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Old October 24th, 2010, 09:00 PM   #661
Wallaroo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mlm View Post
Time for an updated version of my little ongoing motorway map. It's getting a bit difficult with all the different proposals, so not sure everything is 100 %. I've devided the proposed motorways (without funding) into two parts, the red which seems pretty sure and the green which could end up both as motorway, "motortraficway", 1+2, or as nothing at all.



As for the red and green roads:
11: As discussed above, it could end up both as motorway or something "smaller". Really too early to say.
13: Very early in the process, until now just a prestudy has been made with 9 different lines, some as west as re-using some of the route 18 motorway, some a lot more east close to the current E45. Will take many years before anything is build here, if ever.
18: Extension of the "Midtjyske Motorvej / Route 18" from Herning to Holstebro. The government wants it, and funding needs to be found this fall. Is expected to be ready around the same time as a new big hospital is build in Herning (~2018-2020)
26: Major upgrade of the "Århus-Viborg" route 26. Looks like it will end up with motorway from E45 to the small town of Hammel, and the 1+2 the rest of the way to Viborg. Nothing finally decided though, so could end up different.
Western ring around Aalborg: New studies ungoing, there has been talk about this one for a long long time. Seems they can't agree on anything final.
23: Motorway from Route 21 all the way to Kalundborg. Studies ongoing, but I'm not really sure how far in the process they are.
Many of these new motorways are idiotic projects, and the amount of traffic doesn't even call for motorways on many of those stretches. Its a waste of taxpayers money, and they should rather be spend on expanding existing motorways where it is actually needed. Especially Herning - Brande and Herning - Holstebro (both with less than 10.000 cars in 24 hours) does not have enough traffic to build a motorway, and it would be much smarter to simply expand the existing highways with an extra lane in each direction. I dont know of other countries where the politcians are dumb enough to build motorways where there is so little traffic.

In Germany they dont build new motorways unless the traffic is more than 25.000 cars per 24 hours - just to give an example.
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Old October 24th, 2010, 09:55 PM   #662
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Many of these new motorways are idiotic projects, and the amount of traffic doesn't even call for motorways on many of those stretches. Its a waste of taxpayers money, and they should rather be spend on expanding existing motorways where it is actually needed. Especially Herning - Brande and Herning - Holstebro (both with less than 10.000 cars in 24 hours) does not have enough traffic to build a motorway, and it would be much smarter to simply expand the existing highways with an extra lane in each direction. I dont know of other countries where the politcians are dumb enough to build motorways where there is so little traffic.

In Germany they dont build new motorways unless the traffic is more than 25.000 cars per 24 hours - just to give an example.
There's more than pure traffic volumes to construct a motorway. For example, travel times and traffic safety can be a big factor. If you build a motorway, travel times can be saved by a factor 2 compared to Primær- and Sekundærruten which travel through towns, villages, etc. Sure, building a road to 2+1 with new alignments is possible, but if motorway construction costs aren't too high (for example in the range of 75 million DKK per kilometer), it is not much more expensive to build a full motorway compared to a 2+1 grade-separated road on several new alignments.

Although 10.000 vehicles per day is not particularly much, it could be justified. Besides that, it is very uncommon to have regional roads topping out on 25.000 vehicles per day minimum. 10.000 vehicles through a town center is annoying, and 20.000 vehicles would mean near-constant congestion (roundabouts, pedestrian crossings, traffic lights, speed bumps etc), while 20.000 on a motorway would look as an empty road. You cannot just wait until the road hits 25.000 vehicles per day and build a motorway. You will have a traffic safety problem long before that, and also problems in towns and villages where such a road runs through.
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Old October 25th, 2010, 04:08 PM   #663
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wallaroo View Post
Many of these new motorways are idiotic projects, and the amount of traffic doesn't even call for motorways on many of those stretches. Its a waste of taxpayers money, and they should rather be spend on expanding existing motorways where it is actually needed. Especially Herning - Brande and Herning - Holstebro (both with less than 10.000 cars in 24 hours) does not have enough traffic to build a motorway, and it would be much smarter to simply expand the existing highways with an extra lane in each direction. I dont know of other countries where the politcians are dumb enough to build motorways where there is so little traffic.

In Germany they dont build new motorways unless the traffic is more than 25.000 cars per 24 hours - just to give an example.
That you in Germany, wait until the traffic numbers passes 25.000, is your problem. You see in Denmark, we are closing a lot of hospitals at the moment, to concentrate those in way bigger units, in the biggest towns.

This give us the need of better roads, like say motorways, to give the patients and ambulances minimum street time. On the present A-roads in Denmark you will meet around 15-20 roundabouts on a 50 km stretch, beside farm tractors and old women in their Opel Kadetts.

The difference from building a 2+1 road to a 2+2 motorway in flatland Denmark, is very small, we do not have your mountains, but just scrapes the earth aside, and build a motorway.

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Last edited by Fender56; October 25th, 2010 at 06:46 PM.
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Old October 28th, 2010, 01:47 PM   #664
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Question



Motortrafikvej Tavlen angiver vejstrækning, hvor de særlige regler om kørsel på motortrafikvej gælder.

1) Motortrafikvej is only the name of the signal
2) Motortrafikvej is the name of the signal and the name of a specific road

What's right?
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Old October 28th, 2010, 02:23 PM   #665
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucaf1 View Post
Question



Motortrafikvej Tavlen angiver vejstrækning, hvor de særlige regler om kørsel på motortrafikvej gælder.

1) Motortrafikvej is only the name of the signal
2) Motortrafikvej is the name of the signal and the name of a specific road

What's right?
I am not sure what is meant with "name of signal".

However when a specific stretch of road is signed as a "Motortrafikvej" (i.e. at the beginning of the stretch the blue sign, and at the end of the stretch the blue sign with a red diagonal) means that this specific road is designated as a "Motortrafikvej" and the specific rules and regulations apply.

In Denmark those rules and regulations are basically the same as for a Motorway: only motor vehicles that legally can drive 40 km/h are allowed, no stopping or turning are allowed etc.

It doesn't tell anything about the standard of the road. A "Motortrafikvej" can include anything from a 1+1 or 2+2 road with at level crossing or roundabouts, 1+1 or 2+1 or 2+2 without level crossings. Never "Motortrafikvej's" are primarily with a higher standardand less or no at level crossings.
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Old October 28th, 2010, 02:32 PM   #666
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Thanks; so maximum speed limit is 80 km/h ?
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Old October 28th, 2010, 02:38 PM   #667
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Thanks; so maximum speed limit is 80 km/h ?
The general (i.e. when not signed) speed limit on a Motortrafikvej is 80 km/h, but a lot of them has a signed max. speed of 90 km/h, primarily depending on the standard.

Signage on Motortrafikvej is the same as for a normal road, and not like the one at Motorways.
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Old November 5th, 2010, 04:26 PM   #668
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Aerial pictures of the new Kliplev - Sønderborg motorway construction by Vejdirektoratet. Taken in september 2010.

Does anybody know which number will be assigned to this motorway? Maybe it will just be Primærrute 41.











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Old November 5th, 2010, 04:33 PM   #669
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Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Aerial pictures of the new Kliplev - Sønderborg motorway construction by Vejdirektoratet. Taken in september 2010.

Does anybody know which number will be assigned to this motorway? Maybe it will just be Primærrute 41.
According to Vejdirektoratets publication "Statsvejnettet 2010" it will be a part of route 8. http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/pdf/st...nettet2010.pdf
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Old November 7th, 2010, 01:10 PM   #670
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Motorway Næstved-Rønnede Route 54

While the Danish government plans to build a motorway between Herning and Holstebro, the heavy traffic stops on Route 54 Rønnede road, between Næstved and Rønnede. The road has approx. 13,000 -15,000 cars per day, and that it's about 30% more traffic in between the two main towns of Jutland. On Route 54, which stretches between Næstved and Rønnede, there is need for a motorway, on which to help Næstved on the Danish motorway network and help traffic on main road between Næstved and Rønnede road which is the main connection from Næstved to Copenhagen.

Last edited by ADP; November 7th, 2010 at 01:28 PM.
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Old November 7th, 2010, 02:49 PM   #671
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While the Danish government plans to build a motorway between Herning and Holstebro, the heavy traffic stops on Route 54 Rønnede road, between Næstved and Rønnede. The road has approx. 13,000 -15,000 cars per day, and that it's about 30% more traffic in between the two main towns of Jutland. On Route 54, which stretches between Næstved and Rønnede, there is need for a motorway, on which to help Næstved on the Danish motorway network and help traffic on main road between Næstved and Rønnede road which is the main connection from Næstved to Copenhagen.
An extension of that road is allready planned.:

http://www.vejdirektoratet.dk/dokume...t&objno=256538

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Old November 7th, 2010, 03:26 PM   #672
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ADP View Post
While the Danish government plans to build a motorway between Herning and Holstebro, the heavy traffic stops on Route 54 Rønnede road, between Næstved and Rønnede. The road has approx. 13,000 -15,000 cars per day, and that it's about 30% more traffic in between the two main towns of Jutland. On Route 54, which stretches between Næstved and Rønnede, there is need for a motorway, on which to help Næstved on the Danish motorway network and help traffic on main road between Næstved and Rønnede road which is the main connection from Næstved to Copenhagen.
I think it will be a good idea to let a motorway to Næstved follow the Lille Syd railway's corridor via Haslev (maybe east of Haslev instead of west). This will make it a bit longer, but the travel time will be lower.
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Old November 7th, 2010, 05:35 PM   #673
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...Of course, everybody wants to visit Bon-Bon land
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Old November 9th, 2010, 10:02 AM   #674
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The new Holstebro motorway seem secured, and to open 2018, according to this.:

http://www.dagbladet-holstebro-strue...711089805/1384

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Old November 9th, 2010, 12:13 PM   #675
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The new Holstebro motorway seem secured, and to open 2018, according to this.:

http://www.dagbladet-holstebro-strue...711089805/1384

What a waste of money
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Old November 14th, 2010, 12:05 AM   #676
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The tunnel option has not been completely discarded for the Fehmarn crossing: http://tunneltalk.com/Femern-Crossin...omparisons.php

It would be 20 km long, made of immersed segments and for both railway and road. They suggest that it could be built without intermediate ventilation shafts.
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Old November 14th, 2010, 12:07 AM   #677
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So I've read.

I still think they should go for the bridge option because 1) bridges are generally less susceptible to significant cost overruns and 2) bridges are much safer for motorists.
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Old November 14th, 2010, 12:11 AM   #678
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The second point is absolutely true, as for the first, this is not a bored tunnel so it may have less geological problems.
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Old November 14th, 2010, 12:13 PM   #679
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I still think they should go for the bridge option because 1) bridges are generally less susceptible to significant cost overruns and 2) bridges are much safer for motorists.
Fully agrees. Imagine a fire in a truck container full of chemicals, where would you prefer to be, in a tunnel or on a bridge.?

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Old November 14th, 2010, 01:19 PM   #680
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Some drivers have significant claustrophibia when driving trough long tunnels, and long tunnel induses to sleep too. Altough there is issues with strong winds on a tall bridge i think most would prefer a bridge.
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