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Old January 18th, 2008, 03:33 AM   #181
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Halawala View Post
Bullshit Propoganda.
Which part? Please explain the specific points that are inaccurate (and don't say the whole thing, as that will just demonstrate that you have no real point).
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Old January 18th, 2008, 04:55 PM   #182
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You obviously have either not read, ignored parts, or not understood the Holy Book. Oh and good post Walli, very informative and relevant to this thread.
What the hell are you talking about?
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Old January 18th, 2008, 04:56 PM   #183
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Walli, I doubt that you are even Muslim at all!! Or even been to Makkah.
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Old January 18th, 2008, 05:01 PM   #184
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Mecca building more skyscrapers . What's wrong with that ? Mecca needs more hotels to cater for huge number of pilgrims, and this can only be done by maximizing land use i.e. bilding more skyscrapers. In average, Muslims from my country have to wait 7--10 years to perform hajj, due to the quota system. More hotels means higher quota for pilgrims.
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Old January 18th, 2008, 11:53 PM   #185
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Quote:
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Walli, I doubt that you are even Muslim at all!! Or even been to Makkah.
Of course he isn't, he already said that he just read the article.
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Old January 19th, 2008, 01:25 AM   #186
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Of course he isn't, he already said that he just read the article.
He's not Muslim!? That's why!! HAHHA! Walli your just another brainwashed, media-struck person. Thats really unfortunate and sad. U cant judge Makkah by an article writting by an anti-Muslim. Walli, I know your anti-Islam, but really you have to learn more about Islam first.
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Old January 19th, 2008, 02:31 AM   #187
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Halawala - could you please stay on topic and answer the question in post #181

If you can't do that, you really should refrain from posting here as you regular off-topic posts will inevitably get you banned.
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Old January 19th, 2008, 04:11 AM   #188
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Quote:
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Well, I am very happy to explain how Islam is a relegion of ease and happiness and not the opposite. =) If you have further questions, I would be happy to address them.
In the book Claudius the God by Robert Graves, the Roman Emperor Claudius is bemused by the fact that the people of newly-conquered Britain have decided to worship him as a God.

Claudius was a shy, timid individual who had a club foot and spoke with a stammer. He was the most unlikely god imaginable.

He reflects also on his uncle Caligula, a half-mad tyrant who had declared himself to be a god and had been worshipped.

What did that say about the nature of Gods and belief?

Claudius reaches the conclusion that it is not so much the object being worshipped but the act of worship itself that is holy.

When you say that Islam is a religion of ease and happiness that reflects the fact that to you nothing is higher than Allah. For a Christian, nothing is higher than Christ. For a Buddhist, the same is true of Buddha. All religions contain this vision of absolute perfection.

However, religions are created by men to meet the political and social needs of the day. We must not lose sight of that. When we do, we end up with the ridiculous spectacle of modern educated people trying to justify monstrously unjust activities such as raped women being stoned to death.

Islam can be extremely beautiful. I tried to get over that point by posting photographs of the buildings of Al Andalus.

However, whilst I believe strongly that religion is important it should never be used to allow us to turn our backs on the Enlightenment, which is the most important creation of Western civilisation.
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Old January 19th, 2008, 04:13 AM   #189
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Originally Posted by walli View Post
Halawala - could you please stay on topic and answer the question in post #181

If you can't do that, you really should refrain from posting here as you regular off-topic posts will inevitably get you banned.

Sorry, I've gone off topic too. Won't do it again.
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Old January 19th, 2008, 07:20 AM   #190
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no worries Martin. You were at least trying to be constructive with your post.

Halawala on the other hand is a repeat offender who has been attacking some of us on the forum for a long time now.
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Old January 19th, 2008, 09:25 AM   #191
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I thought Mecca is strictly a religious city. Why would they build a mall right next to the mosque...

Gives more reasons why it is stupid that non-Muslims can't visit Mecca. Turning into a tourist attraction... I don't see why non-Muslims can't visit Mecca by this point..
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Old January 19th, 2008, 11:16 AM   #192
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هلاوالله
ماعليك منه هذا معتووه وحاااقد ودم ضروسه شيء اسمه السعودية
تعودنا حنا على هالاشكال
الاشكال هذي ما ينفع الا تسحب عليها ا لسيفون انت والكرامة

القاافلة تسيير والكلااااب تنبح
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Old January 19th, 2008, 11:42 PM   #193
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no worries Martin. You were at least trying to be constructive with your post.

Halawala on the other hand is a repeat offender who has been attacking some of us on the forum for a long time now.
Halawala is a MODERATOR, while the one who is being childishly un-constructive lately, is you ... and why are you even trying to moderate this thread.
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Old January 19th, 2008, 11:46 PM   #194
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I thought Mecca is strictly a religious city. Why would they build a mall right next to the mosque...

Gives more reasons why it is stupid that non-Muslims can't visit Mecca. Turning into a tourist attraction... I don't see why non-Muslims can't visit Mecca by this point..
That is hilariously ironic coming from an sub-urban North American, which life depends on the very existence of the shopping malls.
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Old January 20th, 2008, 05:55 AM   #195
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AltinD View Post
That is hilariously ironic coming from an sub-urban North American, which life depends on the very existence of the shopping malls.
Actually, many of the largest shopping malls in the world are in the middle east. When you consider the minute population of the Middle East, it is quite amazing. It is certainly a shopping, glitz and glamor society there.
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Old January 20th, 2008, 05:58 AM   #196
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Quote:
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Halawala is a MODERATOR
Someone must have been smoking somethin' when that decision was made!

Jokes aside, Halawala still has not responded to post 181. Being a 'moderator' certainly he should be able to respond point by point to the original article, which was started by a real moderator.
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Old January 22nd, 2008, 08:14 PM   #197
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Quote:
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What the hell are you talking about?
Who knows.
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Old January 23rd, 2008, 07:15 AM   #198
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Quote:
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I think that anyone who travels to Mecca by plane, spends their time in a luxury hotel and then, following the rituals at the Kaaba, spends the rest of his or her time shopping, is only playing lip service to Islam.
"Let the rich man spend according to his means, and the man whose resources are restricted, let him spend according to what Allah has given him..." [Quran]


---

As everyone knows Mecca is the holiest place for Muslims and those who can afford it are obliged to visit the Kaba at least once in their lifetime. So, while preservation of historic sites is important needs of pilgrims mustn't be inferior to it. Hajj attracts millions of people and they badly need space in order to avoid stampedes and if destruction of hazreti Hatidza's house is needed to make more space around Kaba, I'm fine with that.

However, destroying historic castle or a mosque to make way for Abraj Al Bait and other hotels and shopping malls is absolutely unacceptable. Such buildings should be built away from the Kaba. I can't think of single reason why Abraj al Bait is placed where it is.
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Old January 23rd, 2008, 09:35 PM   #199
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Quote:
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That is hilariously ironic coming from an sub-urban North American, which life depends on the very existence of the shopping malls.
I really fail to see the comparison, what does a mall in some forgettable nondescript place have to do with putting a gigantic tacky hotel hundreds of meters from one's supposedly holiest epicenter? People wouldn't care if you put a mall in many places because there is no atmosphere or important historical structure that could be compromised.

It would somewhat more analogous if a develperor tried to build something like only hundreads of meters from Niagra Falls, Mt.Rushmore, St.Peters, or the Wailing Wall.
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Old January 23rd, 2008, 09:53 PM   #200
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Read his post, he called the mall a touristic attraction and not a necessity. It had not much to do with the location.

Still, if the majority of the muslims posting here are ok with the location and the proximity to the Kaba, why should I object to it? Living for many years in a muslim country with a very mixed group of nationalities and religions (none of which is trying to "fit in" or "integrate"), has taught me a lot of things about very different perspectives on a lot of issues that people from different backgrounds have.

You and many others are simply seeing the matter under the (so called) western perspective, while obviously the muslims are seeing it differently, and since it's their holiest of places, our "opinions" are totally irrelevant.
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