune can afford such huge investments.?

I think they now will allow 90 km/t on these roads without the biker-roads, offcourse thats only my personal guess.!

__________________
Always look at the bright side of life....
Fender56 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 4th, 2010, 12:49 PM   #646
Fender56
Registered User
 
Fender56's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Esbjerg, Denmark
Posts: 1,376
Likes (Received): 528

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Overall this could save several hundred million euros, which could be used to widen parts of E45, for example between Kolding and Århus (I believe it's already planned).
No thats been cancelled, they now plan a paralel motorway along the A13 instead, which again can be build at the same costs.

__________________
Always look at the bright side of life....
Fender56 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 4th, 2010, 01:01 PM   #647
kalaha
Registered User
 
kalaha's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Copenhagen
Posts: 182
Likes (Received): 63

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
By the way, on August 27th, the last section of the Djurslandmotorvejen (PR15) opened north of Århus.

location:
And already the mayor of Favrskov Municipality complains, because citizens of the Hinnerup-Søften area has to drive an enormous detour to get on the new Djurslandmotorvej.



http://lokalavisen.dk/snoreklipning-...kler/708279767

What is unwritten, is the roundabout were originally planned to be futher west, and have access to the Djurslandmotorvej, but the old Hinnerup Municipality did not want to give up their expensive soil, which would be used to a new industrial area, and would be in hard competition with Århus Municipality's equivalent project at Lisbjerg Park. Now the soil cannot be sold due to the financial crisis, and they have discovered the long way they have to go, so now it is Vejdirektoratet's mistake?!?!
kalaha no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 4th, 2010, 02:19 PM   #648
mlm
Member #109
 
mlm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Herning, Denmark
Posts: 2,706
Likes (Received): 115

Time for an updated version of my little ongoing motorway map. It's getting a bit difficult with all the different proposals, so not sure everything is 100 %. I've devided the proposed motorways (without funding) into two parts, the red which seems pretty sure and the green which could end up both as motorway, "motortraficway", 1+2, or as nothing at all.



As for the red and green roads:
11: As discussed above, it could end up both as motorway or something "smaller". Really too early to say.
13: Very early in the process, until now just a prestudy has been made with 9 different lines, some as west as re-using some of the route 18 motorway, some a lot more east close to the current E45. Will take many years before anything is build here, if ever.
18: Extension of the "Midtjyske Motorvej / Route 18" from Herning to Holstebro. The government wants it, and funding needs to be found this fall. Is expected to be ready around the same time as a new big hospital is build in Herning (~2018-2020)
26: Major upgrade of the "Århus-Viborg" route 26. Looks like it will end up with motorway from E45 to the small town of Hammel, and the 1+2 the rest of the way to Viborg. Nothing finally decided though, so could end up different.
Western ring around Aalborg: New studies ungoing, there has been talk about this one for a long long time. Seems they can't agree on anything final.
23: Motorway from Route 21 all the way to Kalundborg. Studies ongoing, but I'm not really sure how far in the process they are.
mlm no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 4th, 2010, 03:33 PM   #649
kalaha
Registered User
 
kalaha's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Copenhagen
Posts: 182
Likes (Received): 63

Quote:
Originally Posted by mlm View Post
23: Motorway from Route 21 all the way to Kalundborg. Studies ongoing, but I'm not really sure how far in the process they are.
A VVM is ongoing for the piece around Regstrup, which is planned as motorway.

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/dokume...t&objno=208358

Last edited by kalaha; September 4th, 2010 at 06:41 PM.
kalaha no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 4th, 2010, 06:40 PM   #650
ABRob
Registered User
 
ABRob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: road-gap between Amsterdam and Berlin
Posts: 350
Likes (Received): 1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fender56 View Post
And the other will be a new or upgrated road from Esbjerg to Tønder at the Danish/German border. This A11 could be a new motorway, according to the plan. The costs for the pre-studys will be 10 mio dkr, and will take approx one year.
Nice.
There are also ideas in Germany to expand the A23 from Heide to the border.

In some maps I saw a planned motorway from Skive to Viborg. Has anyone ever heard of such a project?
ABRob no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 4th, 2010, 06:43 PM   #651
kalaha
Registered User
 
kalaha's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Copenhagen
Posts: 182
Likes (Received): 63

Quote:
Originally Posted by ABRob View Post
Nice.
There are also ideas in Germany to expand the A23 from Heide to the border.

In some maps I saw a planned motorway from Skive to Viborg. Has anyone ever heard of such a project?
There is a corridor reserved for a new road between Viborg and Skive, either as motorway or expressway ("motortrafikvej" in Danish). I don't think any planning are during yet.
kalaha no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 4th, 2010, 06:47 PM   #652
Fender56
Registered User
 
Fender56's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Esbjerg, Denmark
Posts: 1,376
Likes (Received): 528

Quote:
Originally Posted by ABRob View Post
Nice.
There are also ideas in Germany to expand the A23 from Heide to the border.

In some maps I saw a planned motorway from Skive to Viborg. Has anyone ever heard of such a project?
Hopefully the complete route B5/A11 from Heide to Esbjerg, will soon be 4 lane motorway.

The A26 from Skive to Viborg is still in the planning, and could be a 2 lane motortrafficway or a normal 4 lane motorway, nothing decided yet.:

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/dokume...nt&objno=74590

__________________
Always look at the bright side of life....
Fender56 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 6th, 2010, 03:25 PM   #653
Nikolaj
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 289
Likes (Received): 77

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fender56 View Post
Chris, you´re one among many who looks alone at the present traffic numbers. To understand this new upgrade of the A11, you have to see it in a bigger perspective.

1. The E45 from Kolding and towards south, has for along time been planned extended, from 4 lanes to 6. At the same costs, you can build a parallel highway instead.

2. In Denmark the present goverment, ruled by V and K, is having very big problems, holding their voters in Western-Denmark, due to low investments by the state and other things where they failed. So in an attempt to save their asses, they now comes up with plans like this.

3. A new bordercrossing A11 towards the Bundesstrasse 5, will guaranteed make a huge traffical jump from E45 to an upgraded A11/B5.!

4. Much of the present traffic from Western-Jutland, today is pressed towards the motorway around Vejle/Kolding, which allready is jammed daily. And why push more traffic towards East-Jutland, if a new A11/B5 can solve the problems, at the same costs as extending the E45.?

5. The Danish Minister of Traffic, where in the regional TV yesterday, and from what he said, its only a matter of time before this road is upgraded.

There is no plans to widen the E45 between Kolding and the Danish/German border, and there is no capacity problems on this section what-so-ever. This section only has a AADT between 18.000 (at the border) and 48.000 close to Kolding. Furthermore a screening analysis published by the Ministry of Transport on various options for a so-called Central Jutland motorway concluded that a new motorway from Esbjerg along the west coast to Tønder and the German border will not have any effect on the amount of traffic on E45 at all.

A new road/motorway Esbjerg-Tønder is a political project and not a project based on a real need and rational decisions.
Nikolaj está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old September 6th, 2010, 03:36 PM   #654
Nikolaj
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 289
Likes (Received): 77

Quote:
Originally Posted by mlm View Post
Time for an updated version of my little ongoing motorway map. It's getting a bit difficult with all the different proposals, so not sure everything is 100 %. I've devided the proposed motorways (without funding) into two parts, the red which seems pretty sure and the green which could end up both as motorway, "motortraficway", 1+2, or as nothing at all.



As for the red and green roads:
11: As discussed above, it could end up both as motorway or something "smaller". Really too early to say.
13: Very early in the process, until now just a prestudy has been made with 9 different lines, some as west as re-using some of the route 18 motorway, some a lot more east close to the current E45. Will take many years before anything is build here, if ever.
18: Extension of the "Midtjyske Motorvej / Route 18" from Herning to Holstebro. The government wants it, and funding needs to be found this fall. Is expected to be ready around the same time as a new big hospital is build in Herning (~2018-2020)
26: Major upgrade of the "Århus-Viborg" route 26. Looks like it will end up with motorway from E45 to the small town of Hammel, and the 1+2 the rest of the way to Viborg. Nothing finally decided though, so could end up different.
Western ring around Aalborg: New studies ungoing, there has been talk about this one for a long long time. Seems they can't agree on anything final.
23: Motorway from Route 21 all the way to Kalundborg. Studies ongoing, but I'm not really sure how far in the process they are.
You are missing the Ring 5 project from Helsingør/Nivå towards Køge which i also in planning/under discussion http://www.trm.dk/DA/Publikationer/2...dsområdet.ashx

On route 23 Holbæk to Kalundborg the first section is actally allready on its way. http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/dokume...t&objno=208358

The first section 6-7 km, which will be an upgrade of the current 4 lane expressway will be complete in 2012/13. On the next section around Regstrup an EIA (VVM) including detailed design is currently ongoing. For the remaining section from Regstrup to Kalundborg EIA and detailed design will be carried out between 2011-13.
Nikolaj está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old September 7th, 2010, 03:49 AM   #655
Asbjoern
Grave Architecture
 
Asbjoern's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Aarhus
Posts: 516
Likes (Received): 150

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fender56 View Post
Hopefully the complete route B5/A11 from Heide to Esbjerg, will soon be 4 lane motorway.
There's not enough traffic on route 11 for a full motorway extension and you know it too, Fender. It would be a pure waste of our collective money.

I think Nikolaj says it best:
Quote:
A new road/motorway Esbjerg-Tønder is a political project and not a project based on a real need and rational decisions.
Asbjoern no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 7th, 2010, 11:01 AM   #656
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,631
Likes (Received): 19427

Traffic volumes:
ChrisZwolle está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old September 28th, 2010, 01:43 PM   #657
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,631
Likes (Received): 19427

Overview of the new E45 - Sønderborg motorway, that is currently under construction and will be finished in 2012.


length = 26 km
lanes = 2x2
interchanges = 7
ChrisZwolle está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old September 28th, 2010, 07:02 PM   #658
metasmurf
Registered User
 
metasmurf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Umeå, Sweden
Posts: 374
Likes (Received): 555

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Traffic volumes:
Traffic volumes looks very suitable for a 2+1 road (2+2 around Ribe as you said), grade separated or partly grade separated.
metasmurf no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 17th, 2010, 07:06 PM   #659
Fender56
Registered User
 
Fender56's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Esbjerg, Denmark
Posts: 1,376
Likes (Received): 528

Today in the major SouthJutland newspaper JV.dk, you can see that the motorway Esbjerg-Tønder A11, is closer then ever.! In the negotiations for next years Danish state finances, the VVM trial for the motorway, is top priority to the Conservative party (goverment party). So that´s a good start, way faster than the most optimistic guess.

Article from JyskeVestkysten today sunday.: (Danish)

[IMG]http://i55.************/b8k008.jpg[/IMG]

__________________
Always look at the bright side of life....
Fender56 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old October 23rd, 2010, 01:42 PM   #660
Schnoor17
Rookie
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Horsens; Århus
Posts: 48
Likes (Received): 14

Found a few nice aerials from the construction of the motorway around Silkeborg on the website of Midtjyllands Avis
http://www.mja.dk/luftfotos_motorvej
Schnoor17 no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
legoland

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 10:37 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium