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Old January 17th, 2014, 07:43 PM   #9321
Eulanthe
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What's worth pointing out is that the CH border (unlike most Schengen borders) is still controlled - look at the signs on every border crossing. The area posted in the link shows this well - you can only take across goods according to duty free limits. In a sense, Schengen has made life worse for the Swiss - the vast majority of small customs offices were closed down, meaning that they need to go off-route just to declare a few items in excess of what is allowed.

As for the buildings, the Swiss position is that they will remain in place. They removed some structures, but the control booths will stay for the foreseeable future.

However, as a resident of a EU country, I feel rather uneasy about the way that France in particular seems to have completely abolished any concept of controlling the border for customs purposes.
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Old January 17th, 2014, 08:13 PM   #9322
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Does anyone know if Bulgaria and Romania will enter the Schengen Area this year?
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Old January 17th, 2014, 08:36 PM   #9323
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thats the latest news i found about this

http://www.romania-insider.com/presi...d-2014/113082/
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Old January 17th, 2014, 10:44 PM   #9324
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Corvinus View Post
Some years ago there was an incident of Swiss soldiers crossing inadvertently into Liechtenstein during some routine exercise. After having already marched some 1.5 kms into FL territory, they eventually realized their mistake and marched out again. Later, an official excuse was presented by the Swiss Army to the Gov't of Liechtenstein. No war broke out
Liechtenstein does not maintain an army since the 1860's.
Things happen... http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/765629.stm
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Old January 18th, 2014, 12:59 AM   #9325
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Does anyone know if Bulgaria and Romania will enter the Schengen Area this year?
I have a friend who is involved at a fairly high level with Schengen policy here in Poland, and in his opinion, there's no hope of Romania/Bulgaria joining anytime soon. There's just too much fear over opening the door to Romania, while Bulgaria still has far too many problems.

In my opinion, the most sensible thing to do would be to reach a compromise with a 'soft' opening - member states would maintain a presence at border crossing points with Romania/Bulgaria and be able to control movements as deemed necessary, with obligatory checks on all non-EU citizens (self-declaration would work fine here) - with EU nationals only stopped on an intelligence-led basis.

This way, other Schengen countries would be able to maintain a degree of control, Romania/Bulgaria would be able to use SISII, yet the borders would be open for most people.

I suspect the most likely time for Romania/Bulgaria joining will be in December 2015 with Croatia. They won't want to block Croatia joining, yet it would be politically impossible to admit them and not Romania/Bulgaria.

For that matter, I still can't figure out why Andorra, Monaco and San Marino are outside Schengen. Yet border controls are next to none-existent with those countries - and yet controls are maintained with Romania and Bulgaria? Makes no sense at all..
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Old January 18th, 2014, 07:50 AM   #9326
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Originally Posted by italystf View Post
French-Swiss border near Geneva:
https://maps.google.it/maps?ll=46.16...33.11,,0,25.31
The road is in France, houses on one side are in Switzerland and are accessed to the other side. This gate looks like a private border crossing.
Is the stone at the curb next to the lawn beyond the gate and the green dumpster the border stone?

Last edited by El Tiburon; January 18th, 2014 at 08:11 AM.
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Old January 18th, 2014, 12:53 PM   #9327
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eulanthe View Post
I have a friend who is involved at a fairly high level with Schengen policy here in Poland, and in his opinion, there's no hope of Romania/Bulgaria joining anytime soon. There's just too much fear over opening the door to Romania, while Bulgaria still has far too many problems.

In my opinion, the most sensible thing to do would be to reach a compromise with a 'soft' opening - member states would maintain a presence at border crossing points with Romania/Bulgaria and be able to control movements as deemed necessary, with obligatory checks on all non-EU citizens (self-declaration would work fine here) - with EU nationals only stopped on an intelligence-led basis.

This way, other Schengen countries would be able to maintain a degree of control, Romania/Bulgaria would be able to use SISII, yet the borders would be open for most people.

I suspect the most likely time for Romania/Bulgaria joining will be in December 2015 with Croatia. They won't want to block Croatia joining, yet it would be politically impossible to admit them and not Romania/Bulgaria.

For that matter, I still can't figure out why Andorra, Monaco and San Marino are outside Schengen. Yet border controls are next to none-existent with those countries - and yet controls are maintained with Romania and Bulgaria? Makes no sense at all..
Border checks at Andorran border still exist and are strictly enforced.
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In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old January 18th, 2014, 12:59 PM   #9328
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Another problem with RO and BG in Schengen is that it creates a free corridor between Greece (where many Asian and African immigrants arrive) and Western Europe.
Croatia in Schengen should not be a problem if it controls well the borders with BIH, SRB and MNE.
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“The transponder’s personalised signal would be picked up when the car passed through an intersection, and then relayed to a central computer which would calculate the charge according to the intersection and the time of day and add it to the car’s bill” - Nobel Economics Prize winner William Vickrey, proposing a system of electronic tolling for the Washington metropolitan area, 1959
In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old January 18th, 2014, 01:38 PM   #9329
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yes, but why is it so difficult to make (or force) the greeks to guard their borders properly? i mean this whole issue around RO/BG and schengen is just ridicolous. i must say, i am a little disappointed by brussels when it comes to this question.
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Old January 18th, 2014, 01:40 PM   #9330
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eulanthe View Post
In a sense, Schengen has made life worse for the Swiss - the vast majority of small customs offices were closed down, meaning that they need to go off-route just to declare a few items in excess of what is allowed
That is actually a blessing - I don't think anyone declares the goods if nobody stops you to check them. Basically you save the french VAT since CH is not in the EU and therefore you can claim it back, whilst at the same time you don't pay the swiss VAT either (which in any case is way lower) and prices in general are also lower. In the airport is the same, I always cross my fingers - if no guards stop you to check your goods (which does happen, but not very often -i've had it twice-) then once you cross the doors it's all yours!
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Old January 18th, 2014, 01:44 PM   #9331
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Quote:
Originally Posted by italystf View Post
Another problem with RO and BG in Schengen is that it creates a free corridor between Greece (where many Asian and African immigrants arrive) and Western Europe.
Croatia in Schengen should not be a problem if it controls well the borders with BIH, SRB and MNE.
Immigrants also arrive from Italy where the corridor to the rest of Europe is already open....
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Old January 18th, 2014, 01:50 PM   #9332
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Corvinus View Post
Some years ago there was an incident of Swiss soldiers crossing inadvertently into Liechtenstein during some routine exercise. After having already marched some 1.5 kms into FL territory, they eventually realized their mistake and marched out again. Later, an official excuse was presented by the Swiss Army to the Gov't of Liechtenstein. No war broke out
Liechtenstein does not maintain an army since the 1860's.
Of coure war doesn't automatically break out, relationships between any given countries inside in Western Europe are far too friendly. But an army crossing borders uninvited is still a big thing (look at Spanish and British in Gibraltar waters).
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Old January 18th, 2014, 02:23 PM   #9333
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyline_ View Post
Immigrants also arrive from Italy where the corridor to the rest of Europe is already open....
Quote:
Originally Posted by italystf View Post
Another problem with RO and BG in Schengen is that it creates a free corridor between Greece (where many Asian and African immigrants arrive) and Western Europe.
Croatia in Schengen should not be a problem if it controls well the borders with BIH, SRB and MNE.
Yeah, but it's a much easier political and populist decision. You show how you fight the so called corruption from those two banana republics...

Schengen would be really great for many Romanian communities located at the border with Hungary and Bulgaria. They could develop together with the community from the other side, roads would be built between them, since no border checks anymore...
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Old January 18th, 2014, 02:55 PM   #9334
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By delaying their accession to Schengen the EU can make pressure to reduce corruption and improve thing (you either improve or you don't join).
Many countries had to improve economy, change laws, increase democratic freedoms to be able to join the EU, Schengen area or Eurozone.
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In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old January 18th, 2014, 03:05 PM   #9335
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Yeah right, Romania and Schengen countries signed an agreement, Romania fulfilled all the technical requirements of the agreement. After that, every time there are elections in a Schengen member state, they play the veto card, to get votes.

How about respecting a signed agreement?
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Old January 18th, 2014, 03:08 PM   #9336
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Originally Posted by italystf View Post
Border checks at Andorran border still exist and are strictly enforced.


Andorran police is worried about who enters there. They can make as many controls as they have but infrastructure is not ready for an exhaustive control.

French and Spanish police are worried about goods which enter in Spain/France (people is not the problem, anyone entering there has passed by F/E before).
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Old January 18th, 2014, 03:35 PM   #9337
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Many countries had to improve economy, change laws, increase democratic freedoms to be able to join the EU, Schengen area or Eurozone.
You should have to fulfill the Schengen conditions to join Schengen and you should have to fulfill the Euro condtions join the Euro group.
It's ridiculous if you have to fulfill the Euro conditions to join Schengen...
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Old January 18th, 2014, 05:37 PM   #9338
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Well, in for a penny, in for a pound. If you don't get things done properly before you embark on an adventure, you're in for nasty surprises. We've already seen that with Greece, who shouldn't have been anywhere near Europe.

Bite me Skyline
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Old January 18th, 2014, 05:40 PM   #9339
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There's just too much fear over opening the door to Romania
Fear of what after January 1?
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Old January 18th, 2014, 06:15 PM   #9340
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Well, in for a penny, in for a pound. If you don't get things done properly before you embark on an adventure, you're in for nasty surprises. We've already seen that with Greece, who shouldn't have been anywhere near Europe.

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We can always sell it back to Turkey
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