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Old November 1st, 2009, 12:40 AM   #6081
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Especially on motorways
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Old November 1st, 2009, 10:53 AM   #6082
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Where have you been?
Mölltal in Austria, opened almost through whole year.
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Old November 1st, 2009, 08:24 PM   #6083
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From "guess who I used to be" series:





Budget version


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Old November 1st, 2009, 08:49 PM   #6084
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I was thinking about the Polish letter "ł" and it's pronunciation as "w". Isn't this highly irregular from the other Slavic languages? I mean, in Czech or Russian, the ł would probably be replaced with a normal "l", and pronounced like that too. One of the prime examples is the name "Włocławek", which is pronounced like "Vwotswavek", I think it's quite different than other Slavic languages where it would probably be pronounced like "Vlotslavek".
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Old November 1st, 2009, 08:58 PM   #6085
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Very elaborate gravestones!
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Old November 1st, 2009, 09:03 PM   #6086
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Isn't this highly irregular from the other Slavic languages?
Why should it be? In the same way I can say we replace š with s, as for egzample in Škoda. Noone says [shkoda] but [skoda].
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Old November 1st, 2009, 09:18 PM   #6087
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
I was thinking about the Polish letter "ł" and it's pronunciation as "w". Isn't this highly irregular from the other Slavic languages? I mean, in Czech or Russian, the ł would probably be replaced with a normal "l", and pronounced like that too. One of the prime examples is the name "Włocławek", which is pronounced like "Vwotswavek", I think it's quite different than other Slavic languages where it would probably be pronounced like "Vlotslavek".
Some Polish letters are so unique that the official Slovenian expression for e.g. Łódź is simply Lodž (pronounced Lodzh, not Wudzh). Even though Slovenian linguists are perfectly aware it's wrong, no one here knows Polish letters, so they made it easier for us not to confuse which city we're talking about.

@ the gravestones.
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Old November 1st, 2009, 09:59 PM   #6088
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
I was thinking about the Polish letter "ł" and it's pronunciation as "w".
This pronunciation is rather a new thing in Polish. Before the World War II, and even in the 50s in the proper "high Polish" 'ł' was pronounced almost like English 'dark L'. Nevertheless, each language is a living thing, so now the [w] pronunciation is used both in the official and everyday language. The old one is used only by some old people and in some eastern and north-eastern dialects.
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Old November 1st, 2009, 10:06 PM   #6089
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My halloween party got ruined by police lol
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Old November 1st, 2009, 10:45 PM   #6090
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My halloween party got ruined by police lol
Why? Were you all dressed up as radi?
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Old November 1st, 2009, 11:12 PM   #6091
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His party was too shiny
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Old November 1st, 2009, 11:28 PM   #6092
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I don't think so...

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Old November 1st, 2009, 11:33 PM   #6093
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Of course Niels can't drink in the US, since he's still under 21
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Old November 2nd, 2009, 02:45 AM   #6094
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Lol ya. Some of the neighbours must have called the police. It started with only one. It ended with 20 police cars and several people got drinking tickets
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Old November 2nd, 2009, 02:10 PM   #6095
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
I was thinking about the Polish letter "ł" and it's pronunciation as "w". Isn't this highly irregular from the other Slavic languages? ...
The Polish 'ł' is rather on its own amongst slavonic langauges, ignoring colloquial usage elsewhere, together with some nasal sounds such as 'ą' and 'ę'. Rather like French amongst latin languages. But in some Russian/Ukrainian (others?) dialects there is a form of 'ł' that sits in between 'ł' and 'l'.

Unfortunately, in today's Polish you cannot use 'l' instead of 'ł' because in some words the meaning will change and it is the modern standard.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzy Llama View Post
This pronunciation is rather a new thing in Polish. Before the World War II, and even in the 50s in the proper "high Polish" 'ł' was pronounced almost like English 'dark L'.
Oh I don't know if that is entirely true. What you refer to as 'high Polish' pronounciation of 'ł' was really a regional variation found in eastern regions of Poland, which is still in existence to this day, including Warsaw.

Maybe a few crème-de-la-crème posh totties in Warsaw around WW2 and before thought 'dark L' was 'high Polish' but in other regions (including Kraków) 'ł' was always pronounced as it is today. And thank goodness for that because the 'dark L' is ever so hard to get right. I don't know anyone who uses 'dark L' in everyday speech today and those who do, are normally regarded as ... shall we say upper class snobs.



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Old November 2nd, 2009, 03:55 PM   #6096
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ni3lS View Post
Lol ya. Some of the neighbours must have called the police. It started with only one. It ended with 20 police cars and several people got drinking tickets
Do you mean that you can't be drunk in someone's house (or even your own)? What is the penalty on those drinking tickets?
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Old November 2nd, 2009, 05:06 PM   #6097
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drinking tickets sound weird
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Old November 2nd, 2009, 05:59 PM   #6098
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MAG View Post
Maybe a few crème-de-la-crème posh totties in Warsaw around WW2 and before thought 'dark L' was 'high Polish' but in other regions (including Kraków) 'ł' was always pronounced as it is today. .
Well, it's hard to define what was and what wasn't considered proper Polish and what posh totties speak 50 years ago but I will defend my point. Dark L was used in radio, in television, in theatres - everywhere where you expect to get the 'proper', regionalism-free variety of language.

Just listen to those two examples (both post-war unfortunately, but it is so hard to find the stuff from 30s in the Internet)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ehqdVnyxaAg

http://w228.wrzuta.pl/audio/5KEpxo6w...aczuszka_i_mak

Of course that in the everyday speech people pronounced different sounds differently, and of course that 'dark L' was more common in the East, but still - in every big language regionalisms are a common thing. And it is natural that they differ from the form you consider 'standard' or 'high'.
Now, because of the tragic events of WWII, border changes, massive repatriations and so on most of the regionalisms died and people use more or less standard language in everyday conversation (excluding of course Silesia, Suwalszczyzna and some other regions)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MAG View Post
And thank goodness for that because the 'dark L' is ever so hard to get right. I don't know anyone who uses 'dark L' in everyday speech today and those who do, are normally regarded as ... shall we say upper class snobs.
Yeah, and it just proofs that languages change. No Nobel-prize revelations here
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Old November 2nd, 2009, 09:24 PM   #6099
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My opinion on American drinking rules:
Sainsbury's (a UK supermarket chain) has a policy of not selling intoxicating substances to under 25's.
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Old November 2nd, 2009, 09:26 PM   #6100
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That's ridiculus, soon you will need biometrical documentation in order to buy alcohol :/
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