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Old September 20th, 2015, 02:52 PM   #2881
Surel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrAronymous View Post
First you complain about there no longer being any stations or concrete tracks being built right at this moment, but then you fail to mention there's is still an Amsterdam metro line and a new Utrecht tram line under construction right at this moment. I know you're aiming for more, but do those not count? Bit unfair now.

By the way, I don't see Utrecht fit for a metro. It's too small, and it can do with just an expanded tram and train network. They're currently upgrading the train services so that it should become a sort of RER. Combine that with a lightrail-style tram system and you have the same convenience of metro, for a lot less.
Utrecht is too small for a metro line.
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Old September 20th, 2015, 03:12 PM   #2882
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I've just been experimenting with the SNCB Europe app, and it appears to offer mobile tickets for trips within the Netherlands where either the origin or destination is Amsterdam Centraal, Schiphol, Rotterdam Centraal or Utrecht Centraal. So you can get:

Amsterdam Centraal to Schiphol
Amsterdam Centraal to Groningen
Utrecht to Roodeschool
Schiphol to Hoofddorp
Rotterdam Centraal to Rotterdam Alexander

but not

Amsterdam Amstel to Den Haag Centraal
Groningen to Assen
Den Haag HS to Leiden
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Old September 20th, 2015, 03:14 PM   #2883
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrAronymous View Post
First you complain about there no longer being any stations or concrete tracks being built right at this moment, but then you fail to mention there's is still an Amsterdam metro line and a new Utrecht tram line under construction right at this moment. I know you're aiming for more, but do those not count? Bit unfair now.
Oh, I should have explained better. Of course I know of the Noordzuidlijn and the projects that are winding up. My point is that without new active projects on design phase right now, in a couple years there will be nothing much being brought live.

Leaving the urban transportation projects to other threads, we could talk about electrifying and twinning the whole Leeuwarden-Groningen-Leer (Germany) line.

They also need to get more aggressive with ERTMS deployment, pulling forward the upgrades scheduled only to 2025.
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Old September 20th, 2015, 03:21 PM   #2884
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I would say the Programma Hoogfrequent Spoorvervoer (PHS) is quite a big deal, giving metro frequencies on many lines, and that's going ongoing for the next 10 years and beyond.
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Old September 20th, 2015, 03:25 PM   #2885
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I would say the Programma Hoogfrequent Spoorvervoer (PHS) is quite a big deal, giving metro frequencies on many lines, and that's going ongoing for the next 10 years and beyond.
It won't do much to increase speed though

Of course it is good idea to have 134 daily Eindoven-Amsterdam trains (per direction) between IC and Sprinters, but that doesn't mean one will travel between Eindhoven and Amsterdam in 45 minutes.
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Old September 20th, 2015, 03:39 PM   #2886
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Quote:
I've just been experimenting with the SNCB Europe app, and it appears to offer mobile tickets for trips within the Netherlands where either the origin or destination is Amsterdam Centraal, Schiphol, Rotterdam Centraal or Utrecht Centraal. So you can get:

Amsterdam Centraal to Schiphol
Amsterdam Centraal to Groningen
Utrecht to Roodeschool
Schiphol to Hoofddorp
Rotterdam Centraal to Rotterdam Alexander
Sums NS up really.
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Old September 20th, 2015, 03:45 PM   #2887
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Quote:
It won't do much to increase speed though
For a public trabsport increasing frequency reduces journey time.
First case, after work I have to wait less time for a train going my way= faster journey.
Second, I have to be somewhere at a fixed time. More trains means one is more likely to arrive close to my appointment time, I can leave home later=faster journey
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Old September 20th, 2015, 05:24 PM   #2888
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Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
They also need to get more aggressive with ERTMS deployment, pulling forward the upgrades scheduled only to 2025.
ProRail messed up its finances, so don't expect anything more in the near future than that is currently planned.
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Old September 20th, 2015, 06:52 PM   #2889
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
Oh, I should have explained better. Of course I know of the Noordzuidlijn and the projects that are winding up. My point is that without new active projects on design phase right now, in a couple years there will be nothing much being brought live.

Leaving the urban transportation projects to other threads, we could talk about electrifying and twinning the whole Leeuwarden-Groningen-Leer (Germany) line.

They also need to get more aggressive with ERTMS deployment, pulling forward the upgrades scheduled only to 2025.
Amsterdam - Leeuwarden - Groningen over Ijsselmeer would be better. It would cut some 60 kms between Amsterdam and Leeuwarden. It would be even maybe possible to introduce there half hour tact for 250 km/h trains.
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Old September 20th, 2015, 07:11 PM   #2890
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Yeah well, that's not happening. There have been plans for that for years, but they decided not to go through with it because of the cost/benefit ratio. The (a smaller) budget was spent on improving road connections to Leeuwarden instead.
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Old September 20th, 2015, 07:54 PM   #2891
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Yeah well, that's not happening. There have been plans for that for years, but they decided not to go through with it because of the cost/benefit ratio. The (a smaller) budget was spent on improving road connections to Leeuwarden instead.
I would trace it through Noord Holland and through Afsluitdijk of even a new dike. Yet even worse ratio .
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Old September 20th, 2015, 08:36 PM   #2892
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Today the 1315 returned from Germany to be reactivated and repainted.
Also they showed the 1304 in its new livery.


link
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Old September 20th, 2015, 09:11 PM   #2893
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Today the 1315 returned from Germany to be reactivated and repainted. Also they showed the 1304 in its new livery. link
uah, uggly 70s colour scheme!
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Old September 20th, 2015, 10:00 PM   #2894
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Quote:
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It won't do much to increase speed though

Of course it is good idea to have 134 daily Eindoven-Amsterdam trains (per direction) between IC and Sprinters, but that doesn't mean one will travel between Eindhoven and Amsterdam in 45 minutes.
But appart from speeding up entrance/exit speeds at railway stations, your speed increase wont be as effective.

-The lengt between Eindhoven-Amsterdam is +/- 120 km, with stops about every 30 km.
- Lets say in this 30 km the train can travel at top speed for 20 km.
- Speed is 140km/h : the 15km takes +/- 8.5 minutes.
- Speed is 200km/h : the 15 km takes +/- 6 minutes

The investments for turning the whole stretch in a 200km/h would gain 10 minutes. The cost would be huge, the improvements little.
I would rather save ten minutes by having a train every ten minutes, instead of waiting ten minutes. Adding more trains is cheaper and more cost effective then having 200km/h on such stretches.
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Old September 20th, 2015, 10:17 PM   #2895
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You can have more trains if they clear a section faster.

The distance between Utrecht and Den Bosch is about 48 km. It's about time trains go 200 km/h on that stretch.
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Old September 20th, 2015, 11:51 PM   #2896
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The Hague Central Station.


IMG_1726 by Momo1435, on Flickr
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Old September 21st, 2015, 02:05 AM   #2897
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There are still plenty of major projects for the railway, but they will be less visible than HSL-Zuid or Betuweroute have been. One major project is PHS (introduction of metro-like frequencies), the other is the rollout of ERTMS.

Passengers will notice the first as having more trains per hour on the same infrastructure. Passengers won't notice a thing from the 2nd one, except for perhaps a slight decrease in journey times due to higher maximum speeds and calculated braking curves.

As much as I would love to see the Breda - Utrecht line built, I don't expect it any time soon. With the HSL Zuid fiasco still on everyone's mind, I can't see the government accepting the build of a new line anytime soon.
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Old September 21st, 2015, 05:01 AM   #2898
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The point of have VMax 250km/h would be to have direct non-stop Eindhoven-Amsterdam trains. Now if only they hadn't demolished through-tracks in Utrecht...
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Old September 21st, 2015, 08:58 AM   #2899
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Trains can still pass Utrecht when going from Amsterdam to Eindhoven, just not at 250 km/h.

Wouldn't make sense to not stop at Utrecht, however, as it is THE BUSIEST TRAIN STATION IN THE NETHERLANDS.
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Old September 21st, 2015, 10:19 AM   #2900
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Exactly. Skipping Utrecht does not make sense at all.
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