daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Highways & Autobahns

Highways & Autobahns All about automobility



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old July 26th, 2014, 12:10 AM   #26741
Surel
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 2,702
Likes (Received): 2156

Quote:
Originally Posted by Penn's Woods View Post
I wish I knew how we got there, though....
I don't want to comment on this issue here and I was banned at DLM thus won't comment there either, although I think that is the appropriate place for this kind of discussion.

I did not think that this would get so far out of hand. I was quite confident, that all the parties involved would be reasonable enough to just solve it at the round tables. I was wrong. I have some guesses about where are we going now, but I won't discuss them here either.

Although you mean something else with your last sentence I would answer you like this.

Quote:
**** the EU.
I think I know how we got there.
Surel no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old July 26th, 2014, 12:33 AM   #26742
Surel
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 2,702
Likes (Received): 2156

On another note, my gf family member went with the same flight a week earlier. I don't know anyone on that flight but there are people that I know that knew someone.

I read a very interesting Dutch column http://www.nrc.nl/youp/2014/07/19/niet-te-bevatten/ which impressed me with this, I quote:

Quote:
Of ik het niet verschrikkelijk vind? Natuurlijk wel. Maar het is al jaren overal verschrikkelijk. Mijn lange leven lang. Overal en ergens. Vooral ergens anders. Daar waar we normaal op tien kilometer hoogte overheen vliegen. En nu heeft een oetlul een paar van ons uit de lucht geknald en zijn we in shock. Terecht. Maar moeten we niet eigenlijk altijd in shock zijn?
I won't translate it. Just present my ideas what I make of it for myself.

The idea is simple. We live in our safety bubble, the conflicts we induce (or let be induced without thinking about our responsibility) don't affect us, they are on the other side of the world and we are not really concerned. We literally fly over them ignoring them and we feel safe. Then one day the bubble bursts. This should be a memento. Memento that we are not safe. That we should not be lulled by the fake feeling of safety thinking we are flying over.
Surel no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 12:46 AM   #26743
Kanadzie
Registered User
 
Kanadzie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,377
Likes (Received): 748

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
And what would you do, attack Russia because of it? Yes, they should get over it. It's not a war between Russia and the Netherlands, so there's no need to get personal about it. Whoever shot down that plane is an idiot or just made a stupid mistake (mistaking it for a military plane, f.e.), but it was stupid to fly there in the first place. The whole situation should just calm down instead of this escalation, which brings nothing good.
Honestly if I was Rutte I would launch a missile straight at Kremlin for that one. There is no possible excuse for such a stupid mistake, escalation seems okay.
__________________

Road_UK, keokiracer liked this post
Kanadzie está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 01:03 AM   #26744
Verso
Islander
 
Verso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ljubljana
Posts: 22,088
Likes (Received): 4752

Expect a missile on Amsterdam then. (or Zwolle )
Verso no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 01:12 AM   #26745
Autoputevi kao hobi
srBska Kraljica
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Vladicin Han
Posts: 4,240
Likes (Received): 4063

Maybe they should launch a missile on a Mayrhofen
Autoputevi kao hobi no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 01:13 AM   #26746
Road_UK
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Mayrhofen AT, Sneek NL, Bromley UK
Posts: 5,855
Likes (Received): 1599

The map of Europe according to the Los Angeles Times.



It's all there except of France. Totally disappeared into the sea and with Spain and Portugal becoming a part of Africa. Genève-sur-Mer has appeared on the Atlantic Coast, and Belgium is now where continental Europe stops...

http://bigbrowser.blog.lemonde.fr/20...e-de-la-carte/
__________________
Road_UK no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 01:23 AM   #26747
Kanadzie
Registered User
 
Kanadzie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,377
Likes (Received): 748

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
Expect a missile on Amsterdam then. (or Zwolle )
Yes, probably! But, you can't turn away rage with submission either. It is almost worth it to let Amsterdam burn just to prove the point. I mean, they blew up a civilian airliner in 2014! It's completely insane, completely unacceptable and it cannot be ignored.
__________________

Road_UK liked this post
Kanadzie está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 01:23 AM   #26748
Autoputevi kao hobi
srBska Kraljica
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Vladicin Han
Posts: 4,240
Likes (Received): 4063

Serbia and Montenegro are still the same country.
Autoputevi kao hobi no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 01:25 AM   #26749
Road_UK
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Mayrhofen AT, Sneek NL, Bromley UK
Posts: 5,855
Likes (Received): 1599

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanadzie View Post
Yes, probably! But, you can't turn away rage with submission either. It is almost worth it to let Amsterdam burn just to prove the point. I mean, they blew up a civilian airliner in 2014.
Well, this is why some European countries are willing to take a bit of the bitter pill as well when sanctioning Russia. Economically it's not going to be in anyone's advantage, but Russia really has to be put in its place now.
Road_UK no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 01:27 AM   #26750
Road_UK
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Mayrhofen AT, Sneek NL, Bromley UK
Posts: 5,855
Likes (Received): 1599

Quote:
Originally Posted by Autoputevi kao hobi View Post
Serbia and Montenegro are still the same country.
And I just noticed that Ukraine has fully gone up in Russia...
Road_UK no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 01:29 AM   #26751
Kanadzie
Registered User
 
Kanadzie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,377
Likes (Received): 748

except they aren't, not at all, at least the ones that matter. Park your car and shut off the oil taps and you will tame the bear faster than Reagan did. Us Canadians would be plenty happy to offer all the oil you like!
Kanadzie está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 01:37 AM   #26752
Verso
Islander
 
Verso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ljubljana
Posts: 22,088
Likes (Received): 4752

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanadzie View Post
I mean, they blew up a civilian airliner in 2014!
You don't know who did it, and it was probably mistaken for a military plane.
Verso no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 01:39 AM   #26753
keokiracer
Roadgeek from NL
 
keokiracer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Halsteren (NL)
Posts: 3,675
Likes (Received): 2629

Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK View Post
The map of Europe according to the Los Angeles Times.

Well, someone at the LA Times obviously doesn't like France

Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK View Post
and with Spain and Portugal becoming a part of Africa.
If you look very closely you can still see the Gibraltar strait, so in this pic Spain and Portugal aren't the Iberian peninsula but the Iberian island
keokiracer no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 01:46 AM   #26754
Road_UK
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Mayrhofen AT, Sneek NL, Bromley UK
Posts: 5,855
Likes (Received): 1599

Quote:
Originally Posted by Autoputevi kao hobi View Post
Maybe they should launch a missile on a Mayrhofen
Let them do it in January, and they'd be killing thousands of their own people...
Road_UK no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 02:06 AM   #26755
Kanadzie
Registered User
 
Kanadzie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,377
Likes (Received): 748

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
You don't know who did it, and it was probably mistaken for a military plane.
We know who enabled the situation to happen, and considering that both you and I can easily identify what plane it was in 30 seconds by flighttracker on a smartphone, there is absolutely no excuse. Sure, probably mistaken, but not a mistake that can pass without some heads rolling.
There were 300 people in there with lives, families, dreams...
__________________

Road_UK liked this post

Last edited by Kanadzie; July 26th, 2014 at 02:12 AM.
Kanadzie está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 02:44 AM   #26756
Penn's Woods
Deadpan Snarker
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 6,250
Likes (Received): 781

Oy. Are we still on this?

I must say I recommend these little bouts of anxiety (didn't finish my lunch again) for weight loss....
__________________
I didn't vote for him....

DRIVEN IN BEEN IN:
AL CA CT DE DC FL GA ID IL IN KY ME MD MA MI MN MO MT NH NJ NY NC ND OH OR PA RI SC SD TN UT VT VA WA WV WI WY ---
AB BC MB NB NS ON PE QC SK ---
A B CH D F GB I L NL
Penn's Woods no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 03:04 AM   #26757
Penn's Woods
Deadpan Snarker
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 6,250
Likes (Received): 781

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanadzie View Post
Honestly if I was Rutte I would launch a missile straight at Kremlin for that one. There is no possible excuse for such a stupid mistake, escalation seems okay.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanadzie View Post
Yes, probably! But, you can't turn away rage with submission either. It is almost worth it to let Amsterdam burn just to prove the point. I mean, they blew up a civilian airliner in 2014! It's completely insane, completely unacceptable and it cannot be ignored.
This is exactly what we don't need. Escalation* is not OK, even in jest. This is exactly why THE FIGHTING NEEDS TO STOP! Because as long as it goes on, there's a chance of some unexpected incident leading to places we really don't want to go.

(I still haven't read a few hours of this thread. Think I won't....)

*EDIT: I mean military escalation. Sanctions are totally appropriate.
__________________
I didn't vote for him....

DRIVEN IN BEEN IN:
AL CA CT DE DC FL GA ID IL IN KY ME MD MA MI MN MO MT NH NJ NY NC ND OH OR PA RI SC SD TN UT VT VA WA WV WI WY ---
AB BC MB NB NS ON PE QC SK ---
A B CH D F GB I L NL

Last edited by Penn's Woods; July 26th, 2014 at 03:15 AM.
Penn's Woods no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 03:22 AM   #26758
Penn's Woods
Deadpan Snarker
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 6,250
Likes (Received): 781

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanadzie View Post
Yes, probably! But, you can't turn away rage with submission either. It is almost worth it to let Amsterdam burn just to prove the point. I mean, they blew up a civilian airliner in 2014! It's completely insane, completely unacceptable and it cannot be ignored.
Well, I don't want to see Montreal (among many other places) burn. Do you? I mean, at a time when you're in it?
__________________
I didn't vote for him....

DRIVEN IN BEEN IN:
AL CA CT DE DC FL GA ID IL IN KY ME MD MA MI MN MO MT NH NJ NY NC ND OH OR PA RI SC SD TN UT VT VA WA WV WI WY ---
AB BC MB NB NS ON PE QC SK ---
A B CH D F GB I L NL
Penn's Woods no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 03:38 AM   #26759
Kanadzie
Registered User
 
Kanadzie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,377
Likes (Received): 748

No, not really. But realistically, what can be done, to respond sufficiently to this? Sanction is one thing but already had many in place before it happened. Ban Aeroflot like Reagan did after KAL 007?
Kanadzie está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old July 26th, 2014, 03:53 AM   #26760
Penn's Woods
Deadpan Snarker
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Philadelphia
Posts: 6,250
Likes (Received): 781

That's the problem. There's nothing we can do that doesn't get us all killed (or at least run an unacceptably high risk of getting us all killed) if Putin's determined to keep behaving the way he is. I think we're stuck with Putin until he's out of power. (And I'm not quite as...dramatic (not sure that's the word)...as Road_UK is in evaluating the threat he poses to the rest of Europe. And he certainly poses no threat whatsoever to you and me in North America. Unless we (or our leaders) react in such a way as to make him one.)

Just like we were stuck with the Soviets. I'm old enough to remember well, too well, the last years of the Cold War. Not at all happy to find myself living in something similar. But it's better than dying in a hot one. We lived with them until they eventually went away.

Now, more positively:

Verso and others should note that American leaders (Obama since March, Kerry as recently as Sunday on TV here) have been clearly ruling out sending in American troops. Kerry also on Sunday (answering I-forget-what question) acknowledged the role Putin's played in getting chemical weapons out of Syria and in the nuclear negotiations in Iran. They wouldn't be talking that way if they were warmongering. They're angry that this stupid thing happened, yes. And justifiably so. Not only because of the lives lost but because of the anger it's stirred up...of which the latest posts on this thread are an example. I wish they were talking, though.

I've seen articles over the last couple of weeks indicating the Ukrainian government/military may be close to stamping out the rebellion.

Also seen Russia's economy is hurting and public opinion...well, is not unanimously taken in by his propaganda. Saw something the other day on CNN about the makeshift memorial to the crash victims that appeared in Moscow, with a lot of the notes reading "we're sorry," and "forgive us." And then there's this: http://www.standaard.be/cnt/dmf20140725_01191419

Going to war won't bring back the dead or relieve any of the pain.
__________________
I didn't vote for him....

DRIVEN IN BEEN IN:
AL CA CT DE DC FL GA ID IL IN KY ME MD MA MI MN MO MT NH NJ NY NC ND OH OR PA RI SC SD TN UT VT VA WA WV WI WY ---
AB BC MB NB NS ON PE QC SK ---
A B CH D F GB I L NL

Jasper90 liked this post
Penn's Woods no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
highways, motorways

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 02:46 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium