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Old April 30th, 2016, 04:59 AM   #1841
Blackraven
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MattiG View Post
Most probably such a bridge was approaching the end of its lifecycle anyway.
Makes sense

By the way, what's the average construction time for a bridge to such specification? And what would be the average cost?
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Old April 30th, 2016, 10:22 AM   #1842
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Denmark is a rich country (with lots of $$$) so they can easily build a new replacement bridge
You'd be surprised how some very rich countries seem to fail utterly in providing money for road projects. Just look at Switzerland, by most measures one of the richest countries in the world, but cannot come up with adequate funding for road projects. Everything is dragged out and delayed. Belgium is another example. It took Luxembourg 12 years to complete an 8 kilometer segment of A7.
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Old May 1st, 2016, 11:34 AM   #1843
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackraven View Post
Makes sense

By the way, what's the average construction time for a bridge to such specification? And what would be the average cost?
You are posting a hard question.

A bridge is rather a complex structure, and the price might be a function of hundreds of terms. Therefore, I am afraid there is no such meaningful thing as an average cost. The cost of similar bridges most probably vary by country, because the variations of the climate cause variations to the construction.

Typically, the cost is relative to the area of the bridge across similar bridges, because the cost of the material is the dominating factor.

As a rule thumb, the cost to build such a standard motorway bridge is about 1200 euro per square meter in Finland. The cost of the foundation is high in Finland due to the arctic conditions. The average cost in Denmark may be somewhat lower. (But not always. The comparison may turn upside down if the ground is challenging.) Thus the cost to build a bridge of 40 meters long and 10 meters wide is roughly half a million euro.

The time to construct varies a lot, too, and it depends on the type of the bridge. In Finland, the duration might be around 9 months: 2 months for the foundation, 2 months for the sheathing and iron fitting, 2-3 months to wait for the concrete to harden, and the remaining time for instrumentation, pavement and finalization.
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Old May 23rd, 2016, 09:57 AM   #1844
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A little update on Køge-bugt Motorway



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Old May 30th, 2016, 10:36 PM   #1845
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Femern

Major tunnel contracts have been signed for the Femern / Fehmarn Belt tunnel between Denmark and Germany.

http://femern.com/da/News-and-press-...kabsmeddelelse

It includes contracts for;

* the full length of the immersible tunnel
* the construction dock
* construction of tunnel portals (north & south)
* dredging and land reclamation works
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Old May 30th, 2016, 11:06 PM   #1846
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Femern

Press releases:
Boskalis signs EUR 300 million contract for Fehmarnbelt project

Today, Femern A/S, a subsidiary of the Danish state-owned Sund & Bælt Holding A/S, and the Fehmarn Belt Contractors joint venture, consisting of Royal Boskalis Westminster N.V. (Boskalis) and Van Oord, signed the previously announced contract related to the construction of the Fehmarnbelt Fixed Link. Boskalis' share of the contract is approximately EUR 300 million.

The contract is conditional to obtaining the outstanding environmental permits that have yet to be issued by the German authorities.

The activity scope for Boskalis together with Van Oord includes the dredging of a tunnel trench in the seabed over a distance of 16 kilometers. The dredged material will be reused to create a new recreational nature reserve area on the Danish side of the Fehmarnbelt. The joint venture will also construct a new working harbor where the tunnel contractors will construct a tunnel fabrication yard where the tunnel sections will be cast before being floated out to sea for installation.

http://boskalis.com/press/press-rele...t-project.html
More of the same:
Van Oord signs EUR 300 million contract for Fehmarnbelt project

Rotterdam, The Netherlands, 30 May 2016 - Today, Femern A/S, a subsidiary of the Danish state-owned Sund & Bælt Holding A/S, and the Fehmarn Belt Contractors joint venture, consisting of Van Oord and Boskalis, signed the previously announced contract related to the construction of the Fehmarnbelt Fixed Link. Van Oord’s share of the contract is approximately EUR 300 million.

The activity scope for Van Oord together with Boskalis includes the dredging of a tunnel trench in the seabed over a distance of 16 kilometres. The dredged material will be reused to create a new recreational nature reserve area on the Danish side of the Fehmarnbelt. The joint venture will also construct a new working harbour where the tunnel contractors will construct a tunnel fabrication yard where the tunnel sections will be cast before being floated out to sea for installation.

http://www.vanoord.com/news/2016-van...rnbelt-project
The Femern Link Contractors consortium secured three major contracts.
Signature of the contracts covering the world’s longest immersed road and rail tunnel

The Femern Link Contractors joint venture has signed today with the Danish government *contracts in Copenhagen for the design and build of the world’s longest immersed road and rail tunnel, the Fehmarnbelt link between Denmark and Germany.

The joint venture has won three contracts, two contracts covering construction of the immersed tunnel and the tunnel element factory that will manufacture the precast tunnel elements and a contract covering the building of the portal structures, toll buildings, bridges and ramps. The three contracts have a combined value of €3.4 billion.

https://www.vinci.com/vinci.nsf/en/p...60530-1755.htm
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Old May 31st, 2016, 11:06 AM   #1847
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If you're going to Berlin from Sweden, would Femern be faster then Trelleborg - Sassnitz?
And what about cost?
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Old May 31st, 2016, 12:16 PM   #1848
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Originally Posted by Mirror's Edge View Post
If you're going to Berlin from Sweden, would Femern be faster then Trelleborg - Sassnitz?
And what about cost?
The tunnels and bridges are not always about speed but being independent on timetables. There are only 1-2 daily departures on the T-S route.

The trip Malmö-Berlin under Fehmarn will be 2-3 hours faster than the ferry trip over Sassnitz when there is less traffic. (The crossing time is 4:15 hours plus harbor operations.) The cost of ferry varies a lot by season. Today, the ferry is most probably the cheapest selection, but not necessarily during July and August.
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Old May 31st, 2016, 12:17 PM   #1849
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Originally Posted by Mirror's Edge View Post
If you're going to Berlin from Sweden, would Femern be faster then Trelleborg - Sassnitz?
And what about cost?
Fehmarn meaning the Rödby-Puttgarden ferry is the best way if you go from Sweden to western europe.
Berlin is more to the east so I would choose the 4h Trelleborg-Sassnitz ferry.

In terms of costs the Trelleborg-Sassnitz ferry is the cheapest way of bringing your car from Sweden to the continent.

37EUR one way if you take 20.00 departure.


In terms of time I would drive Berlin-Rostock-Gedser-Copenhagen-Sweden.


Trelleborg harbour for those who dont drive through Denmark on their way to the continent.


The ferry takes 4hours.
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Old May 31st, 2016, 03:32 PM   #1850
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Femern

The official English press release by Femern A/S.
Femern A/S signs tunnel contracts worth DKK 30 billion

On 30 May 2016, Femern A/S signed four major construction contracts worth almost DKK 30 billion with the international contractor consortia that will be responsible for the construction of the 18 km Fehmarnbelt tunnel between Rødbyhavn and Puttgarden.

”We’re pleased that, after a number of years of preparation and a tendering process, contracts have now been signed with the winning contractor consortia. As a result, our prime focus is now on obtaining German approval, which is a condition for getting construction underway,” says CEO Claus F. Baunkjær, Femern A/S.

Certain contractors that were not awarded contracts lodged a complaint with the Danish Review Board for Public Procurement where the matter is currently being considered.

The four major contracts are worth a total of DKK 30 billion. A list of the winning consortia can be viewed here.
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Old May 31st, 2016, 04:04 PM   #1851
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NordikNerd View Post
Fehmarn meaning the Rödby-Puttgarden ferry is the best way if you go from Sweden to western europe.
Berlin is more to the east so I would choose the 4h Trelleborg-Sassnitz ferry.

In terms of costs the Trelleborg-Sassnitz ferry is the cheapest way of bringing your car from Sweden to the continent.

37EUR one way if you take 20.00 departure.


In terms of time I would drive Berlin-Rostock-Gedser-Copenhagen-Sweden.


Trelleborg harbour for those who dont drive through Denmark on their way to the continent.


The ferry takes 4hours.
The city is expanding the harbor by a lot and they are convinced there is a future for ferry traffic.
I believe the night ferry take longer time on purpose so truckers can use this time as "rest" and keep on trucking on arrival, if true this is an advantage to the bridge.
Maybe lower prices will also make the ferry an option, already Öresund is expensive as hell, just imagine the price at Femern.
And there is already and option with Bält bridge for the westward traffic, yet the traffic to TRBG is very strong.
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Old May 31st, 2016, 04:21 PM   #1852
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Have there been any estimates for the price of crossing via the Femern tunnel?
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Old May 31st, 2016, 04:47 PM   #1853
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An economic study in 2014 assumed € 65 for cars and € 276 for trucks.
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Old May 31st, 2016, 06:16 PM   #1854
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
An economic study in 2014 assumed € 65 for cars and € 276 for trucks.
Nothing will change pricewise on this route. Now the cheapest ferry ticket costs 67 € and it carries your car the 18km between Denmark and Germany while you relax and have your morning buffet.

I dont know any other ferry that is as expensive as Rödby-Puttgarden and the tunnel will not be much cheaper either.

Rödby-Puttgarden: 3.72 EUR/KM
Göteborg-Fredrikshavn: 0.77 EUR/KM
Trelleborg-Sassnitz: 0.46 EUR/KM
Ystad-Swinoujscie: 0.38 EUR/KM
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Old May 31st, 2016, 06:32 PM   #1855
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The cheapest tickets are € 67 during the week, but increase to near € 100 on more popular travel days (Fridays & weekends). However, more flexible or refundable tickets are more expensive.

The tunnel will always have the same toll prices, whether on a Monday afternoon or Saturday morning. There will probably be discounts for frequent users.

Scandlines stated they want to engage in a price war against the tunnel, but it remains to be seen how realistic this is after they lose a lot of business. A KPMG report indicated that Scandlines will operate at a loss once the tunnel opens, but it wasn't clear to me if they meant the entire company, or just this particular ferry route. Of course half of Scandlines revenue is from Bordershop.
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Old May 31st, 2016, 07:19 PM   #1856
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NordikNerd View Post
I dont know any other ferry that is as expensive as Rödby-Puttgarden and the tunnel will not be much cheaper either.

Rödby-Puttgarden: 3.72 EUR/KM
Göteborg-Fredrikshavn: 0.77 EUR/KM
Trelleborg-Sassnitz: 0.46 EUR/KM
Ystad-Swinoujscie: 0.38 EUR/KM
Except for Helsingør-Helsingborg ferry, regular ticket costs 51 EUR and its 5km distance so

Helsingør-Helsingborg 10.20 EUR/KM
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Old May 31st, 2016, 07:36 PM   #1857
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Rödby-Puttgarden

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
A KPMG report indicated that Scandlines will operate at a loss once the tunnel opens, but it wasn't clear to me if they meant the entire company, or just this particular ferry route. Of course half of Scandlines revenue is from Bordershop.
The tunnel will lead to many people losing their jobs. Staff on the ferries and also some of those working at the Bordershop in Puttgarden will have to find other jobs.

Scandlines gives away huge discounts for those who shop at Puttgarden bordershop. If you buy a oneday ticket and use all the available discount coupons you can travel with both ferries Helsingborg-Helsingör and Rödby-Puttgarden and back for as cheap as 29EUR, if you stay no more than 3 hours in Puttgarden.

The tunnel company will probably not give away any discounts for those who shop at the Bordershop, so I think that Puttgarden as a shopping centre will be less popular in the future.


Puttgarden bordershop in april 2012


Aboard the Rödby-Puttgarden ferry.

Last edited by NordikNerd; May 31st, 2016 at 08:02 PM.
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Old May 31st, 2016, 07:43 PM   #1858
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mirror's Edge View Post
I believe the night ferry take longer time on purpose so truckers can use this time as "rest" and keep on trucking on arrival, if true this is an advantage to the bridge.
The night departures on the Trelleborg-Sassnitz route take slightly shorter time than the day ones. They might be less popular, as it is inconvenient for most travelers to arrive in Trelleborg at 03:15 in the morning.

The popular truckers' route is Trelleborg-Travemünde. On this route, the trucks move 300 kilometers in 8 hours, while the drivers are enjoying their mandatory rest.
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Old May 31st, 2016, 07:47 PM   #1859
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Originally Posted by kapo311 View Post
Except for Helsingør-Helsingborg ferry, regular ticket costs 51 EUR and its 5km distance so

Helsingør-Helsingborg 10.20 EUR/KM
Yes it's really bad and it isolates us from Europe. Most swedish people stay in Sweden on their vacation or fly instead of driving aboard ridiculously expensive ferries.

Last edited by NordikNerd; May 31st, 2016 at 08:03 PM.
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Old May 31st, 2016, 07:49 PM   #1860
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Originally Posted by NordikNerd View Post

The bridge company will probably not give away any discounts for those who shop at the Bordershop, so I think that Puttgarden as a shopping centre will be less popular in the future.
Ever been to Flensburg? Massive shopping centers close to the border of Denmark. Big share of clients being Danes.

I am quite sure there will be border shops in Puttgarden in the future, too. I can see no reason why the shopping centers and the tunnel company would not co-operate.
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