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Old February 15th, 2010, 02:31 PM   #1301
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Old February 16th, 2010, 05:29 PM   #1302
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A summary of the current alternatives for traveling between Košice/Eastern Slovakia and Bratislava, along with the cost of the tolls is here:
It is from this article which announces that next month the National Highway Company wants to start the EU-funded construction of R4 Košice-Milhosť and D3 near Žilina.

The only funny misspelling in the picture is that Miskolc is called Miškolvec which is not it's Slovak name. The correct name is Miškovec.

Also, the picture is a bit misleading in that it does not show which parts of the highways are actually finished. It just shows what is under construction / to be finished in the coming years.

BTW, the article also announces that two of the 4 bridges that will re-connect Slovakia and Hungary along the river Ipeľ will be opened this year. I think it must be some of the bridges described in this article.

Last edited by DrX; February 16th, 2010 at 05:34 PM.
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Old February 16th, 2010, 09:01 PM   #1303
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those distances doesen´t seem correct. I planned route from Lafranconi bridge in Bratislava (mir-western part of city) to Secovska street in Kosice (mid-eastern part of city), using google maps, and the distancies are:

northern route through Zilina: 461km
combined route through Donovaly pass: 457km
southern route through Zvolen: 407km
hungarian route through Budapest city: 459km
hungarian route through Budapest M0: 500km
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Old February 17th, 2010, 10:38 PM   #1304
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R1 Nitra West - Selenec

Snowy update.

Source: http://www.nitralive.sk/forum/topic?f=8&t=24&start=615
















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Old February 18th, 2010, 12:04 AM   #1305
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beautiful winter in Slovakia this year
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Old February 18th, 2010, 12:41 AM   #1306
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Originally Posted by Nowax View Post
beautiful winter in Slovakia this year
It's beautiful, but not if you have to clean your backyard, access road and side-walk in front of your house everytime that white shit (which is polite translation of my own name for snow) falls.
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Old February 18th, 2010, 10:14 AM   #1307
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Over here it's +3 and most snow is gone now
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Old February 18th, 2010, 11:11 AM   #1308
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Hmm.. much snow in Slovakia

And I thought here in Estonia we had the most of this white thing.
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Old February 18th, 2010, 01:04 PM   #1309
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Originally Posted by RoadMuffel View Post
And I thought here in Estonia we had the most of this white thing.
Don't be confused by the last photo. There isn't so much snow (outside mountains). What you can see there is just snow-bank which is result of strong wind in last days (as you can see at the photos by SureThing_II). This winter is quite rich when it comes to snow, but snowfall is always followed by warm weather which melts snow.

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Over here it's +3 and most snow is gone now
Fortunately here it's the same weather now. That strong wind which caused snow-banks also brought some warm air.
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Old February 22nd, 2010, 05:09 PM   #1310
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An interesting interview with a guy from the Slovak ministry of transportation is here (sorry, Slovak only). Among other things he explains how the EU had to twist Slovakia's arm so that they assign 23% of the EU money to Eastern Slovakia. The other relevant information illustrating how "twisted" the system in Slovakia is is that we are the only CEE country that centralized all decision making about how the EU funding of transportation infrastructure is assigned. I.e., all decisions are made by the BA-ZA-biased government in Bratislava, and their goal is obvious: divert as much money as possible to there (it's funny how the interviewer of this Bratislava-based TV station goes over and over asking him about how much of the money can go to Bratislava, while he has to keep explaining that the EU funds cannot be used there; but, in response, he goes on listing all the projects that they managed to finance near Zilina...).
In contrast, Hungary, the Czech Republic and others let it up to the regional governments to decide how to use the money.
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Old February 22nd, 2010, 08:58 PM   #1311
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrX View Post
An interesting interview with a guy from the Slovak ministry of transportation is here (sorry, Slovak only). Among other things he explains how the EU had to twist Slovakia's arm so that they assign 23% of the EU money to Eastern Slovakia. The other relevant information illustrating how "twisted" the system in Slovakia is is that we are the only CEE country that centralized all decision making about how the EU funding of transportation infrastructure is assigned. I.e., all decisions are made by the BA-ZA-biased government in Bratislava, and their goal is obvious: divert as much money as possible to there (it's funny how the interviewer of this Bratislava-based TV station goes over and over asking him about how much of the money can go to Bratislava, while he has to keep explaining that the EU funds cannot be used there; but, in response, he goes on listing all the projects that they managed to finance near Zilina...).
In contrast, Hungary, the Czech Republic and others let it up to the regional governments to decide how to use the money.
Yes, bad Bratislava, the only thing we need are motorways and high speed railways all around Košice.

BTW, in CZ or HU regional governments make decisions about motorways and main railways?
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Old February 24th, 2010, 09:13 AM   #1312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrX View Post
A summary of the current alternatives for traveling between Košice/Eastern Slovakia and Bratislava, along with the cost of the tolls is here:
It is from this article which announces that next month the National Highway Company wants to start the EU-funded construction of R4 Košice-Milhosť and D3 near Žilina.

The only funny misspelling in the picture is that Miskolc is called Miškolvec which is not it's Slovak name. The correct name is Miškovec.

Also, the picture is a bit misleading in that it does not show which parts of the highways are actually finished. It just shows what is under construction / to be finished in the coming years.

BTW, the article also announces that two of the 4 bridges that will re-connect Slovakia and Hungary along the river Ipeľ will be opened this year. I think it must be some of the bridges described in this article.
Where is road from Zylina to Skalite near polish boarder?
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Old February 24th, 2010, 02:48 PM   #1313
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This map shows only alternative connections between Bratislava and Košice, I think.
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Old February 25th, 2010, 09:25 PM   #1314
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Realista_KR View Post
This map shows only alternative connections between Bratislava and Košice, I think.
That's right. The map is a good reminder of the irony that Slovakia wants to be a transit country in Europe, BUT.... it's not capable of connecting its two main cities / regions within its borders....
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Old February 26th, 2010, 12:17 AM   #1315
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Are you still talking about your sick and biased idea of connecting two main cities through south Slovakia?
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Old February 26th, 2010, 04:07 AM   #1316
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zaq- View Post
Are you still talking about your sick and biased idea of connecting two main cities through south Slovakia?
Let me try to get this straight:
- splitting the money between the north and south in the ratio of 60:40 (or 70:30) is a sick and biased idea
- pushing all the money into the extremely overpriced tunnels and bridges in the hilly north, and leaving desperate regions with 30+% unemployment in the south is a healthy and balanced idea (in particular, if the same strategy is used for both highways and railways) that fulfills the European vision of benefiting the whole society and eliminating regional disparities

I'm thankful that you clarified this for me. And, I'm looking forward to reading how Qwert approves your cultivated language.
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Old February 26th, 2010, 10:40 AM   #1317
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Then, let me ask you a couple of questions:

- which part of Slovakia is more industrial - south or north?

- which part of Slovakia has bigger potencial of tourism, with most tourist attractions - south or north?

- which part of Slovakia has higher density of traffic - south or north?

- what is the purpose of building motorways?

- explain me, why building of motorway in region with very little industry and high unemployment should be preferable to region with very high industry, high potencial of tourism where traffic is already collapsing?

Thanx for your answers.
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Old February 26th, 2010, 06:13 PM   #1318
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zaq- View Post
Then, let me ask you a couple of questions:
It's pretty typical, instead of answering the question I've posed, you pose 30 other vague and ridiculous questions. But, I'll be happy to answer:

Quote:
Originally Posted by zaq- View Post

- which part of Slovakia is more industrial - south or north?
Given that Bratislava and Kosice are in the south, then clearly south. If we ignore that and only want to compare Trencin-Zilina vs. Banska Bystrica+Nitra, then slightly more in the north. But by no measures is it 90%:10% which is the ratio with which we are distributing infrastructure investment (both highways and railways).

Quote:
Originally Posted by zaq- View Post
- which part of Slovakia has bigger potencial of tourism, with most tourist attractions - south or north?
Again, a bit more in the north - assuming you are talking about outdoor tourism. Because, of course, if you care about culture, then Bratislava, Kosice, Nitra are far superior to whatever mountain villages there are in the north :-). And, even as far as the mountains go, there is at least 30% potential in the south (southern side of Low Tatras is in fact the most accessible high-mountain region from Hungary or Austria). So, there's no reason why this region should be getting such a low infrastructure investment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zaq- View Post
- which part of Slovakia has higher density of traffic - south or north?
I agree that intensities are slightly higher in parts of the northern highway (again, maybe, by 10%), but that's mainly because there's usually just one valley between the mountains and all the cars have to go through it, while in the south there are more options.

But, a big part of it is due to the fact that over the last 20 years all the infrastructure investment went there, which attracted more foreign investment into regions where the government promised to build highways.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zaq- View Post
- what is the purpose of building motorways?
There are many of them. For us, some of them are:
1. connecting remote parts of the country (like east and west, ie. KE & BA)
2. making regions attractive for foreign investors
3. creating conditions for international transit (eg Ukraine-Austria since we are talking about the east-west direction here)

And, while 2 applies to all the regions in Slovakia, for 1 and 3 the southern highway is better (especially, given how much cheaper it would be)

Quote:
Originally Posted by zaq- View Post
- explain me, why building of motorway in region with very little industry and high unemployment should be preferable to region with very high industry, high potencial of tourism where traffic is already collapsing?

Thanx for your answers.
First, your question is posed incorrectly. I never said we should ONLY build a highway in the southern region. I said we should be SPLITTING THE INVESTMENT MONEY!!! Now to answer what you wanted to ask:
The little industry and high unemployment in some parts of the south is a consequence of ignoring it from all the Slovak-National-Party governments' development programs. And, to correct this former discriminatory policy, we should at l least try to invest some reasonable proportion of the money there.

Moreover, more people live in the south (even if we just count the Kosice+BB+Nitra regions vs. Presov+Zilina+Trencin). So, southern highway would serve more people WITHIN SLOVAKIA.

So, now you can actually answer my previous question: why is it UNBIASED and NONSICK to give 90% of infrastructure investment to the north and 10% to the south? I can see only one answer:
Most of people in the south are normal and don't vote for the Zilina-focused paranoid Slovak national party (+the totalitarian Meciar's HZDS party). So, their needs can be happily ignored whenever they are in power (even as small minority parties). However, the EU was not willing to support our investment into this ridiculous overpriced project. So, Meciar+Slota+Fico came with PPP which means that the whole SLovakia will spend 99% of its infrastructure budgets over the next 30 years on paying for the Zilina tunnel (PPP3) + a bunch of overpriced highways in the north (assuming that some foreign bank will be willing to lend Slovakia the money...).

PS: I hope the foreign readers are sufficiently entertained. As they can guess, these arguments have been continuing on and on on numerous Slovak discussion forums for years... So, don't expect any resolution... It's just a part of our cultural traditions...
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Old February 26th, 2010, 07:24 PM   #1319
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrX View Post
Given that Bratislava and Kosice are in the south, then clearly south. If we ignore that and only want to compare Trencin-Zilina vs. Banska Bystrica+Nitra, then slightly more in the north. But by no measures is it 90%:10% which is the ratio with which we are distributing infrastructure investment (both highways and railways).
For Christ's sake, we are talking about connection between Bratislava and Kosice through either north or south!!!

Nitra is already connected, BB will be connected soon, much sooner than RK, MT, Orava, LM, PP, High Tatras, SNV and others in north Slovakia!!!

In south Slovakia, between BB and KE there is next to nothing - no big and important cities, no industry, no tourist attraction - NOTHING!!!

Why the hell would we build the motorway through that region???????



Quote:
Again, a bit more in the north - assuming you are talking about outdoor tourism. Because, of course, if you care about culture, then Bratislava, Kosice, Nitra are far superior to whatever mountain villages there are in the north :-). And, even as far as the mountains go, there is at least 30% potential in the south (southern side of Low Tatras is in fact the most accessible high-mountain region from Hungary or Austria). So, there's no reason why this region should be getting such a low infrastructure investment.
By far, most tourists in Slovakia are coming from Czech republik and Poland, Could you tell me, why should we ignore those milions of tourists from those two countries and prefer few thousands tourists from Hungary and Austria, which are coming to Low Tatras????????



Quote:
I agree that intensities are slightly higher in parts of the northern highway (again, maybe, by 10%), but that's mainly because there's usually just one valley between the mountains and all the cars have to go through it, while in the south there are more options.
Slightly????????




Quote:
But, a big part of it is due to the fact that over the last 20 years all the infrastructure investment went there, which attracted more foreign investment into regions where the government promised to build highways.
Lies, lies, lies.
In last 20 years there was nearly no investment into infrastructure in North Slovakia at all.
South Slovakia, due to easy terrain had always better connection with Ba and much faster connection with EU(through Hungary and Austria) than north Slovakia.
South Slovaks, thanx to their corruption and mentality wern't able to attract enough foreign investmentments.





Quote:
There are many of them. For us, some of them are:
1. connecting remote parts of the country (like east and west, ie. KE & BA)
2. making regions attractive for foreign investors
3. creating conditions for international transit (eg Ukraine-Austria since we are talking about the east-west direction here)

And, while 2 applies to all the regions in Slovakia, for 1 and 3 the southern highway is better (especially, given how much cheaper it would be)
Oh yeah!
How about:
Safe, efficient, and convenient movement of people and goods from one place to another
So, b/c there is many more people and much more goods to be moved from one place to other in north part of Slovakia, it's very simple there is much bigger needs of highways over there.




Quote:
First, your question is posed incorrectly. I never said we should ONLY build a highway in the southern region. I said we should be SPLITTING THE INVESTMENT MONEY!!! Now to answer what you wanted to ask:
The little industry and high unemployment in some parts of the south is a consequence of ignoring it from all the Slovak-National-Party governments' development programs. And, to correct this former discriminatory policy, we should at l least try to invest some reasonable proportion of the money there.
Every country has it's own more industrial and much richer parts and also poorer and less industrial.

Italy has a south part of their country,
Germany has east Germany,
Poland has east Poland,
Czech rep. has east and north.

Slovakia has east and south
and if rich Germans with their multibilion euro investments couldn't make east Germany equal, what are the chances Slovakia will succes with our little(compare to Germany) budget with east and south Slovakia?


Quote:
Moreover, more people live in the south (even if we just count the Kosice+BB+Nitra regions vs. Presov+Zilina+Trencin). So, southern highway would serve more people WITHIN SLOVAKIA.
Biased again.
Nitra is already connected, BB will be soon.



Quote:
So, now you can actually answer my previous question: why is it UNBIASED and NONSICK to give 90% of infrastructure investment to the north and 10% to the south?
B/c this is the priority of Slovakia - building of highway connecting west and east through north Slovakia.
Due to very difficult terrain and corruption it is very expensive, but that is no reason, why we should stop this work in the middle of it and invest money in south Slovakia only for matter of some justice and principle.




Quote:
I can see only one answer:
Most of people in the south are normal and don't vote for the Zilina-focused paranoid Slovak national party (+the totalitarian Meciar's HZDS party). So, their needs can be happily ignored whenever they are in power (even as small minority parties).
Yeah, and this is exactly your problem.
You can see only this answer and you permanently ignore to take into consideration facts, which don't support this theory of yours.



Quote:
PS: I hope the foreign readers are sufficiently entertained. As they can guess, these arguments have been continuing on and on on numerous Slovak discussion forums for years... So, don't expect any resolution... It's just a part of our cultural traditions...
Finally some sence.
I'd like to ask all foreign forumers in here, who are interested and entertaind by this discussion, please sign it here.

If We don't see at least couple of signs, we should really stop this pointless discussion and we can continue in it in our Slovak section, or even better, through PM.
I hope you agree with me at least on this one.
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Old February 26th, 2010, 10:54 PM   #1320
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This was such a nice thread before DrX started to post here.
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