WNY Non-Development Discussion II

[Evergrey]

In 1940, Metro Charlotte was basically the same size as Metro Erie.

[DallasTexan]

I'm going to be in Buffalo for nine whole days starting tomorrow... !

[rick1016]

Nice pictures guys. A lot of Buffalo appears pretty mellow and blue collar, no?

[homestar]

Originally Posted by rick1016

Nice pictures guys. A lot of Buffalo appears pretty mellow and blue collar, no?

Yep. Sure. Whatever.

[DallasTexan]

Homestar is such a New Yorker!

To answer Jerome's questions...

Originally Posted by Jerome

1)What is the property tax on a 2,400 sq foot home 4br, 3 bath in a middle class suburban location ,20 years old house?

My house is only 11 years old, but it fits all other criteria. The tax bill last year was $1400 in Davidson County (TN).

Originally Posted by Jerome

2) what are the total annual fees to operate a $20,000 car, registration, personal property tax and insurance?

There are no fees or personal property (ad velorem) tax in TN... only registration, which in Davidson County (Nashville) is $77 per vehicle plus $10 for emissions testing per year.

Insurance depends soley on the driver, but NYS does have the highest auto rates in the nation... so I'm going to say it's much lower. My insurance dropped from $140 a month in NYS to $44 a month in TN, which is where I have my cars registered. I have a 100/300 policy with Nationwide, if you want to know.

Originally Posted by Jerome

3) how much is monthly water bill?

$9.41 was the amount of the last bill we got. Only one person lives in the house, though.

Originally Posted by Jerome

4) how much is annual garbage fee?

No annual garbage fee. It's done by the city and included in your property taxes.

Originally Posted by Jerome

5) How much is annual homeowners insurance on 2,400 sq ft detached home above?

Our policy is $634 a year, with Nationwide.

Originally Posted by Jerome

6) What is sales tax on food? Clothing? Restaurants? Other goods and services?

Tennessee state sales tax is 7%. In Nashville (Davidson County), it's 9.25%.

Food is taxed at a flate rate of 6%.

Originally Posted by Jerome

7)What is the EFFECTIVE income tax rate on $100,000 of income for married couple with the typical 2 children??

$0.00 -- no state income tax in TN.

Originally Posted by Jerome

8) What are total annual Gas and electricity bill for said 2,400 sq ft home?

Gas? Gas is so 1950s.

The house only has electric... and the bills average $55 a month, $90-$120 in the winter. Keep in mind we have the TVA, which provides us with the cheapest electricity in the nation.

Originally Posted by Jerome

Yes please, and I am NOT a Republian!!! BTW I do not think our taxes are low. But if Birmingham is only pulling in $440 per year on a house then they must be getting the funds to run the schools somewhere else. Also there are other costs associated with living in a particular location the house property taxes. It is important to consider sales and personal property taxes as well as homeowners insurance costs along with the water, garbage and sewer fees. My brother pays a very low property tax on his home in Florida but his water bill is $150 per month and his homeowners insurance is over 4 grand a year.

Well, keep in mind we don't have to put up with the unions, red tape, and bureaucracy to run things like up there.

Originally Posted by Jerome

You can avoid all of NY's high tax issues if you rent since our rents are lower than in other parts of the
country.

Not so -- not so at all. Sure, it's much cheaper than the coasts, but it's exactly the same as a lot of midsized cities in the Southeast, Midwest, and in areas like Texas. That's one thing that always irked me that Buffalonians claim.

[Sabretooth]

Originally Posted by DallasTexan

...but NYS does have the highest auto rates in the nation... so I'm going to say it's much lower. My insurance dropped from $140 a month in NYS to $44 a month in TN...

WRONG!

My latest renewal was for $63.50/mo; it was originally $59.83/mo when I moved here 2.5 years ago. That's down from the $79.33/mo I was paying for my last policy in NH (which was as high as $81.83 before I hit the magic 25 mark - big reduction, huh?). I'm still in some of the worst demographics for auto insurance too - single male, age 25-29, fairly high KBB value car, etc. Just because you don't know how to drive, don't criticize me for paying the "nation's highest rates". Technically speaking, until the latest gas price spike my savings in car insurance was more than paying for the increased cost in gas. And I walked to work, too!

Evidently you've never lived near Boston or NYC. As I said in that income comparison discussion, I don't think anything beats the statutory automobile expenses of New England. With that included, you have no idea what cost of living is; no more than the average Buffalonian, anyways.

[DallasTexan]

I've never had a wreck. You must also have something like 25/50 liability coverage.

I'm wrong though, it's third highest. I apologize.

http://www.iii.org/media/facts/statsbyissue/auto/

I have, however, lived (and traveled) in a lot more places than you have. I'm not the average Buffalonian!

[Sabretooth]

Scratch that, I was initially paying $59.00. Actually, it went from $59.83 to $59.00 and then back up for the 2nd renewal. Either way it's splitting hairs.

So what if you've lived more places. Do you want a medal? Then go bark up someone else's tree. I moved away, I did well enough, could have stayed, and I had enough of it. Actually my goal wasn't even to move back to Buffalo; it ironically was the best and quickest job offer I received (my preferences were actually eastern PA, Pittsburgh, NoVA, and even an itch to try Denver). My goal in life isn't to keep hopping from city to city until I've found the one with the lowest perceived cost of living.

And what does it matter where you've travelled? I didn't know that factored into car insurance rates. Or are you that weird that you scope out these statistics everywhere you go? Geesh, take some time off to smell the flowers, it'll do you worlds of good. At least that's what I intend to do whenever I travel.

[steel]

Originally Posted by DallasTexan

Homestar is such a New Yorker!

Our policy is $634 a year, with Nationwide.

I call BS on this unless you are talking renter's insurance. No home insurance is that cheap anyplace unless perhaps you are talking single wide which I guess is very possible in this case.

Originally Posted by DallasTexan

Gas? Gas is so 1950s.

The house only has electric... and the bills average $55 a month, $90-$120 in the winter. Keep in mind we have the TVA, which provides us with the cheapest electricity in the nation.

And electric is so 1970's.

The rest of America says you are welcome for the massive free ride you are getting on your TVA power.

[DallasTexan]

It's not BS. For comparison, my home owner's policy in Buffalo is $700. The house is worth less than the one in Nashville, but that's still not terrible.

Keep in mind, I have a multi-car and a security system discount attached to it.

Would you like me to get a picture of the bill?

Ironically, my highest homeowner's bill is on my house in West Virginia, it's about $773 a month for a house that's worth about $110k.

My renter's insurance in Birmingham is $15.35 per month for $20,000.00 of coverage.

[Sabretooth]

Gas heat >> Electric heat. Electric is faster, but gas is more uniform and you don't have entire walls where you can't put anything against them (particularly true of apartments where you have no say in where the baseboard heaters are). Unless you're my weirdo uncle who keeps ALL his furniture in an "island" in the middle of the room and has NOTHING against the walls, that can be a problem.

Same goes for cooking, in which case gas >>>>>>>>>>> electric.

Cheaper too, even with our rates.

Screw that though, I haven't been using any heat. I just turned in on last night for a few ° and got nothing but the delightful smell of burning dust. Although if you think that's nuts, my coworker from CA (Sacramento) keeps his thermostat set at 58!!

The renter's insurance at least sounds reasonable. I was quoted about $81/yr for something like $10 or 12,000.

[steel]

Well then Cheektowaga is damn cheap

[DallasTexan]

We don't use baseboard heat. We have electric heat pumps.

[DallasTexan]

Originally Posted by Sabretooth

The renter's insurance at least sounds reasonable. I was quoted about $81/yr for something like $10 or 12,000.

Always get at least $20,000.00 -- anything less and your items won't be replaced at full purchase value.

I'm actually licensed to sell insurance.

[Sabretooth]

Actually, for an honest question -

When you lived in Cheektowaga, did you have any problems with your electricity going out? I'm not talking long-term outages, I'm talking maybe a second or two, enough where you get back from work and have to reset the oven clock and things like that. I've heard it's a common occurance in that area of town. That actually happened to me 3-5x a week in Concord, too (but never when I was home ), but never happens here (where I am now at least).

Just a curiousity. Not that it's really a problem, just a nuisance. I'm trying to scope these things out for when I start shopping around. I'm particularly encouraged by a coworker of mine who said he had a family member who got a nice (brick, 2BR, finished basement) house in one of the "better" parts (not that there are any "bad" ones) of Blasdell for only $36k. Evidently it's even totally livable, it needs some updates like heating, carpet, standard stuff like that.

[DallasTexan]

All the time. I'd get home and the oven would say something like 11:05 AM.

I just got used to it.

[steel]

Originally Posted by Sabretooth

Actually, for an honest question -

When you lived in Cheektowaga, did you have any problems with your electricity going out? I'm not talking long-term outages, I'm talking maybe a second or two, enough where you get back from work and have to reset the oven clock and things like that. I've heard it's a common occurance in that area of town. That actually happened to me 3-5x a week in Concord, too, but never happens here (where I am now at least).

Just a curiousity. Not that it's really a problem, just a nuisance. I'm trying to scope these things out for when I start shopping around. I'm particularly encouraged by a coworker of mine who said he had a family member who got a nice (brick, 2BR, finished basement) house in one of the "better" parts (not that there are any "bad" ones) of Blasdell for only $36k. Evidently it's even totally livable, it needs some updates like heating, carpet, standard stuff like that.

Huh? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? You guys crack me up. You come on here talking up Buffalo and then you all are too scared to even come into the city. Buy in the city and lead a real life. An investment in a strong Buffalo neighborhood is going to be much more sound in the long run than anything in the Cheek.

[DallasTexan]

You're so scared to go into Buffalo that you moved 500 miles away

I really don't understand the anti-regionalism stance some in Buffalo take. The old borders of Buffalo are arbitrary.

[Sabretooth]

Yeah, I've heard about it. I guess there was actually a woman my mother and grandmother knew who moved out of that area because she couldn't stand it after a while. I don't know if I'd go that far, but whatever... I agree, I think it's just something you pretty much have to get used to. One thing I really don't miss, though, are brown-outs.

I ought to ask our friend on Whitney if it happens in that end too.

Speaking of which, we're going to make a tour of Cheektowaga around Christmas. My gf's friend in NYC who visited us over Labor Day was particularly intrigued by it (she's originally from near a similar suburb in Chicago - steel??), so I think we're going to theme the Christmas card/gifts after it.

[Sabretooth]

Originally Posted by steel

Huh? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? You guys crack me up. You come on here talking up Buffalo and then you all are too scared to even come into the city. Buy in the city and lead a real life. An investment in a strong Buffalo neighborhood is going to be much more sound in the long run than anything in the Cheek.

I'm not scared of the city. If I was, I wouldn't drive down Broadway or Bailey half the time. I also get some rush (from God-knows where since there's not really anything to do during the day) from being downtown. Besides the fact of overriding importance being that I'd love nothing more than to not be held hostage by my car for every little thing.

That said, I'm looking at this from the realistic standpoint of never having been a homeowner in the past. While I think I'm the type that would absolutely enjoy and derive great satisfaction from buying some pile of shit and restoring it to glory, I have to be realistic and consider that a.) I don't have the resources, at least not yet and b.) I have no experience. I don't see why it's a bad idea to cut my teeth first. Investing in a house in the city (probably south Buffalo) is my eventual goal.

Besides, if I were to invest in a house in an old suburban neighborhood such as a Blasdell or something similar, would I not be just as able to ditch the car for many errands and live a more so-called sustainable lifestyle?