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Old September 8th, 2017, 09:48 PM   #15821
Ermir
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Quote:
Originally Posted by italystf View Post
In NE Italy I can see plates from pretty much all over EE. Not every day, of course, but from time to time yes. Except Kosovo. I've even seen a car from Transnistria in Austria.
SLO, HR, RO, H, CZ, SK, PL are all very common.
You're certainly not supporting your previous comment here.

La geografia non č un opinione. Kosovo is Balkans, those countries are Central Europe.
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Old September 8th, 2017, 09:59 PM   #15822
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Or you may buy Grundig portable radio cassette recorder all compatible with the West, although the FM frequency was 69-87 MHz instead of 88-108 MHz
There is an interesting story here. FM in Poland was initially, in the late 1950s, introduced on the western band (so called CCIR). Although it was the beginnings and there was rather no receivers available. The change to the eastern band (so called OIRT) took place in the early 1960s.

But most Polish radio stuff was constructed in such a way that it could be easily converted to the western band.

Another interesting thing was that in the beginnings of commercial radio stations in Poland, some of them were broadcasting on the western band from the beginning - because the eastern band was already too crowded. In those times, the radio market wasn't regulated by law yet, so many new private stations were appearing. And transmitting without any official license. They quickly filled the whole eastern band. And, anyway, receivers from the west appeared on the market - thanks to them, it was possible to listen to stations broadcasting on the western band.

Later, after the market got regulated, many stations, including the state radio, were broadcasting in both bands simultaneously. The eastern band was officially used in Poland to 2000, but some stations left it in 2004.

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Originally Posted by darko06 View Post
With the television there was another but similar issue. Soviet bloc imposed SECAM (French De Gaulle's standard) instead of PAL, again to make the Western TV program unwatchable. Today only France, Russia, Moldova and Belarus, and finally of course all former French colonies in Africa (Morocco, Tunisia, etc. etc.) have SECAM as TV standard. The Americans, Canada, Mexico, Western South America, Japan, Korea, Taiwan, Thailand and Philipinnes have NTSC.
Well, no longer Most of those counties have already converted to digital TV and don't broadcast in SECAM/PAL/NTSC any more.

In Poland, the first state TV channel was broadcasting from 1952. The second one started in 1970. And the first color broadcast was on the second channel in 1971. Of course, in SECAM.

And the first channel to convert from SECAM to PAL was the second one - in 1994.

It seems that the eastern-European countries were more advanced technologically than the USA, converting from SECAM to PAL, while the US kept their "Never The Same Color" till the very end.

By the way, concerning the differences between the Eastern Bloc (exactly - Poland) and the west (in this case - it's rather north), this is a very interesting reading: https://www.fly4free.pl/forum/szwecj...987,1507,80702

Sorry that it's in Polish, but maybe it will be at least partially understandable for those from former Czechoslovakia and Yugoslavia...

A story of a Polish student which went for a student exchange to... Sweden. In 1987.
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Last edited by Kpc21; September 8th, 2017 at 10:08 PM.
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Old September 8th, 2017, 11:03 PM   #15823
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darko06 View Post
Soviet bloc imposed SECAM instead of PAL, again to make the Western TV program unwatchable.
Such operations tend to fail.

Finland opened a new TV mast close to Helsinki in 1971. Its height was about 360 meters over the sea level, thus making the Finnish TV visible in Tallinn and the other northern Estonia. Quite soon, that area was filled with PAL to SECAM converters ("soome plokk") available at the black market. It has been speculated that ability to watch the western programs over the Finnish network was one of the reasons why the eastern system collapsed.

One key person to create dissatisfaction in Estonia was Väinö Purje ("K-Kaupan Väiski"), who was the actor in food commercials of a supermarket chain for 12 years. The availability of meat was not good in Estonia while the people saw TV commercials full of food. The official propaganda told that Väiski was an agent of CIA, and the meat in the commercials was made of plastic, because Finns cannot afford meat.

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Old September 8th, 2017, 11:33 PM   #15824
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Funny

Meanwhile, the Polish propaganda, for some time, was claiming that the plague of potato beetle, damaging our potato fields, was caused by... Americans dropping those insects from aeroplanes.



Quote:
Criminal American provocation
over the territory of the German Democratic Republic

The USA airplanes dropping potato beetles

The answer of the Democratic Germany to the attack of American gangsters will be even stricter FIGHT FOR PEACE
But considering the transmitter masts and towers, we were a king. Polish state radio on the long waves could be listened not only in the whole Europe, but sometimes even in North America. Thanks to...



The tallest mast ever erected by human. The only half-wave long waves transmitter antenna in the world. The tallest construction in the world ever built before Burj Khalifa in Dubai. 646 meters tall.

Built in 1974, collapsed in 1991.
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Old September 8th, 2017, 11:34 PM   #15825
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Originally Posted by italystf View Post
I've never seen a Kosovan licence plate. I think it's strange because there's plenty of Kosovan immigrants in Italy and plates from other countries of the region can easily be spotted here.
I was on holiday in Greece this year. Northern coast. Seen a plenty of Kosovan plates, either KS or RKS or SRB (especially "KM" district code).

It really fascinates me, seeing such cars standing next to each other. It is possible only outside Serbia/Kosovo
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Old September 8th, 2017, 11:38 PM   #15826
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....A few years ago there was an idea to withdraw the 1 gr, 2 gr and 5 gr coins (I am not sure about 5 gr), because the cost of manufacturing them was higher than what they are worth. And they are often used because supermarkets like to set prices of products like 14,99 zł instead of 15 zł to make it look cheaper....
Re retailers: Canada withdrew its 1-cent coin some years ago, but you can still see prices like $8.98. If you pay with a card, it processes at the exact amount; if you're paying in cash, they'll round to the nearest multiple of 5 cents (which is the smallest-denomination remaining coin): Pay for that $8.98 item with a $10 bill, they'll round up and you'll get a dollar in change; pay with a $10 bill for an item priced at $8.97, you'll get $1.05.
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Old September 8th, 2017, 11:41 PM   #15827
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Quote:
Originally Posted by volodaaaa View Post
I was on holiday in Greece this year. Northern coast. Seen a plenty of Kosovan plates, either KS or RKS or SRB (especially "KM" district code).
Just curious, what kind of cars do Kosovans own nowadays in general? (German (VW, Opel, etc) I guess, but.. )
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Old September 8th, 2017, 11:42 PM   #15828
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Originally Posted by parcdesprinces View Post
Just curious, what kind of cars do Kosovans own nowadays in general? (German (VW, Opel) I guess, but.. )
Used ones. I guess the year ranging from 2004 to 2010. Some were in better condition some in worse. And yes, most of them were VW.
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Old September 8th, 2017, 11:44 PM   #15829
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Originally Posted by Kpc21 View Post
Meanwhile, the Polish propaganda, for some time, was claiming that the plague of potato beetle, damaging our potato fields, was caused by... Americans dropping those insects from aeroplanes.
A Polish news reel from 1950 about the insect:



The script:

Quote:
Postępowa opinia całego świata należycie oceniła zbrodnie lotników amerykańskich, którzy zrzucili ogromne ilości stonki ziemniaczanej na pola Niemieckiej Republiki Demokratycznej. Na skutek burz i wiatrów, stonka przedostała się na terytorium Polski. Oto żuk Kolorado, zwany inaczej stonką ziemniaczaną. Jest nie tylko żarłoczny, ale również niesłychanie płodny - w okresie 18 miesięcy jedna samica daje początek kilku miliardom nowych szkodników.

Ministerstwo Rolnictwa natychmiast przystąpiło do likwidacji nalotowych ognisk groźnego szkodnika. Podstawowym sposobem zwalczania stonki jest skrupulatna lustracja pól. W akcji bierze udział młodzież. Trzeba być uważnym i czujnym. Stonka musi być wytępiona!

Tereny zagrożone spryskuje się specjalnym płynem, którego dostarczają stacje ochrony roślin.

W całym pasie przybrzeżnym panuje stan pogotowia. Porywiste wiatry sprzyjają inwazji szkodnika od strony morza.

Ale zorganizowana akcja społeczeństwa likwiduje groźbę w zarodku. W okolicach Szczecina tyraliery poszukiwaczy stonki nieustannie badają wybrzeże. Do akcji zmobilizowano również lotnictwo.

Azotox - proszek, który niesie śmierć stonce. Amerykańskiemu żukowi nie powiedzie się ani w Polsce, ani w Niemczech. Prowokacja podżegaczy wojennych spali na panewce. Wszyscy do walki ze stonką!
Quote:
The progressing opinion of the whole world correctly assessed the crimes of the American pilots, who dropped huge amounts of the potato beetle on the fields of German Democratic Republic. As a result of storms and winds, the beetle got onto the territory of Poland. This is the Colorado beetle, known also as potato beetle. It is not only voracious, but also incredibly prolific - in a period of 18 months one female gives birth to a few billions of new pests.

Ministry of Agriculture immediately started liquidation of the spreading centers of the dangerous pest. The basic method of eradicating the insect is meticulous inspection of fields. Youth takes part in the action. You have to be careful and vigilant. The beetle must be eradicated!

The endangered areas are sprayed with a special liquid, which is being provided by crop protection stations.

State of emergency in the whole coastal area. Heavy winds favor invasion of the pest from the sea.

But the organized action of the society nips the danger in the bud. In the area of Szczecin, lines of beetle seekers are constantly patrolling the coast. The airforce was also mobilized into the action.

Azotox /DDT/ - the powder which brings death to the beetle. The American insect will not succeed neither in Poland, nor in Germany. The provocation of the war instigator will fail. Everyone fight with the beetle!

Last edited by Kpc21; September 9th, 2017 at 12:07 AM.
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Old September 8th, 2017, 11:45 PM   #15830
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Kosovo citizens can visit only four countries visa-free these are Macedonia, Albania, Montenegro and Turkey.
It is strange that they go to Greece but I have seen some cars since they pass from here down to the Aegean sea.... And remember they can't enter Serbia so it is hard for them to transit to western Europe.
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The Western Balkans is already in Europe i.e., it is in the heart of Europe and all of these nations want and deserve to have the same chance,
the same security and the same rights as all other citizens of the European family, right on their own continent."

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MK A AL B BiH BG HR CZ EST F FIN D GR H I LT MNE NL SRB SK SLO E TR PL RKS
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Old September 8th, 2017, 11:49 PM   #15831
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Originally Posted by Junkie View Post
Kosovo citizens can visit only four countries visa-free these are Macedonia, Albania, Montenegro and Turkey.
It is strange that they go to Greece but I have seen some cars since they pass from here down to the Aegean sea.... And remember they can't enter Serbia so it is hard for them to transit to western Europe.
They may switch to KS plates which are recognized in Serbia
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Old September 8th, 2017, 11:52 PM   #15832
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Originally Posted by Ermir View Post
You're certainly not supporting your previous comment here.

La geografia non č un opinione. Kosovo is Balkans, those countries are Central Europe.
Ok, but even plates from Albania, Serbia, Bosnia, Macedonia and even the small Montenegro are spotted there occasionally (Albanian plates are easy to miss as they are similar to our). Kosovo nothing.
And it's a 2-million-people country 'only' 1000km away from here, so I think it's weird.
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In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old September 8th, 2017, 11:58 PM   #15833
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Originally Posted by volodaaaa View Post
They may switch to KS plates which are recognized in Serbia
Dude I was speaking on the last page about UNMIK's role in Kosovo during and after the war... So those plates were issued by this body from the United Nations. As you can see they have new plates now....
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Brexit is a disaster for Europe because of the English language itself!

The Western Balkans is already in Europe i.e., it is in the heart of Europe and all of these nations want and deserve to have the same chance,
the same security and the same rights as all other citizens of the European family, right on their own continent."

BEEN IN:
MK A AL B BiH BG HR CZ EST F FIN D GR H I LT MNE NL SRB SK SLO E TR PL RKS
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Old September 9th, 2017, 12:14 AM   #15834
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Originally Posted by darko06 View Post
With the television there was another but similar issue. Soviet bloc imposed SECAM
(French De Gaulle's standard; from German Wikipedia: "Die Entwicklung von SECAM in Frankreich war politisch motiviert, um die einheimische Geräteindustrie vor Importen zu schützen. In diesem Zusammenhang wird die Abkürzung scherzhaft als „Systčme élégant contre l’Amérique“, (dt. „Elegantes System gegen Amerika“) gedeutet. ... Wegen des oben erwähnten „SECAM-Feuers“ wurde SECAM scherzhaft auch mit „System Even Crueler (than the) American Method“ (Ein noch grausameres System (als die) amerikanische Methode) übersetzt.")
instead of PAL, again to make the Western TV program unwatchable. Today only France, Russia, Moldova and Belarus, and finally of course all former French colonies in Africa (Morocco, Tunisia, etc. etc.) have SECAM as TV standard. The Americans, Canada, Mexico, Western South America, Japan, Korea, Taiwan, Thailand and Philipinnes have NTSC.
"Systčme élégant contre l'Amérique" - I've never heard that. Vive la France [rolleyes]. But is anyone using SECAM, NTSC or PAL any more with analog gone?
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Old September 9th, 2017, 12:16 AM   #15835
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Originally Posted by Penn's Woods View Post
"Systčme élégant contre l'Amérique" - I've never heard that.
Me neither. ()


Anyway, we're all using HDMI now, no? ...
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Old September 9th, 2017, 12:18 AM   #15836
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Originally Posted by MattiG View Post
Such operations tend to fail.

Finland opened a new TV mast close to Helsinki in 1971. Its height was about 360 meters over the sea level, thus making the Finnish TV visible in Tallinn and the other northern Estonia. Quite soon, that area was filled with PAL to SECAM converters ("soome plokk") available at the black market. It has been speculated that ability to watch the western programs over the Finnish network was one of the reasons why the eastern system collapsed.

One key person to create dissatisfaction in Estonia was Väinö Purje ("K-Kaupan Väiski"), who was the actor in food commercials of a supermarket chain for 12 years. The availability of meat was not good in Estonia while the people saw TV commercials full of food. The official propaganda told that Väiski was an agent of CIA, and the meat in the commercials was made of plastic, because Finns cannot afford meat.

Are Finnish and Estonian mutually intelligible?
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Old September 9th, 2017, 12:19 AM   #15837
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Originally Posted by Kpc21 View Post
A Polish news reel from 1950 about the insect:



The script:
I would think American planes dropping anything over Poland or East Germany in the 50s would have gotten a reaction....
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Old September 9th, 2017, 12:26 AM   #15838
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Originally Posted by Penn's Woods View Post
Are Finnish and Estonian mutually intelligible?
No, but because of the former influence of the Finnish TV, Finnish was widely understood in Tallinn. Nowadays not that widely any more. Estonian is typically not understood in Finland.

As a rule of thumb, one third of the words are the same, and one third are different. The last one third is a challenge: same words but a different meaning.
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Old September 9th, 2017, 12:27 AM   #15839
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Originally Posted by Penn's Woods View Post
"Systčme élégant contre l'Amérique" - I've never heard that. Vive la France [rolleyes]. But is anyone using SECAM, NTSC or PAL any more with analog gone?
Of course nowadays everyone use digital television. I just wanted to express how I was surprised when obtaining information that the former Soviet bloc basically had different yet Western-engineered standard for black/white analog TV broadcasting. I cited the German Wikipedia because I initially found there the article about SECAM when surfing the Internet.

However, the English Wikipedia has another bit of information:
"Nonetheless, SECAM was partly developed for reasons of national pride. Henri de France's personal charisma and ambition may have been a contributing factor. PAL was developed by Telefunken, a German company, and in the post-war De Gaulle era there would have been much political resistance to dropping a French-developed system and adopting a German-developed one instead."
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Old September 9th, 2017, 12:33 AM   #15840
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I started to say I thought I'd read that SECAM was a reaction to the PAL standard in some way, and that it had something to do with Germany, but I wasn't sure, so I stopped.

That said, I think there are still differences in standards even with digital television. The U.S. uses something called A.T.S.C., and I've seen articles about problems picking up German stations in Alsace (and vice versa, I guess) because Germany's rolling out a HD standard that isn't compatible with France.... something like that... But we're off topic again.
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