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Old March 11th, 2017, 11:20 AM   #35861
bogdymol
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I have a small laptop with touch screen. Yesterday I have noticed that I cannot scroll down with my finger on the screen, like on every other website.

edit: now it works
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Old March 11th, 2017, 12:07 PM   #35862
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Quote:
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Typical Suburbanist statement. Who cares about global warming as long as we can drive over mountain passes.
A couple of days warmer than usual don't necessarly imply global warming.
To define global warming, is necessary to analize and compare statistical data collected in a long time.
I'm not denying that the problem of GM exists, of course, but I made a precisation.
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In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old March 11th, 2017, 03:14 PM   #35863
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Global warming is a fact, not something I made up in the last few warmer days.
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Old March 11th, 2017, 03:16 PM   #35864
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Geez, I just said this season road passes will open sooner. I made no statement on global warming or on the folly of taking one single season climatology as proof or counterproof of anything.
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Old March 11th, 2017, 05:23 PM   #35865
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Relax, it was just a joke.
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Old March 11th, 2017, 05:33 PM   #35866
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By the way, how do your countries react to the last political events in the EU, that means, reelection of Donald Tusk as the president of European Council?

Polish state TV reacted in a very funny way:



"The choice of Donald Tusk to be a success of Germany"

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Old March 11th, 2017, 05:35 PM   #35867
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Like the appointment of Soviet apparatchiks. THat's what Europan Union increasingly resembles.
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Old March 11th, 2017, 05:53 PM   #35868
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Donald Tusk was voted in by 27 EU country delegations, which are established, each one, by their own democratic government. Poland voted against. It did so entirely for domestic policy reasons.
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Old March 11th, 2017, 06:32 PM   #35869
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it's such an odd situation

But I'm not sure if it is more strange that Poland opposes Tusk, or that the "convention" is for a country to always support their countryman in a nationalistic way, instead of being truly "European".

but the whole thing is such cheap politics
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Old March 11th, 2017, 06:41 PM   #35870
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European institutions have so little power that it won't matter at all
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Old March 11th, 2017, 07:15 PM   #35871
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EU needs a reconstruction. Without fascists, xenophobes, radicals, but without current left-welcomers either. People, who want to build a reasonable alliance of sovereign, well-developed countries.
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Old March 11th, 2017, 08:14 PM   #35872
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kpc21 View Post
By the way, how do your countries react to the last political events in the EU, that means, reelection of Donald Tusk as the president of European Council?

Polish state TV reacted in a very funny way:



"The choice of Donald Tusk to be a success of Germany"

There has been some discussion about how much it would cost to send Poland back to the other side of the Iron curtain or to sell it to Kazakstan. Thus, some degree of irritation.
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Old March 11th, 2017, 08:56 PM   #35873
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The greatest achievements of EU are on the economic front, and keeping its members from severely damaging each other while greater dangers and threats and challenges lurk outside (Russia, China, Middle East etc).

I am moving to Norway this summer, and I realized online shopping throughout EU will be much more cumbersome. Need to get a VAT invoice, then pay a 110NOK processing fee, pay Norwegian VAT and request reimbursement of EU-VAT to Norwegian customs. At least all of that can be done online. I rely heavily on online shopping and EU-wide competition means prices in a relatively small country like Netherlands are kept in check by everpresent threat of retailers from Germany or UK.
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Old March 11th, 2017, 09:35 PM   #35874
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But I'm not sure if it is more strange that Poland opposes Tusk, or that the "convention" is for a country to always support their countryman in a nationalistic way, instead of being truly "European".
If all the EU members but Poland voted for a Polish candidate, they actually were truly "European".

And... if it was actually so that each country would support their countryman, then - I don't know if all the votes are equal or they have weights, but in the first situation, nobody would be chosen.

It's sad that our government maintains such "low-level" thinking and is not able to go beyond the internal divisions and disputes... But what can we do about that? Now, I just feel ashamed of the government of my country.

Quote:
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The greatest achievements of EU are on the economic front, and keeping its members from severely damaging each other while greater dangers and threats and challenges lurk outside (Russia, China, Middle East etc).
I fully agree.
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Old March 12th, 2017, 01:20 AM   #35875
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
The greatest achievements of EU are on the economic front, and keeping its members from severely damaging each other while greater dangers and threats and challenges lurk outside (Russia, China, Middle East etc).

I am moving to Norway this summer, and I realized online shopping throughout EU will be much more cumbersome. Need to get a VAT invoice, then pay a 110NOK processing fee, pay Norwegian VAT and request reimbursement of EU-VAT to Norwegian customs. At least all of that can be done online. I rely heavily on online shopping and EU-wide competition means prices in a relatively small country like Netherlands are kept in check by everpresent threat of retailers from Germany or UK.
I think that also EU legislations aimed to improve food safety, environmental standards, free market competition, consumer's rights, and transparency in public administration, were great achievements of EU.
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“The transponder’s personalised signal would be picked up when the car passed through an intersection, and then relayed to a central computer which would calculate the charge according to the intersection and the time of day and add it to the car’s bill” - Nobel Economics Prize winner William Vickrey, proposing a system of electronic tolling for the Washington metropolitan area, 1959
In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old March 12th, 2017, 11:00 PM   #35876
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I think that also EU legislations aimed to improve food safety, environmental standards, free market competition, consumer's rights, and transparency in public administration, were great achievements of EU.
From an Italian point of view, EU food regulations are not that good. They made us change the name of a centuries old wine (Tocai) because there is another, completely different, with a vaguely similar name in Hungary; they forbade production and selling of traditional cheese like casu marzu for unspecified health hazards; they constantly rejected proposals for controlling the origin of ingredients, with the result that I can buy a "made in Italy" olive oil bottle with olives coming from Spain or Tunisia.
I am proud of being European, but I really hope that this Union falls apart. It is a failure in every possible way.
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Old March 12th, 2017, 11:46 PM   #35877
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I think that also EU legislations aimed to improve food safety, environmental standards, free market competition, consumer's rights, and transparency in public administration, were great achievements of EU.
True. Still the EU has taken an exaggerated number of actions to regulate things that do not need Europe-wide regulation. This irritates people more and more. That makes the brexit a logical move. Unfortunately, the people in the ivory tower in Brussels do not want to look at the mirror but try to make UK evil, and preferably to punish it.

I am sure that 80 per cent of the existing regulations and directives could be canceled without any harm and we still had a working EU bringing benefits to the citizens. I am sure this will not happen, and that is why I am sure there will be no EU after 50 years. During the history, all oversize complacent organizations have collapsed after reaching the point were the value is less than the price. Examples: Ancient Egypt, Roman Empire, Austro-Hungarian Empire, League of Nations, Soviet Union, Yugoslavia, the Ottoman Empire.
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Old March 13th, 2017, 12:15 AM   #35878
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Like everything else, the EU has its timeline with the rises and falls too. For me, the fall of the EU started with unfortunate Irish referendum in 2008 concerning the Lisbon Treaty. It means, the EU was at its bests in 2007.

I partially work with the EU funds now, not on the site of beneficiaries but on the side of managing authority and I see how many useless regulations and limitation the EU makes up.

It is really like in the joke about different establishments compared to breeding cows. AFAIK EU democracy was described like having a pair of cows, the one will be hand over to other country with senseless subsidies and the other was milked till its death and its milk was then spilled into a river.

All of this under the cover of an overly false and hypocritical political correctness pretending to be the United states of Europe. I wish the old (pre-2008) could be brought back.
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Old March 13th, 2017, 01:31 AM   #35879
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I like the idea of EU, but not a shift towards something like the 'United States of Europe'.
I think EU integration should stop somewhen, before getting too intrusive in internal matters.

There are some ideals EU should actively pursue: human rights, civil liberties, transparency, free competition, health, and environmental preservation.
Any field that is not related to these, should better be left to national states, instead of EU, to prevent EU being seen as too overkill, thus increasing euroscepticism.
It's better to have an EU limited to regulate the basics, but widely accepted by its population, rather than an EU who regulates everything, but perceived as an enemy by large parts of population. In the first case, it will probably survive forever, in the latter, countries will likely vote to get out, cancelling also positive sides of EU.

Moreover, EU should not harm national or local traditions, but preserve them instead, unless they are plain violations of basic principles like human rights, civil liberties, transparency, free competition, health, and environmental preservation.

For example, forcing countries to change well-established historical brands, because they are too similar with other brands in other countries is ridiculous and overkill.
Forcing countries to respect health, hygiene, and labelling standards in food production is acceptable, instead.
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“The transponder’s personalised signal would be picked up when the car passed through an intersection, and then relayed to a central computer which would calculate the charge according to the intersection and the time of day and add it to the car’s bill” - Nobel Economics Prize winner William Vickrey, proposing a system of electronic tolling for the Washington metropolitan area, 1959
In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.

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Old March 13th, 2017, 01:35 AM   #35880
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From an Italian point of view, EU food regulations are not that good. They made us change the name of a centuries old wine (Tocai) because there is another, completely different, with a vaguely similar name in Hungary; they forbade production and selling of traditional cheese like casu marzu for unspecified health hazards; they constantly rejected proposals for controlling the origin of ingredients, with the result that I can buy a "made in Italy" olive oil bottle with olives coming from Spain or Tunisia.
That's because Italy had already very advanced laws in food matters. It wasn't probably the case in other countries.

In other fields, like market competition, environment, and transparency, Italian legislation improved a lot since the 1980s, due to the obligation of adopting EU directives and regulations.
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“The transponder’s personalised signal would be picked up when the car passed through an intersection, and then relayed to a central computer which would calculate the charge according to the intersection and the time of day and add it to the car’s bill” - Nobel Economics Prize winner William Vickrey, proposing a system of electronic tolling for the Washington metropolitan area, 1959
In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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