Rays planning new ballpark?

[FLHawk]

Although the local media has focused on the downtown Channelside spot being considered by some as a potential future home for the Rays, the Central Park site is also under consideration.

Go to http://builditdowntowntampa.org and select "Winter 2010 News and Updates." This will open up a Powerpoint file that shows two maps - one for Channelside and one around the old Central Park location.

[Jasonhouse]

They don't have to pay for that study. I already figured out the answer almost a year ago.

[soholivin]

Originally Posted by Jasonhouse

Imo, if a stadium is developed in Tampa, it will most likely be in Central Park, the old Tampa Bay One site, or maybe on the SW corner of Columbus and Dale Mabry.

can you post a map of where this is (Central Park)?

[TampaMike]

Originally Posted by soholivin

can you post a map of where this is (Central Park)?

http://www.tampagov.net/dept_economi...Aerial_map.asp

[joey7f]

Putting the stadium between Downtown and Ybor would be awesome(central to most of Tampa, soon to be transit hub, etc) . I could picture a very interesting looking stadium to mesh with the Ybor style. Kind of an Ybor Wrigley Field.

Btw, opening day is a week from today!

--Joey

[lamsalfl]

I'm very familiar with the rest of Florida but sadly I've only been to the bay area twice. Once via the Suncoast Pkwy to buy a Rays AL Champs shirt then due east to Orlando. (I'm a Rays and Marlins fan from New Orleans and I made a detour on my way to my friend's house in Orlando.) And then last year I went to a Rays game (Orlando to Sarasota then up to St. Pete... explored coastal Pinellas before the game as well). Very impressed with downtown Tampa btw...

Anyway, what is considered the heart of the Bay Area as far as population? Is the geographical center (Frankland Bridge?) different from the population center? From a map you've got the Sarasota area... Pasco... Pinellas.. and everything east of I-75. I'm just an outsider trying to gain a little more perspective.

[joey7f]

I would say the center of Tampa (population wise) is probably where Raymond James Stadium is. What we consider our center to be is weird. I remember hearing from an urban planning professor that when the Bucs won the Superbowl, no one knew where to go. Do we celebrate in Ybor? Channelside? Downtown? The Stadium?

Good start for the Rays this year

--Joe

[tampasteve]

Yes, the city of Tampa is def. the population and ecomonic center of the region. As for where that center is...well I would agree somewhere around Ray Jay. However, with the LR and new residential buildings in DT Tampa I believe it may shift a bit south towards DT. In 30 years it could be profoundly different with a much more dense core....or not depending on how our leaders react to the coming world.

Steve

[TampaMike]

ACtually, that brings up a great point. There is seriously no area near by for Bucs fans to drink up before a game or party after a game in that area. The closest I would say is International Plaza, but they don't really offer anything for the sports fans unlike SPTF with Hooters and a couple other joints.

[John F]

In the football environment, it's expected to be done through tailgating. "Do it on your own" type stuff. Are ANY NFL stadiums located in entertainment districts?

It's different with MLB and the NHL/NBA and their venue locations and the party atmosphere pre/post game.

While I've been involved in discussions for years about activity surrounding a sports venue, the discussion has never been aobut a Football stadium's effects and the type of establishments it spawns.

[TampaMike]

Atlanta Falcons don't really have much of parking lots don't handle tailgating. And I'm not saying we should het rid of all the parking lots, or maybe none at all, but many football stadiums are nearby to the main city (Jacksonville, Atlanta, Cincy, etc) and have the privilege to offer their fans restaurants and bars to go after or before. Raymond James doesn't offer that and really doesn't offer much without having to jump in a car and drive to International Plaza. And if RJ and the TBSA actually built a parking lot instead of putting cars on grass, they could probably fit more cars on since you have them drivers who don't know how to park properly.

I'll make up a concept idea of what I would do with the whole area. Something that Bucs fan, Yank fans, and HCC students can all use in that area.

[John F]

I'm certainly not trying to argue with you here -- you make a point about the location and (like has been said) how it is a central location in the area... But while you cited Jacksonville and Cincy and Atlanta, what about New York and the swamps of Jersey? Or KC? Denver? The Pats stadium in Boston?

Atlanta's a much more urban location. And there has been talk about replacing georgia Dome (already! Ugh!) with a new venue in the suburbs. Jacksonville is a reconstructed Gator Bowl that had been int eh city center... Cincy (like Pittsburgh and Philly and Seattle) has several venues close by, so while the buildings are not multi-purpose, teh locations serve as such.

RJS/Steinbrenner Field don't draw enough bodies between them year-round to afford a solid number of support businesses (nightlife, restaurants, whatever). Those cities I cited, do. I don't know Atlanta too well but isn't Phillips arena nearby?

Jasonhouse has cited that there should be more stuff in that area around RJS before... Probably many years ago now. But he has brought it up.

Whatever the case, I think the Glazers have first rights / first profit to the lots. So anything that was built would be padding their coffers. I could be wrong, it's been years since I heard anything about the lease at RJS.

[Jahi98]

The football season is so short compared to other sports. Residential would need to densify to support retail and entertainment venues on a year-round basis.

As for the Rays, I think the City of St. Pete needs to go ahead and come to the negotiating table now on a new stadium. Let the Rays buy out of their contract for 2027 and build something new in Gateway (ie. Toytown). Then let a developer (or developers) redevelop the Trop property. I'm all for a new transit hub with accompanying TOD. It'll keep the Rays in St. Pete (since that's really what the City wants) and puts the stadium in a more central location. I believe it will be a swap of municipal land for municipal land (no referendum needed), and it would put the Trop land to its highest and best use.

[Jasonhouse]

Originally Posted by John F

While I've been involved in discussions for years about activity surrounding a sports venue, the discussion has never been aobut a Football stadium's effects and the type of establishments it spawns.

That's because football stadiums don't spawn jack, unless they have multiple tenants and plenty of other activities going on there. (which Ray Jay pretty much does)

Regardless, RayJay is a compelling location for commercial retail and hotel development, because of the proximity to the existing Westshore district, and the fact that Westshore's boundaries have been extended up Dale Mabry, all the way to Hillsborough... The old Tampa Bay Center site was p-e-r-f-e-c-t for a town center style urban mixed-use development, that could later tie into transit and function as a TOD. Especially since there is a huge hospital on one side, and an office park capable of being densified on another.

[TampaMike]

Georgia Dome does have Phillips Center nearby and does also have the extra help from Atlanta's commuter rail to be easily connected with a good number of Atlanta residents. Shame for RJS that it won't be connected by anything but buses for a good while from now.

If we look at the four seasons, half are busy and half is pretty much dead.

Winter:
-End of NFL season (Could last longer if they make it to the Play-offs
-Spring Semester for HCC
Spring:
-Yankee Spring Training
-Spring Semester HCC
Summer:
-Summer courses at HCC
-Training at Buc Place One
Fall:
-NFL Season
-Fall Semester at HCC

So I do agree we need some residential projects in the area to make more demand for this. Be also cool once the second terminal at TIA is built that the city builds a circular line from TIA east to RJS south to Westshore and back to TIA.

[Jasonhouse]

^I wouldn't hold your breath for much residential... If anything, expect more office, retail and hotel space in the area right around RayJay.

[joey7f]

Personally, I think putting a stadium anywhere but Tampa is a mistake. There is such a mental block for Tampa residents about going over the big bridges that they would serve themselves well to put a stadium in a place like where Tampa Heights or Encore would be (or between Ybor and Downtown).

Like was said earlier, since baseball has a long season with many games played during the week, you want an area that already has people there (eg Downtown) near where people live so that a 10:30 end time still gets people home and asleep by midnight (or sooner).

--Joe

[lamsalfl]

We had a similar problem on 2-7-10 as what y'all are saying. Everyone was wondering where to go to watch the Super Bowl! Downtown? The Quarter? Warehouse District? Magazine St? Carrollton? University Area? The Marigny neighborhood?

One of the beauties about the Superdome (despite its long history and versatility for events) is its location. It's within walking distance of 25,000 hotel rooms (many of those being 4 and 5 stars), world class restaurants, bars and live music venues, etc. You don't need to drive anywhere once you're downtown or the Warehouse District unless you want to go to historic neighborhoods Uptown and see everything that has to offer. It's one reason why N.O. is hosting is 10th Super Bowl. Dallas is about to host its FIRST. Who wants to vacation in Dallas??? The Super Bowl should have a set permanent rotation of New Orleans, Miami, San Diego, perhaps Tampa and Phoenix. But NEVER should it go to Detroit, Dallas, etc. Gag.

[JBrisco]

At least Dallas has mass transit. And an obvious care for architecture. Their Arts District has 5 Pritzker winning buildings.||

DOES Tampa have any pritzker winners or a mass transit system? Nope. What makes Tampa more deserving than Dallas?

Personally I'd rather go to Dallas, atleast I can take the D.A.R.T. WTF am I gonna do in Tampa with out a car?

I think the VENUE itself is more important than the city for the superbowl... just my 2 cents.

[John F]

Joe, you're an architecture student... You've got a busy life as is...

What would you do with a ballpark design (baseball) that we don't see with the numerous HOK designed parks that dominate baseball?