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Old March 30th, 2017, 10:10 PM   #3641
The Polman
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That's correct. Enschede is a double terminus meaning no train from Germany can go further into the Netherlands and vice versa. It is, AFAIK, introduced in about 2001 with the reopening of the line to Germany (which was abandoned for about 20 years). The whole system east of Enschede, except for the station layouts, is adapted to German standards, or say it was much cheaper to make than any interconnection with the Dutch railways.

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So now I've seen quite a few of the "new" NS panel screens in operation. Disruption messages (in red) change between English and Dutch. Advice is shown on split text, English with a bad italic version of the NS typeface.
So you have
Hierna/Next, instead of Volgende trein.
I'm not sold on this option. Volgende trein is more elegant than Hierna, but more importantly, it clutters the whole thing. They could just alternate Dutch and English for the whole screen, if they are already changing the red line, costs of changing the advice lines (white typeface over blue blackground) would be negligible. Then, Dutch users would soon know their screens alternate and foreign passengers would have uncluttered screens.
I'm not fond of the new system either because at first I could see any disruption from a distance, now I have to walk towards the screen in order to know if there is any disruption. The dark blue background always gave away a lot of information and sadly that clear visibility is gone.
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Old April 1st, 2017, 11:36 AM   #3642
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Yesterday was the last day of operation for the Hoekse Lijn. This year RET will continue the operation as a metro line extension from Schiedam Centrum to Hoek van Holland











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Old April 1st, 2017, 05:30 PM   #3643
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I had a train connection from Middelburg to Rosendaal next saturday at 11.29 but now they have rerouted my connection to Goes where I am supposed to take a bus to Rosendaal instead. Does anybody know what's going on there?
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Old April 1st, 2017, 05:56 PM   #3644
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Scheduled maintenance.

Quote:
Maintenance works
Dordrecht-Roosendaal-Vlissingen

When: Saturday 8 and Sunday 9 April
Extra travel time: 15 minutes to an hour
Advice: U can use of the buses or other trains

-No Sprinters will run between Oudenbosch and Roosendaal; you can make use of the Intercity that will make an extra stop at Oudenbosch
-Buses will be deployed in stead of Intercitys between Goes and Roosendaal; there will be Fastbuses between Goes and Roosendaal and All-stop-buses between Goes and Bergen op Zoom
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Old April 1st, 2017, 10:01 PM   #3645
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Thanks a lot
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Old April 4th, 2017, 10:35 PM   #3646
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True, but I think we should compare building a new railway vs. adding two (fast) tracks to existing ones, in which case the heterotachy* problem usually is much less relevant.
And most of the Randstad is already four-tracked and straight-aligned, so it wouldn't have been a hard job. Basically the Amsterdam - Utrecht line followed that principle and works quite well.
Outside the Randstad local traffic is less dense, so less of a problem.

On the other hand it is also true that long distance services follow very different logics than the Dutch domestic traffic.

Maybe, for the Schiphol - Rotterdam line, I wouldn't have gone with a full HSL (300 km/h are actually pointless there), instead leaving the line open to a few local trains which could have opened new connections (i.e. Zoetermeer to Amsterdam and Rotterdam).


* I'm not sure that word is used in English as well, but the meaning is correct.
The quadrupling of rail lines would be an appropriate tactic for the Netherlands if the domestic express services would harmonise with fast international services. To do that they would need to run at least 200 km/h. But this isn't the case. Domestic services is still limited to 140 km/h. And this is where this concepts fails.

Furthermore there are very few 4 track sections even in the Randstad. Bijlmer-Utrecht is the only longer one. Adding two additional tracks has also the disadvantageous of aligning the fast tracks through towns and villages where services on these tracks don't call but polluting their noise.
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Old April 5th, 2017, 12:22 AM   #3647
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In general I agree, but I also think domestic services should be run at 200 km/h or at least over 160. ICs don't stop so often, modern trains accelerate quite fast and good speed could be attained, at least better than today's...
Belgium runs some of its ICs @200, the density can be compared.


I wouldn't say there are few 4 tracks sections.
- Bijlmer - Houten;
- Amsterdam - Schiphol - Leiden is in fact 4 tracked up to Nieuw Vennep
- Leiden - Delft Zuid will soon be complete;
- Schiedam - Dordrecht, soon;
- Den Haag/Rotterdam - Utrecht is 4 tracked where local services are denser and designed for further expansion to Rotterdam

In fact there already are 4 tracks almost anywhere along the international corridors, apart from a few spots where Sprinters could run @160 without stops (e.g. Delft Zuid - Schiedam) with less conflicts with faster trains.

Today international traffic is already sorted out, but I think there is still a case for a speed up of internal services where the tracks are already dedicated.
The really difficult parts are Den Haag and Rotterdam to Gouda, and sooner or later something will have to be done there.
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Old April 5th, 2017, 02:08 AM   #3648
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilhem275 View Post
In general I agree, but I also think domestic services should be run at 200 km/h or at least over 160. ICs don't stop so often, modern trains accelerate quite fast and good speed could be attained, at least better than today's...
Belgium runs some of its ICs @200, the density can be compared.
Domestic service in Belgium run @200km/h is on highspeed lines shared by the 300km/h international trains. They run those trains in the interval between international trains.

The only two sections of domestic traffic @200km/h I know of is between Leuven and Ličge and between Brussels and Leuven on line 36N. The line Ostend-Ghent-Brussels (line50A) runs domestic traffic @ 160km/h but is currenty upgraded to 220km/h (4tracks). Line 96 is also being upgraded to 220km/h. Line 50A and Line 96 will be the first domestic traffic lines where IC will run at 200km/h. Trains between Antwerp and Brussels are mostly only 140 and 160 and the HSL is still not completed.

Nice historical fact; trains between Ostend and Brussels ran @ 160km/h since the mid 1930's on line 50A. It ran express trains for the Brussels bourgeois to Ostend. Line 50A has only one stop since it's completion in the late 19th century - Ghent- and was build without any crossing from the start to run express trains to the coastal area. Sadly the line was damaged and the expensive steam trains lost during the second worldwar and it wasn't untill the 70's trains where able to run at those speeds again on line 50A.
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Old April 5th, 2017, 02:14 AM   #3649
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Doesn't line 50A cross Brugge?

Anyway, Boxtel - Eindhoven is also 4-tracked. They should do the works to make Duivendrecht - Eindhoven 4-tracked all the way. Tilburg-Prinsenbreek should also be 4-tracked, the situation with waiting freight trains appears to be worsening.
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Old April 5th, 2017, 02:23 AM   #3650
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Indeed, there are also other parts, we were just naming the ones in the Randstad square.
Some extra tracks are needed also on the lines to Amersfoort, and maybe between Utrecht and Arnhem.

I believed I rode a train @200 between Brussels and Ghent, my bad.
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Old April 5th, 2017, 02:28 AM   #3651
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
Doesn't line 50A cross Brugge?
It does. How could I forget.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilhem275 View Post
I believed I rode a train @200 between Brussels and Ghent, my bad.
Most parts are allready able to handle 220km/h but I think currently all trains are still limited to 160km/h untill all works are completed.
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Old April 5th, 2017, 02:53 AM   #3652
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Works are far from complete, still two to three years to go for Brussels-Ghent. 4 tracks till Liedekerke, new access to Brussels Midi, new catenary (you need constant tension on both cables for 200 km/h and the current catenary only has weights on the contact cable) and of course new signalling.
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Old April 6th, 2017, 03:35 PM   #3653
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
Doesn't line 50A cross Brugge?

Anyway, Boxtel - Eindhoven is also 4-tracked. They should do the works to make Duivendrecht - Eindhoven 4-tracked all the way. Tilburg-Prinsenbreek should also be 4-tracked, the situation with waiting freight trains appears to be worsening.


The following should also be considered (apart from Delft-Rotterdam, the Rijswijk bottleneck and Zwolle-Herfte):


- Gouda Goverwelle-Woerden (12 trains/hour/direction excluding cargo)
- At least two stations long near Zoetermeer (for bypassing of Sprinters by IC's)
- Bunnik-Maarn (for fast-tracking the IC's to 200km/h and splitting them from sprinters)
- Amersfoort Schothorst-Vathorst (the sprinter terminating there can be set apart easier with 5 tracks at that station, more room for a new fast train to Harderwijk)
- Hilversum-Weesp (in a tunnel on most places likely seen the narrow space)
- Amsterdam Westtak (west branch from Schiphol to Amsterdam Centraal to be able to have more freedom in timetabling and higher speeds for bypassing HST's)
- Amsterdam-Haarlem so all trains currently terminating in Haarlem can continue to Amsterdam.
- Amsterdam Muiderpoort to Duivendrecht AND Diemen (both so on both of them there is some play during instability on the tracks and more sprinters can get on the tracks. But also because two tracks to become exclusively for IC's with faster high speeds).
- Bridge south of Zwolle so all IC's to the south can depart at the same time.
- Bypassing tracks between Castricum and Alkmaar and near Rotterdam Alexander
- Fly-overs east of Eindhoven for not having to wait for each other's trains, possibly even creating cross-platform between sprinters and IC's.


- And even though the cargo traffic between Tilburg and Breda will decline once, it is better to have it 4-tracked anyway indeed for more, faster and more reliable services, especially 6+4: 4 IC Eindhoven, 2 IC Den Bosch and 4 Sprinters.
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Prohibit the construction of new single-family dwellings without stacking apartments in Amsterdam (A10), Rotterdam (motorway ring), The Hague, Utrecht (outer ring), Eindhoven (ring), Tilburg (ringbanen) and Groningen (provincial ring)!

And prohibit the use of agricultural land for new dwellings!
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Old April 6th, 2017, 03:37 PM   #3654
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcVD View Post
Works are far from complete, still two to three years to go for Brussels-Ghent. 4 tracks till Liedekerke, new access to Brussels Midi, new catenary (you need constant tension on both cables for 200 km/h and the current catenary only has weights on the contact cable) and of course new signalling.


At least the plans are quite solid to speed up domestic traffic this way. For us it will at least take a decade for an even smaller piece of track between Lelystad and Zwolle at a lower speed.
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Relieving the pressure on Dutch housing market: we need more apartments and taller apartment buildings, no single-family dwellings anymore!

Prohibit the construction of new single-family dwellings without stacking apartments in Amsterdam (A10), Rotterdam (motorway ring), The Hague, Utrecht (outer ring), Eindhoven (ring), Tilburg (ringbanen) and Groningen (provincial ring)!

And prohibit the use of agricultural land for new dwellings!
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Old April 6th, 2017, 03:44 PM   #3655
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It is true that in Belgium the arrival of the TGV has been turned into an opportunity to modernize the classical network rather than building new HSLs each time it made sense. So we ended up with Brussels-Leuven at 200 km/h and Brussels-Antwerp at 160 with entirely new infrastructure.
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Old April 6th, 2017, 04:41 PM   #3656
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Is there any project to increase the average speeds?
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Old April 6th, 2017, 04:47 PM   #3657
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Is there any project to increase the average speeds?
Sadly, no. Most projects are focused on increasing capacity and running the rail network in the West/South part of the country like a big gigantic metropolitan service (though with 2-class trains, a handful of hosted international trains and the high speed line etc).
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Old April 6th, 2017, 04:48 PM   #3658
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Question: why has Den Haag Centraal still not fenced out with OV Chipkaart gates? It is a fairly easy station to seal off.
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Old April 6th, 2017, 06:18 PM   #3659
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They have to change the platforms, some have to be shortened
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Old April 6th, 2017, 06:23 PM   #3660
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It is possible to purchase tickets from other railway operators (like DB) that obviously aren't Chipkaarts (like Cellphone or Online- tickets) How are people with such tickets able to access the platforms?
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