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Old December 18th, 2012, 04:43 PM   #341
RV
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It also seems, that the old junction M4/Kehä III was a roundabout interchange! Can you scan a map of that?

Porvoo-Rita was a "motor traffic road" (1+1) by 1984, as I believe was the whole road until Koskenkylä. It was upgraded to motorway in 2002.
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Old December 18th, 2012, 11:23 PM   #342
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RV View Post
It also seems, that the old junction M4/Kehä III was a roundabout interchange! Can you scan a map of that?
Yes, it was. The setup was rather problematic because of several short weaving areas. The junction layout was changed to the current "half-turbine" in the early 1990's as a part of the Ring III upgrade.





Quote:
Porvoo-Rita was a "motor traffic road" (1+1) by 1984, as I believe was the whole road until Koskenkylä. It was upgraded to motorway in 2002.
The map from 1984 shows the Rita-Koskenkylä leg being under construction. The road opened to traffic only in autumn 1987.
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Old December 19th, 2012, 08:03 PM   #343
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Well that's a rare type of interchange in Finland! Was it a 2-lane roundabout?
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Old December 20th, 2012, 03:12 PM   #344
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Quote:
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Well that's a rare type of interchange in Finland! Was it a 2-lane roundabout?
Unfortunately, I do not have map material detailed enough available to check.
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Old December 20th, 2012, 05:47 PM   #345
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Such roundabout interchanges work fairly well if they have 3 lanes, are traffic light controlled and have sufficient capacity for queuing traffic at the traffic lights. There is such a roundabout in my city that handles about 80 000 vehicles per day and is basically never congested.
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Old December 20th, 2012, 07:22 PM   #346
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Roundabout 3 lanes:
https://maps.google.ru/maps?hl=ru&ll...04823&t=k&z=18
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Old December 20th, 2012, 08:37 PM   #347
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Дмитрий Кудряшо View Post
Its very dangerous IMO.
__________________
BRAZIL !
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Old December 21st, 2012, 12:04 AM   #348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Such roundabout interchanges work fairly well if they have 3 lanes, are traffic light controlled and have sufficient capacity for queuing traffic at the traffic lights. There is such a roundabout in my city that handles about 80 000 vehicles per day and is basically never congested.
In that specific location, none of the these prerequisites applied... There is lack of space (at the Ring III level three junctions within 1100 metres), too short ramps for waiting queues, and therefore no lights. In addition, there was a steep uphill west of the junction, and it would have been a really bad idea to make the heavy vehicles to stop under the hill especially during the winter time.

There are large industrial areas nearby, and the share of heavy vehicles is high. The area still is somewhat problematic due to excessive weaving and bad geometry of a few ramps. That is why the complex is again under redesign. The changes will be rather small: adding lanes to reduce weaving taking place on the through lanes.

http://www.ely-keskus.fi/fi/Liikenne...2600_14200.pdf

I think there is only one roundabout in whole Finland being traffic light controlled at the entrance. It is located in NW Helsinki at the busy crossing of the roads 110 and 120:



The roundabout works pretty well. Many non-residents fear it and try to avoid it whenever possible.
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Old December 21st, 2012, 12:47 AM   #349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MattiG View Post
The roundabout works pretty well. Many non-residents fear it and try to avoid it whenever possible.
Why people fear it? It looks simple and logical.
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Old December 21st, 2012, 12:57 AM   #350
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geogregor View Post
Why people fear it? It looks simple and logical.
It has about 50 years of reputation being something to fear on, something comparable to the Magic Roundabout in Swindon UK. Earlier, it was rather accident-prone due to not being traffic light controlled and having several level-crossings for pedestrians. It was built at the time roundabouts were uncommon, and many non-residents had not seen such a monster earlier.

Yes, nowadays it is simple and logical.
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Old December 21st, 2012, 01:50 PM   #351
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^If I properly remember, it's so large because Road 120 was ment to be upgraded to motorway standard in the 1960's as the new route of the National road 2, so it would had passed above the roundabout.
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Old December 23rd, 2012, 09:47 PM   #352
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Quote:
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^If I properly remember, it's so large because Road 120 was ment to be upgraded to motorway standard in the 1960's as the new route of the National road 2, so it would had passed above the roundabout.
I am somewhat suspicious on that.

The planning history of the area dates back to 1915 when the architect Eliel Saarinen released his "Munkkiniemi-Haaga Plan", a very ambitious city plan covering the then west outskirts of Helsinki. Saarinen was able to foresee the growth of Helsinki 40 years before it really took place.


Munkkiniemi-Haaga Plan

There is a round plaza in the middle of the plan, named "Länsiympyrä", to be translated to "West Circle".


West Circle (photo of the miniature model)

Only small parts of the plan became true. The roundabout in question was build exactly where the West Circle was planned, and to the size of the planned plaza. The roundabout was built in the mid-1960's when the Saarinen's plan was not yet completely abandoned. Perhaps the planners of the roundabout thought that the plan might become true some day.

Therefore, I tend to think that the key driver to build the roundabout as it is now, was the Saarinen's city plan, not any later visionary initiative.
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Old December 25th, 2012, 08:40 PM   #353
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Snow

There is a lot of snow in the southern Finland. The Baltic Sea is still free of ice, and that often brings snow when the temperature is low.

The first snowfall took place in the late November, and since that new snow has been falling almost every day.

Helsinki has received 30-40 centimeters new snow during the Christmas Eve and Christmas Day, when there is a minimal number of staff for cleanup. The depth of snow in the Helsinki Airport was 71 centimeters today at 19:50 local time, and it is increasing. The record depth in December is 83 cm, measured in December 1965.

The snow is not a big problem, and there has been no major traffic delays. The exception is Helsinki where narrow streets and number of parked cars make it difficult to remove the snow due to the limited space available.


Road 1, Espoo


Helsinki


Snow ploughing, Helsinki


Road 45, Helsinki


Ring I of Helsinki, Espoo. Traffic camera
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Old January 3rd, 2013, 05:09 PM   #354
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Road 4 motorway bypassing Oulu will be widened to 3+3 lanes in the future for ca. 20 Kms. Here are the plans:

http://www.infotripla.fi/oulunliiken...20liitteet.pdf
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Old January 3rd, 2013, 07:22 PM   #355
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RV View Post
Road 4 motorway bypassing Oulu will be widened to 3+3 lanes in the future for ca. 20 Kms. Here are the plans:

http://www.infotripla.fi/oulunliiken...20liitteet.pdf
That plan is partially obsolete. The recent one, more detailed, was presented to the public last September.

Anyway, the traditional Equation of Road Projects applies: Good plans plus no money equals to no action. (Or the NATO mode is active: No Action, Talk Only.)

No new major project is expected to begin before 2016. As the Oulu Bypass upgrade does not belong to the national TOP20 list, I would be slightly surprised if something happened before the year 2020.

Last edited by MattiG; January 3rd, 2013 at 11:37 PM.
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Old January 4th, 2013, 12:15 PM   #356
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Is this the only 2+1 stretch with divider in Finland?
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Old January 4th, 2013, 01:17 PM   #357
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Quote:
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Is this the only 2+1 stretch with divider in Finland?
No.
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Old January 4th, 2013, 02:02 PM   #358
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No.
Thanks for the info...
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Old January 4th, 2013, 04:20 PM   #359
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MattiG View Post
That plan is partially obsolete. The recent one, more detailed, was presented to the public last September.

Anyway, the traditional Equation of Road Projects applies: Good plans plus no money equals to no action. (Or the NATO mode is active: No Action, Talk Only.)

No new major project is expected to begin before 2016. As the Oulu Bypass upgrade does not belong to the national TOP20 list, I would be slightly surprised if something happened before the year 2020.
Yeah, the plan has been split in two phases (like always here) = build first crap and then replace it with double cost in the future; 2+1-roads are a good example of this. It seems like first they'll add third lanes in the Oulujoki bridge and then in the future build the whole plan.
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Old January 4th, 2013, 04:26 PM   #360
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Quote:
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Thanks for the info...
Ah... Maybe you asked a different question than you intended...?

Most of the 2+1 stretches are relatively short: overtaking lane pairs with total lenght at most 3-4 kilometres. The upgrades ones (width 13.5 metres) are without the middle divider while the newbuilds (width 15.0 metres) are usually equipped with those.

https://maps.google.se/?ll=61.781322...,,0,-5.59&z=14
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