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Old January 14th, 2015, 10:03 AM   #12201
El Tiburon
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Originally Posted by Kanadzie View Post
Ah, but both are ****ed up - Americans are crazy about the booze (Canadians... even worse) but okay on guns, Europeans are psychotic about firearms (Canadian also) but okay on booze... so Canada worst of both worlds (like gasoline price too... European gas price, American gas mileage )
Canada will not allow people convicted of drunk driving into their country and booze is very expensive because of high taxes. They hate firearms until they visit a range in the United Sates and discover target shooting and gas is so heavily taxed that those who live close to he border buy it in the United State though Canada's gas taxes are not nearly as high or confiscatory as they are in Europe.

I don't understand why Europeans (the Swiss excepted) are so psychotic about firearms when some of the best firearms in the world are from Germany (SIG Sauer, Walther, H&K), Italy (Beretta), Austria (Glock, Steyr) , Belgium (FN/Browning), and other countries in Europe.
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Old January 14th, 2015, 11:07 AM   #12202
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I don't understand why Europeans (the Swiss excepted) are so psychotic about firearms when some of the best firearms in the world are from Germany (SIG Sauer, Walther, H&K), Italy (Beretta), Austria (Glock, Steyr) , Belgium (FN/Browning), and other countries in Europe.
That's exactly the reason why we hate them. Because we know them oh so well.
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Old January 14th, 2015, 11:32 AM   #12203
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The famous singer Montserrat Caballe recently was in a big legal trouble for declaring Andorra her residence while in reality she was found to live in Barcelona thus not paying taxes in Spain.
Not only living.... She had to face a judge and due to her health, judge agreed to send an officer to her home to make all questions. (thus not only not living in Andorra but not going out of her home in Barcelona)
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Old January 14th, 2015, 01:20 PM   #12204
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Originally Posted by El Tiburon View Post
I don't understand why Europeans (the Swiss excepted) are so psychotic about firearms when some of the best firearms in the world are from Germany (SIG Sauer, Walther, H&K), Italy (Beretta), Austria (Glock, Steyr) , Belgium (FN/Browning), and other countries in Europe.
As a result of this European "psychosis" firearm-related death rate per 100,000 population per year is 10,3 for the USA and only 0,25 for the UK.

That means that in the US you are 40 times more likely to be shot than in the UK.

In Switzerland this rate is 3.84. A little over third of the US one but still you are 7 times more likely to be shot than in the UK.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ted_death_rate

As much as I love US (lived there twice, travel there every year and been to 47 states so far) I do prefer UK gun laws over the US.

But it becomes a bit OT

BTW, can you bring fresh food from Canada to the US? I know you can't when you fly from Europe but how about driving from Canada? Do you also have to bin your banana or apple?
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Old January 14th, 2015, 05:32 PM   #12205
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Catholics believe that evolution is consistent with Scripture and that science and religion are not at odds with each other. Certain protestant denominations, specially in the U.S., believe in a strict and literal reading of the Bible., and those are the ones that push for the teaching of creationsim.



In some states uunatural and lascivious acts, adultery and cohabitation are still illegal, but those laws are no longer enforced.



There was alcohol prohibition here in the 1920's and the current high drinking age gives alcohol the "allure of the forbidden fruit" to teenagers. Ironically, in Cuba, where there is a totalitarian and highly oppressive and repressive communist diciatorship, the only freedoms allowed are with respect to alcohol consumption and sale (probably to keep people's brains numb and away from thinking about how to free themselves from the Castro family's grip).



I don't know about other states, but in Florida, the loitering law is strict and requires evidence that a crime was committed or is about to be committed.



It's not like that. Convicted felons, people charged with crimes, mental incompetents, drug addicts, illegal aliens, domestic abusers, etc. are not allowed to buy or own firearms. Decent people can freely buy firearms though if they buy 5 handguns within 5 days, the shop has to report it to the government. Dealer sales are subject to a background check but private sales are not in most states. Each state has a list of places where you cannot carry firearms. Almost all state issue permits to carry concealed firearms and most states allow open carrying, but all have restrictions on where the guns can be carried. Americans highly value their rights under the Second Amendment to the U.S. Constitution, something that most European countries don't have. And, the Americans gun-purchasing habits has a direct and positive effect in the economy of the Brescia area in Italy
Liked, except I'm not a big Second Amendment fan. But it's not the license to carry guns wherever you want that Europeans like to say it is. (And repealing it - which I'm not in favor of, mostly because I don't want to open up the Bill of Rights - would not immediately end gun violence. As the many mass shootings that take place in places like Montreal, Norway, Liège and now Paris should suggest.)

By the way the weapons (guns, grenades, rocket launcher - A FRICKING ROCKET LAUNCHER?? - used in Paris were apparently bought in Belgium. Where the Second Amendment is not in effect.
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Old January 14th, 2015, 05:40 PM   #12206
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Originally Posted by geogregor View Post
As a result of this European "psychosis" firearm-related death rate per 100,000 population per year is 10,3 for the USA and only 0,25 for the UK.

That means that in the US you are 40 times more likely to be shot than in the UK.

In Switzerland this rate is 3.84. A little over third of the US one but still you are 7 times more likely to be shot than in the UK.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ted_death_rate

As much as I love US (lived there twice, travel there every year and been to 47 states so far) I do prefer UK gun laws over the US.

But it becomes a bit OT

BTW, can you bring fresh food from Canada to the US? I know you can't when you fly from Europe but how about driving from Canada? Do you also have to bin your banana or apple?
Interestingly, five minutes after reading your post, I read a front page story in the New York Times on how far down violent-crime rates are in the U.S. over the last 25 years. New York City had about 1/8th as many homicides in 2014 as it did in 1990 (and around 1980 it was even worse).

So....
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Old January 14th, 2015, 05:41 PM   #12207
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I don't know about food restrictions, but since diseases or whatever can cross land borders naturally, I'm not sure what the point would be.
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Old January 14th, 2015, 05:43 PM   #12208
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Canada will not allow people convicted of drunk driving into their country
To be fair, I seem to remember a story like that...but it was the other way around. Couldn't get into the U.S. with a criminal record and a drunk-driving conviction in Canada counted.
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Old January 14th, 2015, 05:51 PM   #12209
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Originally Posted by Penn's Woods View Post
Liked, except I'm not a big Second Amendment fan. But it's not the license to carry guns wherever you want that Europeans like to say it is. (And repealing it - which I'm not in favor of, mostly because I don't want to open up the Bill of Rights - would not immediately end gun violence. As the many mass shootings that take place in places like Montreal, Norway, Liège and now Paris should suggest
This is just anecdotal. You have to look at the numbers like geogregor did, not the events. It's like saying there is no global warming because today in Turin is really cold

Quote:
By the way the weapons (guns, grenades, rocket launcher - A FRICKING ROCKET LAUNCHER?? - used in Paris were apparently bought in Belgium. Where the Second Amendment is not in effect.
Nobody says it's impossible. It just much more difficult (but if you're determined and know where to look, you can still find whatever you're looking for).

I guess in the US many more common people have guns than in Europe. That's the fundamental difference. In 37 years I've never even seen a firearm with my own eyes, except the ones carried by law enforcers.
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Old January 14th, 2015, 05:59 PM   #12210
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Anecdotal, perhaps. But when something like Breivik happens in Norway, Europeans and Americans treat it as a one-off. When something like Newtown happens in the U.S., Europeans start indulging in frankly xenophobic bullshit about "what Americans are like." Sort of like blaming all Muslims for last week.

"In 37 years I've never even seen a firearm with my own eyes, except the ones carried by law enforcers. "

And I can say the same thing. (Well, maybe not 37, but 35 or so....)
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Old January 14th, 2015, 06:03 PM   #12211
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That New York Times article:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/14/us...av=bottom-well

There are nice western European countries where total violent crime is higher than in the U.S., by the way.
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Old January 14th, 2015, 06:05 PM   #12212
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Anecdotal, perhaps. But when something like Breivik happens in Norway, Europeans and Americans treat it as a one-off. When something like Newtown happens in the U.S., Europeans start indulging in frankly xenophobic bullshit about "what Americans are like." Sort of like blaming all Muslims for last week.
Not me. I am a number guy.

Quote:

"In 37 years I've never even seen a firearm with my own eyes, except the ones carried by law enforcers. "

And I can say the same thing. (Well, maybe not 37, but 35 or so....)
I don't know why I wrote 37. I am 35 too.

Maybe east coast is somewhat stricter or more 'Europe - like' with regards to firearms?
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Old January 14th, 2015, 06:10 PM   #12213
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International border crossings?
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Old January 14th, 2015, 06:13 PM   #12214
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Fair enough.

Actually, I'm not 35 and haven't been for some time.

But the last time I saw a gun other than one carried by law enforcement I was probably in my early teens. (And that may have been my one brush with gun culture. My Dad took me to a weekend camp as part of a Boy Scout-like program of the YMCA called Indian Guides. I know, I know, very politically incorrect. Learning to shoot at targets was one of the activities, along with fun and games and general male bonding.

Seriously, I don't know anyone who has a gun (or anyone who's told me they have a gun) except people who hunt.

EDIT: Arrows and "fair enough" are for Spinoza.

But, Chris, fair enough....
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Old January 14th, 2015, 06:23 PM   #12215
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International border crossings?
I've found a very interesting video on this topic. I don't understand it (except the two Polish guys talking), but I think it's about the delays on German/Polish border at Frankfurt (Oder)/Swiecko. Of particular interest in the infrastructure on the German side - I'm absolutely confused as to what is going on there. I thought all the border infrastructure was on the PL side, but it seems that Germany had their border crossing on their side of the Oder/Odra. Does anyone know for certain what's going on here? http://youtu.be/sM9ZDMGxcGg
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Old January 14th, 2015, 10:12 PM   #12216
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International border crossings?
Seems like there are no international border crossings all over the world. What a wonderful world
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Old January 14th, 2015, 10:59 PM   #12217
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But the last time I saw a gun other than one carried by law enforcement I was probably in my early teens. (And that may have been my one brush with gun culture. My Dad took me to a weekend camp as part of a Boy Scout-like program of the YMCA called Indian Guides. I know, I know, very politically incorrect. Learning to shoot at targets was one of the activities, along with fun and games and general male bonding.

Seriously, I don't know anyone who has a gun (or anyone who's told me they have a gun) except people who hunt.
Still OT, but since you mentioned Breivik and Norway, I felt a comment coming on...:-) To Norwegians, firearms are generally NOT seen in the hands of law enforcement - our police has traditionally been unarmed (at the moment, though, special rules apply and police carry firearms at least until February - some believe/hope/fear the situation will be made permanent). However, most Norwegians are familiar with rifles and shotguns, since there are hundreds of thousands of hunters and sports shooters in this country. But weapons are and has traditionally been seen as tools of such trades and are not considered as means of self-defence. Thus, there are strict regulations in place which govern how firearms are to be stored and transported when not used. And - even when including the 22 July massacres - our murder rate is low.

Again, OT, of course...
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Old January 14th, 2015, 11:57 PM   #12218
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To drag this thread back on topic, I've always wondered about the practical problems caused by Schengen. Before Schengen, you could drive to the border crossing at Swiecko and ask the German border guards about pepper spray for instance. It's completely legal in Poland, but highly illegal in Germany - so the border guards would tell you "nope, you can't have it" - and you'd be free to dispose of it before crossing the border. These days, there's no-one to ask (well, okay, at Swiecko, you can...) at the border, and so no way of finding out about the relevant law. It might be obvious to some people that you just can't transport a shotgun across the border, but to others? If there's no border posts, then there's no restrictions, right? Or so the thinking goes...
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Old January 15th, 2015, 12:01 AM   #12219
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Law doesn't admit ignorance. You're supposed to study the country you're getting in beforehand.
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Old January 15th, 2015, 12:57 AM   #12220
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You're right, on principle, but the question would have to occur to you in order for you to look for the answer. I mean, would it occur to anyone to look into whether France requires reflective triangles and breathalyzers? It's reasonable to expect some effort on governments' part to publicize new legislation, to media, automobile associations and the like....
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