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Old March 21st, 2017, 11:43 PM   #15061
alserrod
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About ID and that stuff... once I crossed by train border between Spain and France. There were many foreing people. It had to be a special date or so but many people moved by train till the border and were to take another train in the border to keep on the journey.

Train arrived near here and had to cross a long tunnel under main tracks (in the google image there is a long distance train and a commuter train waiting for departure).

Former booths remained but no longer used... but in the middle of the tunnel I was stopped by a person who showed me a police plate and asked for passport. I hereby have to say that he had so strange jacket that should I find him in a corner, I turn back and take another way... but he showed me police plate and asked for passport.

I was so surprised that asked him again what he wanted (it was first time I was asked to show a passport in the border for a long time, a long time I had to show ID or so and first time I hear something in Spanish except conversations by phone or with some mates, because in France and all in the train all was in French).
I stopped, opened one suitcase in the middle of the tunnel (there were a lot of people and two more polices were located randomly in the middle of it) and looked for it. He asked me where I was going to. I answered. He asked me again (there was too much noise). I repeated and he invited me to keep all and go through.

Destination was clearly not usual about type of people they were suppose to search and my accent was so clear that no passport was supposed (in addition, being honest, someone can guess my region just hearing me. I have seen only the case of a French whose mother was from my homecity and he visited his grandparents once or twice per year. He learnt Spanish and kept a so strong local accent.... not often at all providing he had only French nationality)


No more controls I have had in Spain for passports each time I have gone to France. Never coming from Andorra (always suitcases coming from Andorra) and in 1986 yeah... border booths existed with Portugal.
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Old March 22nd, 2017, 01:23 PM   #15062
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I always make a point of refusing to show a passport when arriving in Ireland from a UK originating flight. Driving licence is always accepted by the Irish border guards.
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Old March 22nd, 2017, 10:24 PM   #15063
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Interesting

But it's a matter of some extra agreements between the UK and Ireland, I think. Because, for example, if you travel from Poland to Germany, even though there is no check at the border, you are obliged to have your ID or passport with you. There are random document checks by police or border guard patrols in the close neighborhood of the border.

More or less a year ago, I had such a check on a line bus from Berlin to Warsaw. The German police stopped us on the highway, we had to pull off to a roadside rest area, they entered the bus and started checking the documents of all the passengers.
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Old March 22nd, 2017, 11:38 PM   #15064
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In Spain, everyone is obliged to have always the ID card, therefore, it can be easily asked randomly (even in the border...). It is compulsory for teenagers over 14 years old but let's say that compulsory to have it (at least in your home) over 12 years old because ID card number is needed for first education grade title.

For my oldest daugther I had to show it to ask for a music education program (obliged to write child ID card number!!!) and for playing official federated sports (insurance = ID card number)

For my youngest daughter, I made first one when she was 9 months old to take a Ryanair plane.



by the way, I do know that those documents are enough to move within EU for adults but teenagers and children must have an official agreement made by both parents. They try to avoid children leaving country without parents' agreement (compulsory too for a passport).
My question is... should a child is abroad with both mother and father at the same time... does he need agreement?
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Old March 22nd, 2017, 11:52 PM   #15065
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In Romania, if a person under 18 years old wants to get out of the country, it must do so together with both parents.

If only one parent is going with the child, then an official document made at a public notary is needed certifying that the other parent allows the child to leave the country.
This can bring issues like: the parents of someone I know have divorced, and the child was living with one of the parents, who had also relatives abroad. The child couldn't visit his relatives abroad, not even for a short time during school vacantion, as the other parent would not agree to sign this document (did so more to annoy the ex-partner).

If the child needs to exit Romania without any parent, then the declaration at public notary is needed, signed by both parents, and also with the details of an adult with who the child is allowed to travel with.
My story about this: I was 18 years and 1 month old, just got my drivers license and wanted to go to a nice aquapark in Hungary just a few km from the border with Romania. My girlfrend was under 18 at that time, so her parents went at a public notary and made this document, writing me as the "responsible" adult for her, so that we can travel alone to Hungary. After the aquapark in Hungary, few months later, while she was still under 18, we visited together also Paris and London, while she was still under my "supervision".
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Old March 23rd, 2017, 12:04 AM   #15066
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Well, if the child is with them abroad, then the agreement can be stated without any problem by mouth, so I don't see any reason why it would need to have a written form.

In Poland, it's obligatory to have an ID from the age of 18. Before, it's possible, but not compulsory. Some people are getting an ID a few months earlier to be able to start a driving course earlier (if I remember well, it's possible from the age of 17, while taking the exam is possible at the age of 18), but then, the ID is valid for 5 years only instead of 10 years. And some do it to fool sellers in shops to sell them alcohol, which is also allowed from the age of 18 (even beer). They often just check that you have an ID, without specifically checking the date of birth.

The personal number (called PESEL here) is given to the child at the moment of registering the birth. It has nothing to do with the ID card, except for that it's printed on it. The number of the ID changes when the ID expires (or gets stolen, lost or damaged) and a new one is issued, PESEL is one for the whole life.

To issue an ID for a child, from the age of somewhere around 10 up, an agreement of only one of the parents is required. To issue a passport, both parents must sign the application form. And I haven't heard about problems with travelling the child with only one of the parents within the EU.

Although I know a case when a child was travelling with his mother - within the EU - but the situation was so unusual that:
- the child had a different surname (the father's surname, not used by the mother),
- the parental rights of the father were terminated by a court.

An officer of an airline at an airport in Greece didn't really like that - although, finally, let them go, telling to have some documents confirming being the parent of the child for the next time.

By the way, when did your countries (if you have ID's at all) switch from an ID in form of a booklet, filled in by hand, to a plastic card? In Poland it was somewhere around 2000 (they were in use to 2008), and more or less the same with driving licenses.

The old ID's looked like this:





The PESEL number is here below the photo.

Those old ID's contained much more information - for example the list of the children of the specific person, together with the information about the other parents and their jobs.

Last edited by Kpc21; March 23rd, 2017 at 12:11 AM.
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Old March 23rd, 2017, 12:50 AM   #15067
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haddockman View Post
I always make a point of refusing to show a passport when arriving in Ireland from a UK originating flight. Driving licence is always accepted by the Irish border guards.
I will remember that for next time
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Old March 23rd, 2017, 01:33 AM   #15068
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I will remember that for next time
That only works if you are an Irish or UK citizen.
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Old March 23rd, 2017, 01:35 AM   #15069
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The public transport authority in Budapest accepts foreign student cards as proofs of being entitled to a student discount in the means of public transport. And it's quite affordable to use this discount, as a monthly pass for a student is cheaper than a weekly pass for a non-student. And only slightly more expensive than a three-day pass.

When I was in Budapest a year ago, I had two student IDs with me: a Polish and a German one, both were valid. A friend of mine I traveled with, had a German one, but he was a Norwegian citizen.

From what I checked, only EU citizens are allowed for this discount. I used the Polish card and it was accepted without any problems. The Norwegian friend (Norway is not in the EU) used a German card and it was accepted too

Later, our friend from China, also having a German student ID, joined us. For her, we didn't risk buying a ticket with a discount allowed for EU citizens only, the ticket inspector could get curious about her nationality And anyway, she was in Budapest for 3 days only, and a three-day pass was enough for her.


Polish public transport authorities, as well as the railway, also have discounts for students, but they usually accept Polish students IDs only. And ISIC cards too, but it's not a typical student ID, rather just a discount card. Euro26 cards are not accepted.

The explanation is that it's impossible for a ticket inspector or the conductor on the train to know all the templates of student IDs from all the countries around the world.

By the way, while in Poland, the template of a student ID is fixed by law:





and the ID has to be prolonged every semester - so that a student who leaves the university before graduating will not be able to use the card for the discounts:



in Germany, each university has its own template. And there is no prolongation each semester. The ID has just a single expiry date. It should be returned when you are leaving the university - although technically it's possible to find a workaround to that. Like claiming that you have lost your ID.

Some transport authorities in Poland allow using foreign student cards if the student can show a certified translation of the card to Polish. But... the German ID I had looked like this:



On the rear side, there was just a commercial advertisement.

What to translate from this card? Just the word "Matrikel Nr."? Or the commercial on the rear side?
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Old March 23rd, 2017, 11:19 AM   #15070
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I remember leaving when 14. I had my passport but as back-up I had my ID card and "mother's agreement" (then it was enough one father or mother agreement and it is signed in a police station).

Nowadays, due to restricted laws, for ID card is enough father or mother agreement but both for passport or allowance to travel abroad.

Another issue is the birth document (Required for first ID card or passport, for instance). It can be asked only by parents... or grandparents with authorization. In addition it can be asked by internet... but with your passwords. I know one person who was born in the last island in Canary and I always say him to ask a document each time he goes there... maybe will be needed in the future and not easy to ask nowadays.


I wasn't born in my homecity and it was enough a phone call from my parents to a friends and they asked that document without authorization.


Today or tomorrow I will ask if being with both parents within Schengen, parents' agreement is needed.
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Old March 23rd, 2017, 11:53 AM   #15071
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Quote:
Originally Posted by italystf View Post
However, I'm concerned about the possible effects that border fences can have on wildlife and biodiversity. Since they can't be crossed by terrestrial animals, they may change the environmental equilibrium of the area in some decades.
But it's also stopping epidemics from spreading, like I mention.

Quote:
Originally Posted by koko_vp
One more great benefit from the fence is that stops the herds of infected wild animals from Turkey carrying Foot-and-mouth disease (Aphthae epizooticae), causing thousands of euros in losses to the Bulgarian farmers.
There is no cure for the Aphthae epizooticae and the only way to stop the disease from spreading is to put down all of the infected livestock and burying them. One news from 2011
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Old March 23rd, 2017, 03:26 PM   #15072
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Quote:
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That only works if you are an Irish or UK citizen.
Not at all. I am an EU citizen and I don't carry the passport within the EU.

I can go to Bulgaria or Croatia with my plastic ID as well.
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Old March 23rd, 2017, 03:45 PM   #15073
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Not at all. I am an EU citizen and I don't carry the passport within the EU.

I can go to Bulgaria or Croatia with my plastic ID as well.
Do you know that EU citizens can enter Macedonia, Montenegro, Serbia, Bosnia&Hercegovina, Albania and Kosovo with ID as well?
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Old March 23rd, 2017, 03:58 PM   #15074
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Already asked.... no need for further documentation for kids providing they travel within Schengen area and both parents are with them (and all of them have their ID cards)

About passports, they require both father and mother signature. Regarding problem to go at the same time to police station, they offer first of them goes and signs (but sample form cannot quit police station). Second one will go and allowance of the first one is already given.
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Old March 23rd, 2017, 07:48 PM   #15075
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Passport at the police station? What does the police have to do with passports, except for that they are entitled to check them?

In Poland, ID cards are issued by city/town/municipality offices, passports by voivodeship offices.

So you usually have to go to a bigger city to apply for a passport.

Polish citizens can enter Serbia with IDs only. It's probably the same with all the EU.

Possibility to enter a country with ID only and no passport doesn't depend on the membership in the Schengen area, but on the membership in the EU. Or on additional agreements if the country is not in the EU. If it's in Schengen, but not in the EU, it has to be possible too, there is just no other way.
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Old March 24th, 2017, 01:55 AM   #15076
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Quote:
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Not at all. I am an EU citizen and I don't carry the passport within the EU.

I can go to Bulgaria or Croatia with my plastic ID as well.
He was talking about driving licence, not ID.
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Old March 24th, 2017, 02:54 AM   #15077
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Quote:
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Not at all. I am an EU citizen and I don't carry the passport within the EU.

I can go to Bulgaria or Croatia with my plastic ID as well.
But you wouldn't be able to enter Ireland with a driving licence unless you're a British or Irish citizen I don't think.

Oh sorry, I didn't see Verso's post.
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Old March 24th, 2017, 04:42 AM   #15078
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Correct!
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Old March 24th, 2017, 09:29 AM   #15079
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Quote:
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Passport at the police station? What does the police have to do with passports, except for that they are entitled to check them?
In many countries, passports are issued by the police.

Quote:
In Poland, ID cards are issued by city/town/municipality offices, passports by voivodeship offices.
Believe me, there are other countries than Poland, too.
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Old March 24th, 2017, 12:19 PM   #15080
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Passport at the police station? What does the police have to do with passports, except for that they are entitled to check them?

To ask for one new or renewal, in Spain, ID cards and passports are issued by police (and driving licence by traffic authorities). Thus, any issue about them, police station (and not all of them).
To avoid queues, in some of them it is compulsory to ask an appointment by internet.

I just walked near one of them and entered to ask in the desk
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