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Old December 1st, 2015, 02:48 PM   #2641
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I'm guessing they think it'd be to expensive/disruptive to re-dig those tunnels. PLus they might somehow think Förbifarten will result in fewer cars there (even though that's not what happens when you build more motorways in a city).
Yes, probably the cost of re-building those two tunnels is the reason. Even with the E4 Förbifart Stockholm completed, Trafikverket calculates with more traffic on the "old E4" through Hagastaden than today so I guess the ques will remain. On the other hand, picking up the old idea of straightening E4 by building two new tunnels under Norra Begravningsparken and Karolinska (thus accessing Essingeleden directly) could solve the problem. However, that will never happen...
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Old December 1st, 2015, 03:07 PM   #2642
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Yes, probably the cost of re-building those two tunnels is the reason.

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Even with the E4 Förbifart Stockholm completed, Trafikverket calculates with more traffic on the "old E4" through Hagastaden than today so I guess the ques will remain.
Not "even with", rather "in part because". Induced demand effects mean that after a handful of years the queues on Essingeleden will be at least as bad and possibly worse than it would have been without Förbifarten. That's what the science of traffic planning tells us.

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On the other hand, picking up the old idea of straightening E4 by building two new tunnels under Norra Begravningsparken and Karolinska (thus accessing Essingeleden directly) could solve the problem. However, that will never happen...
IMO doing this would have more interesting effects than Förbifarten. Even better would be the Ulvsundadiagonalen option for Förbifarten. It was rejected due to too much tunneling. Then they but the other option fully under ground meaning it is now *more* tunneling than Ulvsundadiagoneln would have had. In other aspects the UD would have been better. The current plan is iditotic.
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Old December 2nd, 2015, 01:35 AM   #2643
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The current plan is iditotic.
They will get the world record for longest rural motorway tunnel though

One can only hope that a cataclysmic property bubble recession hit Sweden 2016-2020 and the stupid road will be killed with the mandatory buget cuts that follow.

Then hopefully a better solution will be choosen.
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Old December 2nd, 2015, 03:58 AM   #2644
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The Forbifarten is a great idea. A few years late, but great.
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Old December 4th, 2015, 07:37 PM   #2645
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A truck was blown over today on E6 north of Göteborg. There is a strong windstorm affecting northern Denmark and western Sweden.

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Old December 5th, 2015, 10:34 AM   #2646
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I've heard they considering renaming the R40 to E40 in the future and replace E20. Anyone who knows more about this?
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Old December 5th, 2015, 11:41 AM   #2647
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They can't name it E40 (or, rather, the UNECE will throw a hissy fit about that number). They could name it E261 or something, or reroute E20 and give another number (probably have to be 3-digit) to the current E20 route.

There's E47 and E55 that could be extended from Helsingborg. Or (while north of E22) make the E24 Birmingham-Cambridge-Ipswich...Goteburg-Jonkoping: no one will care about the lack of link to England, as no one cares about the route in England.
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Old December 5th, 2015, 11:53 AM   #2648
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They can't name it E40 (or, rather, the UNECE will throw a hissy fit about that number). They could name it E261 or something, or reroute E20 and give another number (probably have to be 3-digit) to the current E20 route.

There's E47 and E55 that could be extended from Helsingborg. Or (while north of E22) make the E24 Birmingham-Cambridge-Ipswich...Goteburg-Jonkoping: no one will care about the lack of link to England, as no one cares about the route in England.
Yeah, maybe they will reroute E20...Honestly, i've only heard this from untrusted sources but I dont know :p
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Old December 5th, 2015, 03:15 PM   #2649
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E-nrs are useless in Sweden anyway, all roads should be Rv instead.
Bring back the old nrs ASAP.


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Old December 5th, 2015, 04:01 PM   #2650
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That sign is a proper route confirmation. Not even the UK has crowns on their (uncommon) route confirmation signs.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 04:02 PM   #2651
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E-nrs are useless in Sweden anyway, all roads should be Rv instead.
Bring back the old nrs ASAP.


Agree. I have always wondered why Sweden has outsourced its key road network numbering decisions to the United Nations.

Perhaps the past scheme of 13 main routes is somewhat obsolete, and therefore subject to rethinking.

My proposal:

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Old December 6th, 2015, 04:25 PM   #2652
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I don't think we "outsourced numbering decisions" as towns asked to change R45 to E45.
Sweden also totally ignore the changes of routes over and over and ignored the rules of E6 to E06 and so on.

However, E6 should be R2 again, and E45 back to R45 like it always was, E22 should be R4 as well.
No need to change these basic routes from before, most of them still are locally known as "gamla 2:an" so it makes sense.

Restore and preserve.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 05:23 PM   #2653
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Sweden also totally ignore the changes of routes over and over and ignored the rules of E6 to E06 and so on.
That was one time, albeit persistently for about a decade (and with Norway's help on E06).

old number -> new system -> OK, you guys are holding out, we'll let you get away with it.
E4 -> E55 -> E04
E6 -> E47* -> E06

*This was silly numbering, and ought to have been E45 north of Goteburg
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Old December 6th, 2015, 06:44 PM   #2654
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Ok guys, change nrs...How about no.
Ok guys, ad a zero at least....How about no.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 10:09 PM   #2655
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I don't think we "outsourced numbering decisions" as towns asked to change R45 to E45.
Still the final decision was made by UNECE, not by Sweden. Most other countries make the decisions of the national road numbering by themselves.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 11:00 PM   #2656
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Most other countries make the decisions of the national road numbering by themselves.
Most other countries make the decisions of the International E Road Network numbering by themselves. Some of them notify the UNECE somewhat post-hoc (or ignore the rejection), but some don't even bother with that.
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Old December 20th, 2015, 11:43 PM   #2657
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Yes, probably the cost of re-building those two tunnels is the reason. Even with the E4 Förbifart Stockholm completed, Trafikverket calculates with more traffic on the "old E4" through Hagastaden than today so I guess the ques will remain. On the other hand, picking up the old idea of straightening E4 by building two new tunnels under Norra Begravningsparken and Karolinska (thus accessing Essingeleden directly) could solve the problem. However, that will never happen...
Never heard about this plan. Does it have any name?
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Old December 20th, 2015, 11:45 PM   #2658
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In other news: Vägverket has done ground works to se if a Österleden is possible and they have reached the conclusion that it is indeed possible.

http://mitti.se/beskedet-det-gar-bygga-motorvagstunnel/

The plan is to completet the ring around Stockholm from Frihamnen to Södra Länken.
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Old December 21st, 2015, 04:25 AM   #2659
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Originally Posted by Mirror's Edge View Post
I don't think we "outsourced numbering decisions" as towns asked to change R45 to E45.
Sweden also totally ignore the changes of routes over and over and ignored the rules of E6 to E06 and so on.

However, E6 should be R2 again, and E45 back to R45 like it always was, E22 should be R4 as well.
No need to change these basic routes from before, most of them still are locally known as "gamla 2:an" so it makes sense.

Restore and preserve.

E6 could be R2 again. And E4 from Helsingborg to Stockholm can be R1 again. But what about E4 from Stockholm to Haparanda. Do you want it to be R13 again? Or do you want it to be R1?
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Old December 21st, 2015, 05:12 AM   #2660
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I'm not particularly sure what the big deal is with using E-roads in Sweden?

My reading of the E-road network is that it's basically Europe's equivalent of our Interstates and U.S. Highways. In some U.S. states you only have one mainline Interstate (like Maine or North Dakota). Does that mean we shouldn't designate e.g. ME I-95 as such? That it should become ME Hwy 1? No. Actually, for interstate traffic, that would make things way more confusing. The main highway from Maine to Florida could become ME-1, NH-3, MA-5, RI-1, CT-1, NY-90, NJ-1, PA-72, DE-1, MD-3, VA-6, NC-34 ... etc. You get the point. Very confusing, very fast. Abstentions from the system makes the system break down.
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