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Old July 5th, 2017, 02:19 AM   #15501
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Old July 5th, 2017, 02:45 PM   #15502
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Those countries may be smaller except for Serbia but sure not weaker
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Old July 5th, 2017, 04:38 PM   #15503
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Junkie View Post
I never understood why Slovenia and Hungary threat with fences to other weaker european countries.
How can a fence, which according to its very purpose is unable to move, and being completely located on the territory of one country, be any threat to any other country?
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Old July 5th, 2017, 05:24 PM   #15504
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Originally Posted by OulaL View Post
How can a fence, which according to its very purpose is unable to move, and being completely located on the territory of one country, be any threat to any other country?
Because in this case the Balkan countries in the middle of Europe are not threat to anyone. We are not migrants or immigrants. And these countries even don't have equal rights like the rest of the european countries and as you can see people react to these fences because its 2017, not 1980 or something like that.
Its funny how the very democratic Hungary is erecting a fortified electric voltage fence and at the same time accuse others (Balkan countries) for not doing their job to stop the Syrian flow. But I think the intention along with these fences is to take lives!
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Brexit is a disaster for Europe because of the English language itself!

The Western Balkans is already in Europe i.e., it is in the heart of Europe and all of these nations want and deserve to have the same chance,
the same security and the same rights as all other citizens of the European family, right on their own continent."

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Old July 5th, 2017, 06:32 PM   #15505
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What's the problem with the fence? If you have the right to go to Hungary (or Schengen area in general), then you show your documents at the border and proceed. If you don't have that right, then you are not allowed to enter. The fence is there to prevent people from doing things that they have never had right to do anyway.

A sovereign country has the right to decide, who enters its territory in addition to its own citizens, and who does not. Nothing has happened concerning the question on who has the right to enter.
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Old July 5th, 2017, 06:42 PM   #15506
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Magyars even wrote on Arabic about the danger of high voltage
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Brexit is a disaster for Europe because of the English language itself!

The Western Balkans is already in Europe i.e., it is in the heart of Europe and all of these nations want and deserve to have the same chance,
the same security and the same rights as all other citizens of the European family, right on their own continent."

BEEN IN:
MK A AL B BiH BG HR CZ EST F FIN D GR H I LT MNE NL SRB SK SLO E TR PL RKS
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Old July 5th, 2017, 06:55 PM   #15507
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OulaL View Post
How can a fence, which according to its very purpose is unable to move, and being completely located on the territory of one country, be any threat to any other country?
Because people think that freedom means allowing people going everywhere and doing anything, doesn't matter if illegally.
People all know that Schengen means freedom of movement within member states. But they tend to ignore that it also implies to control the outer border.
Spain built a fence too on the border with Morocco, but nobody blames it, maybe because its government isn't 'rebel' towards EU like the Hungarian one.
I personally don't have simpathy for Donald Trump (for things like xenophoby, denial or global warming, etc...), but I don't like how European media portrayed him as the worst guy in the Earth for building the wall with Mexico, ignoring that the wall was started by Bush and continued by Obama (but these two were OK for European politicians, so they had the right to build the wall).

Those walls do not interfere in any way in the possibility for honest people of any citizenship to travel between Spain and Marocco, Hungary and Serbia, or USA or Mexico. Wall or not wall, you still have to deal with passports, border crossings, custom and so on. It's not anything like the Iron Curtain, the Korean DMZ, the Israeli-Palestine separation wall, or the Cypriot buffer zone until 2000 or so, that effectively banned/still ban millions of people to travel.
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In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.

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Old July 5th, 2017, 08:52 PM   #15508
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Czech saying "thanks God"? uhmmm, not really.
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Old July 5th, 2017, 11:57 PM   #15509
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You can not cross a border without documents, so simple it is. For 40 years ago you perhaps would have been shot now you find a fence at the H border.
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Old July 6th, 2017, 12:43 AM   #15510
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EL Paso/Juarez (USA/MEX)


El Paso, Texas
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Old July 6th, 2017, 12:52 AM   #15511
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Chamizal National Memorial

Chamizal National Memorial commemorates the peaceful resolution of a 100 year old border dispute between the United States and Mexico. It was caused by the changing course of Rio Grande
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Old July 6th, 2017, 01:03 AM   #15512
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Chamizal National Memorial

Chamizal National Memorial commemorates the peaceful resolution of a 100 year old border dispute between the United States and Mexico. It was caused by the changing course of Rio Grande


Chamizal National Memorial
by Jasperdo, en Flickr
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Last edited by Nikkodemo; July 6th, 2017 at 01:09 AM.
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Old July 6th, 2017, 01:11 AM   #15513
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Chamizal National Memorial

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Old July 6th, 2017, 01:14 AM   #15514
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Chamizal National Memorial

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Old July 6th, 2017, 02:15 AM   #15515
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Junkie View Post
Magyars even wrote on Arabic about the danger of high voltage
Translation:
"Touch here to win a prize!"
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Old July 6th, 2017, 02:28 AM   #15516
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Junkie View Post
Because in this case the Balkan countries in the middle of Europe are not threat to anyone. We are not migrants or immigrants.
As you know very well, the border fortification at Hungary's Schengen external border is not in any way against Balkan countries' citizens (save for Kosovans w/o valid Schengen visa who were walking in before the Middle Eastern wave started). It is against the uncontrollable illegal immigration across the green border. Which was fuelled by Greece, Macedonia and Serbia not stopping the flow at their southern borders (which is, admittedly, difficult in case of islands). Macedonia improved a lot though when they became aware of the Serbia -> EU outflow slowing down.

Hungary does not regard SRB, MK, BIH, AL, .... citizen visitors as any form of general "threat", and none of them are impeded by the fence to access the Schengen space.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Junkie View Post
Its funny how the very democratic Hungary is erecting a fortified electric voltage fence and at the same time accuse others (Balkan countries) for not doing their job to stop the Syrian flow. But I think the intention along with these fences is to take lives!
1- It's not funny, it was a necessity - at the taxpayer's burden.
2- It's not the "Syrian flow", it's a general flow of migrants not honoring their obligations to co-operate with authorities (e.g. in Greece, who direct them to reception centers there). As much as 70% of these migrants are not Syrian.
3- It is a fact that GR, MK, SRB were lenient about the defense of their own borders. Especially SRB government simply relied on the incoming stream just leaving for the EU, which is exactly what happened - before the border fortifications.
4- "Intention along with these fences is to take lives" - simply trolling, or can you elaborate on that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Junkie View Post
Magyars even wrote on Arabic about the danger of high voltage
Again, nothing funny, it is a fact that many of those attempting to cross illegally are literate in Arabic. Sign helps them to avoid unwanted consequences of attacking the fence.
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Old July 6th, 2017, 02:51 PM   #15517
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You should blame Greece for not taking any steps to stop the flow, because they are in the same club as is your country and Slovenia, etc...
Although I personally don't blame them, the Balkan countries are NOT in that club and are constantly ignored and pushed in the corner. These countries received zero help from the rest, and legally they were NOT obliged to help your prestige club or whatever, because they are NOT in the same position and their citizens have NO equal rights as your citizens or Greek or Slovenian citizens. These countries even don't get any basic help from the rest of the so called western civilized european world. That said these small countries only tried to save their own land from harassment and were caught in the fire because some very prosperous, democratic and liberal countries like Hungary or Greece did not manage to stop the fire train coming from Syria.
Your barbed wire and glorified electric fence only shows that your government is ready to shoot just anyone that will cross illegally. It could also be citizens from your neighbouring countries as well which is AGAINST all the international conventions.
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Brexit is a disaster for Europe because of the English language itself!

The Western Balkans is already in Europe i.e., it is in the heart of Europe and all of these nations want and deserve to have the same chance,
the same security and the same rights as all other citizens of the European family, right on their own continent."

BEEN IN:
MK A AL B BiH BG HR CZ EST F FIN D GR H I LT MNE NL SRB SK SLO E TR PL RKS
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Old July 6th, 2017, 03:46 PM   #15518
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Do you want to be elected in some Macedonian elections? Your post sounds like some campaign speech. If I were a Macedonian, I surely would vote for you.
However, it has - what a surprise - nothing to do with border crossings.
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Old July 6th, 2017, 09:56 PM   #15519
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Can we please stop this bickering about migrants and get back to some border images please?
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Old July 7th, 2017, 02:25 AM   #15520
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"New" border between Slovenia and Croatia. A Slovenian concrete factory by Hotiza now belongs to Croatia.


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