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Old July 19th, 2013, 12:10 AM   #8021
Laurentzius
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Has this thread turned into the comment section of Daily Mail?
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Old July 19th, 2013, 12:12 AM   #8022
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What about UK criminal numbers?
What about non-european criminals?
What about African, Arab, radical muslims, drug dealers, etc.? Or have they already got UK citizenship, so no problems there?

4000 Romanians convicted. But how many Romanians work hard and pay taxes in the UK and help the economy? Of course, honest people are never noticed...
No, because we're not talking about honest people. We're talking about criminals. And you're supposed to be ignoring me.
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Old July 19th, 2013, 12:13 AM   #8023
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Has this thread turned into the comment section of Daily Mail?
What Daily Mail?
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Old July 19th, 2013, 12:13 AM   #8024
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Without all those honest immigrants you would be in deep shit.
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Old July 19th, 2013, 12:14 AM   #8025
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Without all those honest immigrants you would be in deep shit.
We would. I'm all for immigration.
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Old July 19th, 2013, 12:39 AM   #8026
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What Daily Mail?
The one and only Daily Mail, I'm sure you're quite familiar with it. You would fit quite well in the DM comment section, if you're not already an old and respected member. Just like most people commenting over there and complaining about those bloody immigrants ruining the good Old Blighty, you are also an immigrant yourself. Oh sorry, I meant an expat.
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Old July 19th, 2013, 12:54 AM   #8027
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Originally Posted by cinxxx View Post
What about UK criminal numbers?
What about non-european criminals?
What about African, Arab, radical muslims, drug dealers, etc.? Or have they already got UK citizenship, so no problems there?
Oh, no, we are too politically correct to mention those.
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Old July 19th, 2013, 12:58 AM   #8028
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Originally Posted by Laurentzius View Post

The one and only Daily Mail, I'm sure you're quite familiar with it. You would fit quite well in the DM comment section, if you're not already an old and respected member. Just like most people commenting over there and complaining about those bloody immigrants ruining the good Old Blighty, you are also an immigrant yourself. Oh sorry, I meant an expat.
Where do you see me complaining about immigrants?
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Old July 19th, 2013, 01:19 AM   #8029
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Where do you see me complaining about immigrants?
Do I need to spell it out for you? You keep banging on about Eastern European criminals and what a wonderful world would it be if border controls were set up again. Your country is not even in the Schengen Area, so why don't you mind your own business and leave us alone?
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Old July 19th, 2013, 01:26 AM   #8030
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Do I need to spell it out for you? You keep banging on about Eastern European criminals and what a wonderful world would it be if border controls were set up again. Your country is not even in the Schengen Area, so why don't you mind your own business and leave us alone?
Border controls are not a big problem for immigrants, provided their documents are in order. UK itself is a proof of that fact.

However, border controls are useful when fighting foreign crime and human smuggling.
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Old July 19th, 2013, 01:37 AM   #8031
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Border controls are not a big problem for immigrants, provided their documents are in order. UK itself is a proof of that fact.
Exactly! Now tell that to Road_UK.

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Originally Posted by OulaL View Post
However, border controls are useful when fighting foreign crime and human smuggling.
They are not that useful, go ask the Americans how well their version of Berlin Wall on the Mexican border stops illegal immigration and drugs. However, border controls are a nuisance and a waste of time for ordinary people and cargo transporters. Well, at least for the citizens of countries part of an alleged single market.
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Old July 19th, 2013, 03:05 AM   #8032
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Here it doesn't make a difference. In Austrian, UK and Dutch newspapers you often read about Romanians committing crimes. You never read whether they're gypsies or not, it's the nationality what counts.
Doesn't matter; my point was that just as one can generalize about Bulgarians and other Eastern Europeans, one can generalize about gypsies as well (who are mostly also Eastern Europeans anyway). To change your post a little:
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It seems particularly Bulgarians gypsies have found a way to scam the Dutch welfare system...
And it's even more correct.
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Old July 19th, 2013, 08:03 AM   #8033
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurentzius View Post

Do I need to spell it out for you? You keep banging on about Eastern European criminals and what a wonderful world would it be if border controls were set up again. Your country is not even in the Schengen Area, so why don't you mind your own business and leave us alone?
Excuse me?

I'm half English/Dutch, grew up in both countries, travel through the whole of Europe for a living (including East) - cross these borders everyday, now live in Austria, Tirol, right tucked in between Germany and Italy, I speak English, Dutch German and French, married to a Russian girl and love all countries I go to.

Who do I have to leave alone exactly?
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Old July 19th, 2013, 09:49 AM   #8034
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Doesn't matter; my point was that just as one can generalize about Bulgarians and other Eastern Europeans, one can generalize about gypsies as well (who are mostly also Eastern Europeans anyway). To change your post a little:And it's even more correct.
Well, I would not like to jump in Gypsy issue again, but (and I even don't know why) in Slovakia (where you have freedom on choosing your nationality), Gypsy people usually mark themselves as Slovaks or Hungarians. Maybe some of them feel ashamed of their origin or what.

Obviously, Lot of Eastern Europeans travel to Western Europe as a cheap labour force to earn much more money than it is possible in their homeland. They are often marked as criminals or weird people from behind Iron curtain. But it is non sense to even compare them with immigrant from third world (especially far east muslim countries for their different culture and meaning of life).

Gypsies has generally different vision of life too. They often think they have only rights without any obligations. They think if they are tolerated in their homeland, they might behave in same way in foreign (especially western) countries as well.

Just think of it! Although the name might be a little confusing, it wasn't Romanians deported from France half year ago, but Roma people from Romania. See the difference.

The same goes for some robberies in Austria. For what purpose do I need a copper wires from Austria? Roma people usually steal them and sell them.
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Old July 19th, 2013, 09:54 AM   #8035
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I think you'll find that in a lot of countries they have embraced Polish people has hard workers. I have made a lot of friends among them. It's a bit tense in the transport section though...
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Old July 19th, 2013, 10:18 AM   #8036
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Indeed.



It's "Free Zone", not "Free France", dear .
What we call "Free France" was the French resistance and anti-Vichy/anti-Nazi organization founded by de Gaulle in June 1940 in London and its armed forces (aka the Free French Forces) based outside the French metropolitan territory, such as in UK for example, but also in the French colonial empire.
Merci pour l'explication
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Old July 19th, 2013, 10:25 AM   #8037
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Don't forget they are also afraid that the illegal immigrants from Greece will have a free land route to Western Europe if Bulgaria and Romania join the Schengen Area. Basically, they want the 2 countries to act as additional layers of protection for them. All that border security is paid by Bg&Ro, while in the meantime they also suffer economic loses because the international traffic in/out of their countries is hindered. This is bullshit. If I were in charge of the 2 countries, I would spend the money on something more useful and let all the illegals go through. It's not like they're going to stay in Bulgaria or Romania anyway.
Are Greeks such poor, so they are unable to afford an air ticket and travel to western europe directly?
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Old July 19th, 2013, 10:28 AM   #8038
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are we europe ?
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Old July 19th, 2013, 10:31 AM   #8039
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The Greeks are not the problem. They're in the EU and Schengen anyway. The problems lie with Bulgaria and Romania. The Commission has already approved their application for Schengen, which subsequently got vetoed on by the Netherlands and Finland. Reasons given were corruption, organised crime and insufficient border protection with Turkey. Once these problems are solved, the process for joining will be reviewed again.
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Old July 19th, 2013, 10:49 AM   #8040
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The Greeks are not the problem. They're in the EU and Schengen anyway. The problems lie with Bulgaria and Romania. The Commission has already approved their application for Schengen, which subsequently got vetoed on by the Netherlands and Finland. Reasons given were corruption, organised crime and insufficient border protection with Turkey. Once these problems are solved, the process for joining will be reviewed again.
Thank you for the explanation. Nevertheless, I think Schengen Area is a good idea. The criminality itself is a problem, but border checks belongs to previous century. It just bothers common people and solve almost nothing.

The only emerged disputy is common foreign policy. E.g. Slovakia does not recognizes Kosovo and its passports, so citizens of Kosovo are unable to cross borders with Slovakia (which obviously exist only along Ukraine. But fun fact is, that if any people from Kosovo want to enter Slovakia, they can enter e.g. Hungary and then freely travel across Europe For me, regardless my opinion on Kosovo issue, this is what I call fail.
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