Puerto Rico Statehood and General Discussion

[Onn]

Originally Posted by davsot

O yea I didn't tell you. On January 4 was the governor's inauguration (?)(of Puerto Rico) and during this event a representative of Obama gave a message and he said he wanted to solve this in the next four years. gasp!

Wow, that has to be exciting for you then, whatever the outcome might be. This is not as difficult a issue to solve as many others he has to deal with, I expect Obama to get the process moving.

[aliendroid]

I like that funny joke about how americans only speak one language.

When Europeans start taking baths and stop smelling like they havn´t changed clothing in 3 weeks than maybe americans might want to learn another language to stay even but I´d rather be next to someone who takes a bath and speaks just one language than someone who speaks 8 languages and smells like pepe le pu.

[davsot]

what?

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic...

[Bori427]

Originally Posted by Onn

Wow, that has to be exciting for you then, whatever the outcome might be. This is not as difficult a issue to solve as many others he has to deal with, I expect Obama to get the process moving.

I doubt he solves it!

[Onn]

Originally Posted by Bori427

I doubt he solves it!

Well with the way Obama has been talking, you know, tackling the hard problems, solving the issues other presidents have avoided, getting the most bang for our buck, doing what is right for the country, you would think Puerto Rico would be on his list. Of course, I don't think he would initiate a dialogue with Congress until the economy is upright again, and that includes in the commonwealth.

[Bori427]

So hopefully in 2010???

[Onn]

Originally Posted by Bori427

So hopefully in 2010???

....During Obama's presidency, is probably more accurate. Obama has a lot on his plate, Puerto Rico is not the number one issue on his list. Improving the economy is most important, Iraqi and Afghanistan, improving global relations. If he could get that done by the end of his first term, he’ll probably get a second term, than I expect him to turn his attention towards the rest of his original agenda. But again, I don’t think Puerto Rico is as difficult to solve as many of the other problems he faces.

[Rastacoqui]

if something's not broken dont try to fix it

[Bori427]

Typical independence supporters that vote for the PPD party(Commonwealth).

[davsot]

Originally Posted by Rastacoqui

if something's not broken dont try to fix it

Well, the commonwealth status is a transition process. The government demands full healthcare benefits (among other things) that could easily be achieved by being a state. The island economy is broken, the utility company should be privatized cause it's doing a REALLY bad job at making us energy independent, and there are numerous landfills that are mismanaged.

Okay, the last sentence won't improve if we become a state. Look at the coal disaster in Tennessee.

[Bori427]

Puerto Rico, the 51st state?

Puerto Rico statehood referenda have been consistently, though narrowly, unsuccessful. In each referendum, statehood supporters are matched almost equally by supporters of maintaining the status quo (the balance of the votes being cast by supporters of full independence), although support for statehood has risen in each successive popular referendum.[4] If Puerto Rico were a U.S. state, it would rank 27th in population, and have six seats in the House of Representatives.[5][6][7] Puerto Rico has been under U.S. sovereignty for over a century and Puerto Ricans have been U.S. citizens since 1917; but the island’s ultimate status still has not been determined and its 3.9 million residents still do not have voting representation in their national government. Puerto Rico currently has limited representation in Congress in the form of a Resident Commissioner, a nonvoting delegate, and the current Congress had returned the Commissioner's power to vote in the Committee of the Whole, but not on matters where the vote would represent a decisive participation.[8] Puerto Rico has elections on the United States presidential primary or Caucus of the Democratic Party and the Republican Party to select delegates to the respective parties national conventions although presidential electors are not granted on the Electoral College.

Contrary to common misconception, residents of Puerto Rico pay U.S. federal taxes: import/export taxes, federal commodity taxes, social security taxes, etc. Most residents do not pay federal income tax but pay federal payroll taxes (Social Security and Medicare). However, federal employees, or those who do business with the federal government, Puerto Rico-based corporations that intend to send funds to the U.S. and others also pay federal income taxes. Puerto Ricans may enlist in the U.S. military. Puerto Ricans have fully participated in all U.S. wars since 1898. All persons born in Puerto Rico after 1941 are legally natural born citizens of the United States, one of the constitutional requirements to be President of the United States.[9][10][11]

President George H.W. Bush raised the statehood before Congress in his first State of the Union message:

There’s another issue that I’ve decided to mention here tonight. I’ve long believed that the people of Puerto Rico should have the right to determine their own political future. Personally, I strongly favor statehood. But I urge the Congress to take the necessary steps to allow the people to decide in a referendum.[12]

President George H. W. Bush issued a memorandum on November 30, 1992, to heads of executive departments and agencies establishing the current administrative relationship between the Federal Government and the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico. This memorandum directs all Federal departments, agencies, and officials to treat Puerto Rico administratively as if it were a State insofar as doing so would not disrupt Federal programs or operations.[13] On December 23, 2000, President Bill Clinton signed executive Order 13183, which established the President's Task Force on Puerto Rico's Status and the rules for its membership. Section 4 of executive Order 13183 (as amended by executive Order 13319) directs the Task Force to "report on its actions to the President ... on progress made in the determination of Puerto Rico's ultimate status." President George W. Bush signed an additional amendment to Executive Order 13183 on December 3, 2003, which established the current co-chairs and instructed the Task Force to issue reports as needed, but no less than once every two years.[5][6]

The statehood position is carried by the New Progressive Party of Puerto Rico. Both the Democratic Party and Republican Party, in their respective 2008 party platforms, have expressed their support of the rights of the United States Citizens in Puerto Rico to determine the destiny of the Commonwealth to achieve a future permanent non-territorial political status with government by consent and full enfranchisement.[14][15]

The Republican Party platform of 2008 says:

We support the right of the United States citizens of Puerto Rico to be admitted to the Union as a fully sovereign state after they freely so determine. We recognize that Congress has the final authority to define the constitutionally valid options for Puerto Rico to achieve a permanent non-territorial status with government by consent and full enfranchisement. As long as Puerto Rico is not a state, however, the will of its people regarding their political status should be ascertained by means of a general right of referendum or specific referenda sponsored by the U.S. government.
The Democratic Party platform of 2008 says:

We believe that the people of Puerto Rico have the right to the political status of their choice, obtained through a fair, neutral, and democratic process of self-determination. The White House and Congress will work with all groups in Puerto Rico to enable the question of Puerto Rico's status to be resolved during the next four years.[16]
Its population in the 2000 census was 3,927,776. (Kentucky ranked 26th, with 4,206,074, and Oregon ranked 27th, with 3,700,758.)

[Bond James Bond]

^
I merged your thread with another one. This topic comes up so often I'm going to sticky it in hopes of avoiding further duplication.

[-Corey-]

So when are they going to become a state? Lol are they planning a future referendum?

[Suburbanist]

A question for the locals: is the fact that English is not the major language an objection to statehood? How are English skills of people younger than 40?

[Manitopiaaa]

I would love it if Puerto Rico joined the union. One simple question: Would it vote Democrat or Republican in presidential elections?

[mgk920]

Originally Posted by Manitopiaaa

I would love it if Puerto Rico joined the union. One simple question: Would it vote Democrat or Republican in presidential elections?

I don't think that we really know. On one hand, it is quite poor (lower average annual income than Mississippi, lowest of the current 50), something that could favor liberals, BUT, the locals also see what's happening on neighboring islands (especially Cuba and Haiti) and thus they *TREASURE* the freedoms guaranteed by the USA's Constitution, something that is more favorable for conservatives. Puerto Rico also has the strongest economy in the region.

Could be a swing state. Remember that Mississippi trends strongly conservative.

If admitted, Puerto Rico would have six USHouse seats plus its usual two USSenators (8 EVs).

Also, don't forget that in the years leading up to the admission of Alaska and Hawaii (1950s), common thought was that AK would trend liberal and HI conservative, while the reality has been the direct opposite.

Mike

[Remolino]

Being Pro-US, not Pro-Statehood, I find it strange that US citizens on the mainland have no real idea of how things are in PUR. Much of the things written in this thread is copied tourist information and other propaganda. Have you not wondered why only good things are shown or talked about. What are they trying to hide.

In answering an above post -
People are always with that lame Cuba and Haiti example. Well it seems PUR. which is tied to the US is going the way of Haiti economically. The following is from a local newspaper this year 2010 -

One investment banker said it could take 10 to 20 years for Puerto Rico to dig itself out of its current hole, adding that García is doing a great job of keeping things together and if García leaves the GDB, he is planning to move off of the island, whose finances will most likely start swaying the way of Haiti.

GDB is the Government Development Bank. Seems they have not wanted to comment about the islands Credit rating going down. Governor even said in his yearly speech that the island credit rating was saved and the next day Morgan Stanley Smith Barney LLC commented that it was not true. Welcome to politics in PUR..

PUR. economy today is stagnating and continuing being part of the US will not help it. It is the 21 Century and nations need many trade partners and not rely on one trade partner who by the way has the final word of who you may trade with and how. Because of this many other nations in the region are signing business and trade deals with other nations while PUR. is not allowed to do that. So they will be improving there economies while PUR. stays stagnant.

Has for the freedoms guaranteed by the USA's Constitution what about those thousands of secret dossiers (called carpetas in Spanish) that the islands government collected and which was seen in a good light by some US government agencies. I thought they only did that in Cuba. Guess I was wrong.

This from an article from the Washington Post -

Lawyers for carpetas victims seeking redress in court say the order
excludes most of the thousands of Puerto Ricans, largely pro-independence supporters, who were spied upon by a commonwealth police intelligence unit. Over half a century the police unit built up a vast network of informers--everyday people like the victims themselves. Other governmental and private institutions also provided information for the files. The practice is widely believed here to have had the blessing, if not the encouragement, of federal authorities on the island.

The files themselves, containing seized U.S. mail, FBI agents' signatures and requests for information from Customs Service officials, confirm that they were at least aware of the practice.

Information in the carpetas allegedly was used to deny employment or take
other punitive actions such as unlawful arrests against Puerto Ricans from
every walk of life, from students and teachers to farmers and cab drivers,
lawyers and artists.

This Scottish poem can sort of also apply for many People in PUR. who are finally seeing what has been truly happening. Internet and radio is just full of information not once easily available.

Fichead Bliadhna (Twenty Years)


Freedom of the moor

Freedom of the hill

And then to school

At the end of a summer

Children, five years of age

Without many words of English



Here is your book

Here is your pen

Study hard

That's what they told me

And you will rise up in the world

You will achieve



I learnt many things

The English language

The poetry England

The music of Germany

The history of Spain

And even that was a misleading history



Then on to further education

Following education, more education

Like puppets

On the end of a string

Our heads filled with a sort of learning

And I did rise in the world

I found my suit

I found my shirt

I found a place in the eyes of men

Well away from the freedom of the moor



But why did they keep

Our history from us?

I'll tell you ‑ they are frightened

In case the children of Gaeldom awaken

With searching

And penetrating questions

Twenty years for the truth

I had to wait

I had to search

Twenty years of deceit

They denied me knowledge of myself



‑ C & R Macdonald, Runrig, 1979.

[minneapolis-uptown]

i think 51 stars on the flag would look stupid. but otherwise its a great idea

and I dont think that language would be that big of a barrier. there are some parts of America that are predominantly spanish speaking, and Hawaii had its own language

[Jennifat]

A 51-star flag hardly looks any different, just a more staggered layout.

[minneapolis-uptown]

Originally Posted by Jennifat

A 51-star flag hardly looks any different, just a more staggered layout.

ok. i acually like that one better then the one we have.


what about the virgin islands though?
will they become part of the same state or have their own state eventually?