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Old February 8th, 2011, 02:26 PM   #2521
Anniyan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seku View Post
Whatever it's, this project will not be conceived till the elections. After election, if DMK comes to power this will be materializing. On the other hand, if ADMK comes to power, i don't think they will continue with this site, as they have opposed it. Are there any alternate places suggested by ADMK? (more interested in knowing, coz it looks to be the most likely case)
ADMK govt will not hesitate to continue with the same site, and the DMK which chose this site will oppose it from the opposition bench. Thats TN politics!!
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Old February 8th, 2011, 03:39 PM   #2522
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ADMK govt will not hesitate to continue with the same site, and the DMK which chose this site will oppose it from the opposition bench. Thats TN politics!!
Very true. Dont be surprised if DMK and Congress oppose the greenfield @ Sriperumbudur if they become a weak minority.

Parties must be made accountable. Each party must clearly spell their stand on the greenfield project, instead of saying we oppose or we support nonsense. Parties must be made to realise that this accountability cannot be traded for free tv, cycle, computer, pongal, saree-dhoti or briyani.
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Old February 8th, 2011, 05:35 PM   #2523
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Originally Posted by satchitananda View Post
Very true. Dont be surprised if DMK and Congress oppose the greenfield @ Sriperumbudur if they become a weak minority.
Does TN congress supports or opposes anything in the interest of people??? Please remove the word congress from your post.
Thanks
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Old February 8th, 2011, 06:15 PM   #2524
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Originally Posted by Anniyan View Post
Does TN congress supports or opposes anything in the interest of people??? Please remove the word congress from your post.
Thanks


PRO - indicates good. CON indicates bad.

PROGRESS vs CONGRESS ..

Anniyan, now I understood what you meant.
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Old February 8th, 2011, 07:34 PM   #2525
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Quote:
Originally Posted by satchitananda View Post
Very true. Dont be surprised if DMK and Congress oppose the greenfield @ Sriperumbudur if they become a weak minority.

Parties must be made accountable. Each party must clearly spell their stand on the greenfield project, instead of saying we oppose or we support nonsense. Parties must be made to realise that this accountability cannot be traded for free tv, cycle, computer, pongal, saree-dhoti or briyani.
Right said.I seriuosly hate this freebies....these guys who had their roots from the suyamariyadhai iyakkam and all.....now their favorite job is to give free things like giving a coin to the beggars. do they think people are beggars.Setting up a way for them to carry out their livelihood would have been a more sensible option and is with due dignity and respect.
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Old February 8th, 2011, 07:50 PM   #2526
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Originally Posted by wlbkng View Post


* Works for New Greenfield airport at Sriperumbadur expected to start after elections
* Severe protest made by the local villagers with the help of ADMK and PMK in the past
* 4500 acres are estimated to be acquired and 42 villages are expected to be affected
* Fearing vote bank, govt temporarily froze the plan and it is expected to start again after elections
Why do they always choose very fertile land as this one for such projects? Are v space constrained? There is hell lot of free space in and around sriperumbudur...
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Old February 8th, 2011, 08:13 PM   #2527
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I was just surfing and I found this interesting article(2 yrs old though) about the hidden potential of existing airport. Not sure whether it has been discussed before. (I do not know how much technically this is correct yet it does make some point.

Quote:
London Gatwick and Chennai — The tale of two airports


Instead of building growth castles in the air, we need to run the current airports efficiently and to optimum levels.

From the beginning of this century, Indian aviation has been projected to be shining. But the clear skies are often clouded with the darkness of inefficiency and corruption. Maybe, Indian aviation should learn from Albert Einstein’s famous saying: “Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope for tomorrow. The important thing is to not stop questioning”

..........................

Take the case of Chennai airport. Plans are made for expansion. It is announced that the traffic potential is so large that the airport needs a parallel runway, that the second runway has to be extended, displacing thousands of honest, tax-paying citizens. What is this exercise for, is the question that every taxpayer should ask.

Chennai airport handles 129,575 aircraft movements a year. This is based on the 355 movements per day that Airports Authority of India has given out. The airport is open for 24 hours of operation. There are just a few hours when the traffic peaks to around 28 movements in an hour.

The AAI has projected that, by 2015 there will be 50 movement an hour.
For this grand increase, more than Rs 1,000 crore is to be spent to build the second runway, displacing a 1,000 families from their residences, paying a pittance as compensation and, in the process, filling several deep pockets.

Compare this with London Gatwick airport, which is similar to the Chennai airport in its layout. Gatwick has a single runway that is used just like Chennai’s. But the big difference is, Gatwick handled 266,550 aircraft movements in 2007. This is more than double the traffic that Chennai airport has and is more than the projected traffic for Chennai in 2015. Does Gatwick clamour for a second runway? Does it give excuses? How does it manage this large traffic flow? Simply because of ‘efficiency’ and ‘correct procedures’. The only difference between Chennai airport and Gatwick is the ‘Rapid Exit Taxiways”. Gatwick has a minimum of two rapid exit taxiways at either end of the runway.

These taxiways are angled at about 30-45 degrees from the runway alignment. This enables the aircraft to leave the runway, after landing, at a high speed of 50-55 knots. Chennai has the taxi exits at 90 degrees to the runway alignment. Because of this, planes have to slow down to exit the runways safely. This would mean a slightly longer runway occupancy time of around 15-20 seconds more for each flight.

Runway maintenance
Another factor is the quality of runway maintenance. The exit points on the runway at Gatwick are clear of rubber deposits and the maintenance procedures are as per ICAO requirements. The exit points of Chennai airport have heavy rubber deposits and we use outdated rubber removal procedures.

The air traffic flow is also different in London and in Indian airspace. ICAO requires a minimum of 1 minute separation between aircrafts. This will amount to about 4 nautical miles between aircrafts. In India, the ATC use more than 8 nautical miles. This slows down traffic enormously.

Moreover, the ATC uses the same distance separation, irrespective of the speed of the aircraft. You may have a turboprop aircraft coming for landing at Chennai at six miles. This would take a minimum of three minutes for landing. Yet, a jet aircraft waiting for take off will not be permitted to enter the runway and take off, even though it would take just one minute to be airborne. This over-cautiousness also results in slow traffic flow.


An efficient air traffic control system uses positive speed control to maintain this minimum separation. Aircraft are specified definite speeds to be maintained at different distances from the runway. They have to comply with this speed control. If an aircraft is found to be too fast or slow, the offending aircraft is alerted. If this disregard for speed control continues, the aircraft is taken out of sequence. Discipline has to be enforced.

Flooding
Chennai does not require the parallel runway nor does it need the expansion of the second runway. I wonder whether the geographical layout of the terrain was ever considered. At the intersection of the two runways, the elevation is around 15 metres.

At the threshold of Runway 12 (the beginning of the second runway) the elevation is just 9 metres. If this portion is extended across the Adyar river, the mid-point of the river is just 2 metres in elevation. Crossing over to the north, across the river, the elevation is close to 12 metres. Anyone with ‘Google Earth’ can see this clearly.

It doesn’t require rocket science to recognise that this cup-like formation is bound to suffer severe flooding during moderate to heavy rains. We saw what happened to the present airport when the sky opened up in November 2005. The authorities had to break portions of the airport compound wall to let out the flood waters which threatened the airport.

If the extension of the second runway is to be usable, they will have to spend crores of rupees to fill the entire central section to raise the level. This, in turn, will result in blocking the overflow of excess water from Chembarambakkam lake. Does anyone care about the hundreds of families who will be affected by this?

Let us remember what Mahatma Gandhi said: “The best way to find yourself is to lose yourself in the service of others”.

(The author, an airline pilot with 19,000 hours experience, specialises in accident prevention studies.)

http://www.thehindubusinessline.in/2...0250830900.htm
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Old February 8th, 2011, 08:34 PM   #2528
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Garuda to fly to India

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T Garuda Indonesia will begin direct flights between Indonesia and India in the second half of 2011, subject to regulatory approval.

According to Tempo Interaktif, the airline hopes to cash in on the high volume of traffic between the two nations, which in recent years has grown due to increased trade and the large number of Indians working in Indonesia.

Garuda’s information technology and strategic director, Elisa Lumbantoruan, says that at present the market is “very open” as no airline offers direct flights between the two nations.

The carrier will initially offer one daily flight from Jakarta to Chennai and Mumbai, but plans to add a service from Denpasar further down the track, the website reported.

In related news, Indonesia’s air transportation director-general, Herry Bhakti, has confirmed the establishment of a new airline, PT Pacific Royale.

According to Tempo Interaktif, the carrier, a creation of Indonesian and Indian businessmen, is in the process of lodging its flight permits.
Pacific Royale has yet to confirm the details of its fleet, but Herry Bhakti has said that the airline would offer full services on its flights.
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Old February 8th, 2011, 09:06 PM   #2529
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Originally Posted by wlbkng View Post
I was just surfing and I found this interesting article(2 yrs old though) about the hidden potential of existing airport. Not sure whether it has been discussed before. (I do not know how much technically this is correct yet it does make some point.
Well it was discussed at that point.

The opponents of Greenfield(read ADMK) must come with alternative land.

The only other viable alternative is to create an expanded current airport. This will put the pakkams in question. (Whoever proposes that will have severe political lashback.. similar to Sriperumbudur). In practicality, even if the expansion costs slightly more at existing airport, we dont have to worry about maintaining two separate infrastrucutures that ought to have speed link.

I do hope we can convince the military (give enough carrots and they will) and the pakkam people to create a more cost effective big airport. We can also have second access from the bypass road which will be awesome. This will also pave way for one more parallel runway. One end can have domestic and other end international.
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Old February 8th, 2011, 09:08 PM   #2530
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Originally Posted by Malaysia Mustafa View Post
[Garuda to fly to India[/URL]
Been in the news for so long. Wish it materializes. Garuda can really help strengthen Chennai's primacy in connecting SE Asia. Also may provide alternatives to AUS/NZ.
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Old February 8th, 2011, 09:18 PM   #2531
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Quote:
Originally Posted by satchitananda View Post
I do hope we can convince the military (give enough carrots and they will) and the pakkam people to create a more cost effective big airport. We can also have second access from the bypass road which will be awesome. This will also pave way for one more parallel runway. One end can have domestic and other end international.
By Military, do you mean OTA and the military zone inside it? It has good motive behind its start and am not sure whether Army will yield to the pressure from SG but yes that will be one such good plan. A low cost carrier terminal can be planned here with entry/exit points from Mount-poonamalle road, GST road and Chennai Bypass Road. Whats more there is already a metro station planned at OTA..
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Old February 9th, 2011, 06:32 PM   #2532
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It makes a lot more sense to expand the current airport than to build a new one. Much of the land neded for a parallel runway is not built up even now. Good road and rail transportation links already exist and a new metro line is being built. Its distance from the city is short. If the land for a parallel runway is acquired, it woud automatically create the space for a future large terminal between the two runways. And with connections to it from both sides, including perhaps a tunnel section under the runways, it would serve Chennai's needs for decades.

Unfortunately none of this will happen. Short term expediency coupled with greed will make us seek less than optimal solutions where simpler ones exist.
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Old February 9th, 2011, 06:50 PM   #2533
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Here's a rough plan for the expansion of the current airport. Can somebody point out to me how much land with built up structures are part of this plan? Other than a brick kiln, a coconut plantation, some farm lands and open plots and 3-4 structures, nothing will be affected by this plan.

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UT...c176b36f7d7ab2

Last edited by Sridhar; February 9th, 2011 at 07:04 PM.
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Old February 9th, 2011, 06:54 PM   #2534
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If land is not acquired soon, it will all get built up. The time for such a plan is quite short.
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Old February 9th, 2011, 07:28 PM   #2535
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Originally Posted by Sridhar View Post
Here's a rough plan for the expansion of the current airport. Can somebody point out to me how much land with built up structures are part of this plan? Other than a brick kiln, a coconut plantation, some farm lands and open plots and 3-4 structures, nothing will be affected by this plan.

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UT...c176b36f7d7ab2
The plan looks promising. Army has to support in order to give up their lands. Whats more irritating is, the present govt neither thinks on its own nor bothers to get advice. All they are worried is about vote bank. Visionary projects are a past in TN. There is no wonder why we are losing investments and development to other neighbouring states. The govt is interested only in money for themselves.

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Originally Posted by Sridhar View Post
If land is not acquired soon, it will all get built up. The time for such a plan is quite short.
True. But everytime in TN when govt proposes a big scale development plan, opposition will stall it. PMK will oppose every plan irrespective of which side it is. i.e ruling or opposition. only god shud save Chennai & TN from these people.
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Old February 9th, 2011, 07:57 PM   #2536
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The problem is that the cost, both direct and indirect, of this expansion would be extremely high. Better to go for brand new airport with a much better plan than the current one.

One good thing is that Tn gov. (read Kalanithi Maran) should naturally have an interest(particularly on the transit facilities) in the new airport. Both Paramount(if its still there) and spicejet should force AAI or whomsoever to build the airport and terminals according to their plan.

btw can anyone name some major private airport outside India? Can't recall. Thanks
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Old February 9th, 2011, 08:08 PM   #2537
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The huge parking lots at both MAA and CSIA airports can be done away with by building a 8 or 10 level parking building. And the freed up land could be used in a better way ! Of course, even the new greenfield HYD and BLR airports too have spent vast land tracts for parking !
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Old February 9th, 2011, 08:16 PM   #2538
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bonoslack:

Could you please tell me how this is more costly than building the greenfield airport at Sriperumbudur, with no existing infrastructure on site, no transportation links whatsoever, land that is not necessarily any cheaper and which is much farther away from the city than this airport? Especially when expansion here is feasible and can meet the needs of the city for the next 40-50 years! What are the indirect costs you are referring to?
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Old February 9th, 2011, 08:21 PM   #2539
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wlbkng: Very little army land is involved in this plan. I don't think that will be the constraint. The constraint will be vested interests, either those who want to whip up political issues with the residents here (none of whom need to be affected) or those who have bought up huge amounts of land around the site of the new greenfield airport in anticipation of rises in prices with the coming of the airport. If pure logic is applied, it makes absolute sense to expand the current airport - it can support 3-4 times the current capacity, perhaps even more. But then, when do decisions get made on logic. I am not holding my hat out for them to do anything logical.
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Old February 9th, 2011, 08:31 PM   #2540
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road connectivity/access/widening/traffic problems, land cost/court cases, rehabilitation cost if any, parking problems, etc. and all these are major problems.

I too want the airport to expand but with all these problems, can't think of any other option than a new one.

btw does anyone know of any major private airports outside India?
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