Seattle: Mid-rise projects

[jessejb]

Awesome! I can see the Quiznos, Tanning Salons and UPS Stores now!

[Capitol Hill]

Well, the Brix has been pretty good about taking other retailers on B'way that were going to be dislocated from the construction of the LRT. I'm hoping that with this new project, we'll get some new retailers, not just more of the same. I think we have enough Thai/Pho/Asian restaurants, enough Mexican restaurants, and enough smoke shops. I'd like to see some more clothing stores that sell something NEW.

[jessejb]

Originally Posted by Capitol Hill

Well, the Brix has been pretty good about taking other retailers on B'way that were going to be dislocated from the construction of the LRT. I'm hoping that with this new project, we'll get some new retailers, not just more of the same. I think we have enough Thai/Pho/Asian restaurants, enough Mexican restaurants, and enough smoke shops. I'd like to see some more clothing stores that sell something NEW.

Yeah. Like Pinkberry. Now.

[Capitol Hill]

Originally Posted by jessejb

Yeah. Like Pinkberry. Now.

Well, considering right now they are only in California and New York, I can't imagine we're the next state in line to get one. There is a crazy berry that just opened next door to the USBank and Hollywood Video. I've never been in, though, as I'm not a huge smoothie fan.

[brettro82]

i haven't been to a pinkberry but I've heard that Crazy Berry is modeled after it. The green tea flavor is interesting.

[Seattleguy]

I noticed on the QFC B'way site they are using stucco on some of the siding! Haven't they learned from the endless stucco siding disasters around the city!
I wished they had used more colors on the building like the ones used so beautifully in the new complexes at 45th N and Stoneway.

[mhays]

In terms of the cladding failures, stucco isn't the problem. It's the specific design and installation of exterior wall systems that's the problem. Particularly EIFS, or Exterior Insulation & Finish Systems.

(I'm no expert. It's not relevant to us, and I'm just a marketing guy anyway.)

[Capitol Hill]

Originally Posted by Seattleguy

I noticed on the QFC B'way site they are using stucco on some of the siding! Haven't they learned from the endless stucco siding disasters around the city!
I wished they had used more colors on the building like the ones used so beautifully in the new complexes at 45th N and Stoneway.

Seattleguy, one of the problems that the Design Commission had with this project was the use of too much color. The Commission wanted the brick of the retail portion to be more prominent, so they did that and mimicked it wtih the color that is used.

All in all, it'll be an improvement over what is there, it'll add some much needed street appeal to the north end of Broadway, and I'll be glad to see it start.

[CommanderObvious]

mhays, you are right on EIFS buildings. Dryvit has been the cause of the wraps we constantly see around this area. The problems these systems have been facing area a result of both bad installations and poor product specifications for this climate.

[Capitol Hill]

Originally Posted by CommanderObvious

mhays, you are right on EIFS buildings. Dryvit has been the cause of the wraps we constantly see around this area. The problems these systems have been facing area a result of both bad installations and poor product specifications for this climate.

So the question that I have is are the developers/builders doing it correctly now and making correct specifications?

I ask this, because I know that if I were to sign a purchase contract in a building that had dryvit siding, there would be something about there of me taking NO liability for siding failure. I don't know if they'd sell to me with that in there or not, but if they didn't, I'd walk away from the deal.

[Capitol Hill]

Today the Stranger's SLOG bring us tragic news - the impending redevelopment of the Undre
Arms apartments at 11th & Madison:

http://slog. thestranger. com/2007/ 12/smell_ you_later

The building has not changed noticeably for the 25 years I've been going past it. You can
help memorialize it by attending the Design Review hearing, and suggesting that the
wonderful name (at the very least) be memorialized in the replacement.

PROJECT DESCRIPTION The proposal is to demolish existing single family residence and
construct six-story building, including 48 units of housing, common amenities, retail &
underground parking for 18 vehicles.

http://web1. seattle.gov/ dpd/luib/ Notice.aspx? BID=271&NID= 7124

Wednesday, January 9, 2008, 6:30 p.m. Seattle Central Community College 1701 Broadway
Room 3211

[mhays]

Originally Posted by Capitol Hill

So the question that I have is are the developers/builders doing it correctly now and making correct specifications?

I ask this, because I know that if I were to sign a purchase contract in a building that had dryvit siding, there would be something about there of me taking NO liability for siding failure. I don't know if they'd sell to me with that in there or not, but if they didn't, I'd walk away from the deal.

I don't know much. But essentially yes, things have gotten much better. No designer, builder, developer, subcontractor, or lender would build something that put themself at risk.

The problem existed for several years because projects were built with defective standards until the problem became clear -- in other words, buildings were designed and built, and then they had to exist long enough that many started to fail. Immediately after that, new projects were avoiding the problem pretty well, though it still required a learning curve as some solutions were better than others.

A lot of this is the law of unintended consequences. One major culprit is the new standards for airtightness that were impremented in the 1990s, benefitting energy efficiency. These standards mean that air pressure is generally lower inside a building than outside. This creates a vacuum effect that sucks water into buildings and pulls in past the gravity-based defenses that used to work. Another culprit is that many of the old systems assumed you could keep 100% of the water out, and therefore didn't need a route for water to escape. (I'm probably showing how little I know. Maybe Seasun can clarify?)

[BoulderGrad]

Originally Posted by Capitol Hill

Today the Stranger's SLOG bring us tragic news - the impending redevelopment of the Undre
Arms apartments at 11th & Madison:

http://slog. thestranger. com/2007/ 12/smell_ you_later

The building has not changed noticeably for the 25 years I've been going past it. You can
help memorialize it by attending the Design Review hearing, and suggesting that the
wonderful name (at the very least) be memorialized in the replacement.

PROJECT DESCRIPTION The proposal is to demolish existing single family residence and
construct six-story building, including 48 units of housing, common amenities, retail &
underground parking for 18 vehicles.

http://web1. seattle.gov/ dpd/luib/ Notice.aspx? BID=271&NID= 7124

Wednesday, January 9, 2008, 6:30 p.m. Seattle Central Community College 1701 Broadway
Room 3211

Yeesh, I feel like sneezing just from looking at it. But yes, that name is far too priceless to be lost to history. We need the "Undre Arms 2."

[Seasun]

Originally Posted by mhays

One major culprit is the new standards for airtightness that were impremented in the 1990s, benefitting energy efficiency. These standards mean that air pressure is generally lower inside a building than outside. This creates a vacuum effect that sucks water into buildings and pulls in past the gravity-based defenses that used to work. Another culprit is that many of the old systems assumed you could keep 100% of the water out, and therefore didn't need a route for water to escape. (I'm probably showing how little I know. Maybe Seasun can clarify?)

I'm not a cladding expert but you hit a couple of major points that I've also heard. I worked on an apartment building in '97 that had EIFS as its primary skin and we did a very competent job as far as I know but I did notice the white plastic wrap enclosure/redo scaffold I think in the last year - so about 9 years. Not great but not the worst either.
I would also say that when I see EIFS used in combination with other materials (brick, metal siding, whatever) you're just asking for that many more chances to have things leak. Keep material transitions and weird angles/parapets to a minimum. I helped deconstruct and reconstruct the cladding of a condo back in about '99 that was pretty bad after only a couple years. It was clear that certain flashings were installed in the wrong order due to the construction schedule probably. Spots of rotted out wood framing wasn't pretty! I wouldn't rule out buying a condo with EIFS (a lot of other materials have sealant joints that leak, etc) but I would ask some questions about initial construction and any issues since. Make sure the condo association has decent reserve funds for recladding and other major repairs regardless of EIFS or not.

[Capitol Hill]

Back on the midrise projects. The QFC project at 523 Broadway East. I know that the 4th design review happened recently. In the past week, the Taco Bell restaurant (sic) at the corner of Broadway E. and E. Mercer St. is now closed, So the entire block is now vacant, so I imagine we very well may see demolition begin soon. I know that originally, there had been plans for demolition in October 2007.

[brettro82]

The building at Bellevue and Pine that was in the process of being renovated for the past few months now looks like it's going to be demolished and replaced with a 103 unit midrise project.

Matt at Urbnlivn notes that the devloper is conducting an online survey to help guide the project.

[BoulderGrad]

EXPO62 is switching from Condos to Appartments:
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/347684_expo16.html

Apparently they've only sold 17 of 117 units since the beginning of the summer.

[mhays]

The Expo switch is good for those of us buying in other buildings nearby. Less supply to compete with.

Their marketing concept was horrible, as everyone has been saying. They expected you to buy into a halloween costume in a manner of speaking, or at least laugh along with it. Also the 62 concept and associated lingo are ancient history to many, and not connected to each other. Fundamentally, buyers want a good floorplan in a good neighborhood at the right price, and marketing "brands" are ancillary at best. At worst we're uncomfortable about being typecast.

I live in an Intracorp building now, and they're a good developer. It's unfortunate that cancelling 17 contracts will hurt their credibility on future projects, because I want them to succeed and keep building. Hopefully they'll go forward with stuff like 1915 Second as apartments.

[Capitol Hill]

Originally Posted by mhays

Actually it's two parts. From DPD: Land Use Application to allow one four-story building containing 122 assisted living units and one three-story building containing 23,610 sq. ft. of retail and 103 residential units. Both structures to be over a below grade parking garage for 255 vehicles. Project includes 25,000 cu. yds. of grading. Existing structures to be demolished.

Merrill gardens will be all retirement. The way that they work, is you move into a unit when you are still a healthy senior. If/when you need to move into an assisted unit, you move from the 'apartment' to the assisted facility. Its much less disruptive for seniors to have this process. Merrill does some very nice retirement communities, so it should be quality. The apartments are for seniors only.

I'm actually looking into this sort of program for my parents, although its still probably around 5-7 years for them, but I'd rather be prepared now then in panic mode.

[jessejb]

I was bussing it up Pike today and it looked like Mirabella was doing quite a bit of exterior panelling. It looks really good. I hope that was the panelling I saw or maybe it was just the weather-wrapping stuff.