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Old April 26th, 2008, 09:38 PM   #161
Yardmaster
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin S View Post
It's very difficult to say what is a Metro and what isn't. I believe that the word Metro comes from the Metropolitan line in London, which started out as steam hauled and so would probably not fit part of the modern definition.

A Metro system, as I understand it will have some or all of the following characteristics, with its degree of 'Metroness' depending on how many it has:

1. Serves a large urban area or agglomeration of urban areas (a Metropolis).

2. High frequency

3. Electric traction.

4. Underground running

5. Complete separation from other transport modes (e.g. a tram sharing a street with other road vehicles would not be considered a Metro but one with its own reserved route could be).

By that definition, I think BART qualifies as a Metro.
BART obviously isn't underground, except in central San Francisco.

If BART qualifies, then I can't see why the NE & E networks of Melbourne don't ... they don't share their tracks with anything else, they run on their own right-of-way, and at least in the inner suburbs, they offer "frequent" services (whatever that means).

Last edited by Yardmaster; April 26th, 2008 at 09:44 PM.
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Old April 26th, 2008, 09:40 PM   #162
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The word metro comes from the Paris metro... which is actually the abbreviation of "Compagnie du chemin de fer métropolitain de Paris" (Paris metropolitan railway company), the original company managing the network.

That company's name may have been inspired by the metropolitan line in London, but it's in Paris that the word "metro" has been invented. And it's only after Paris network has been created that the use of the word "metro" started being used elsewhere to designate other urban rail networks over the world.

So now, I want people to stop about that silly urban legend saying that the word metro has been invented in London. That's just crap.
Paris wouldn't have called itself 'metropolitan' if it wasn't for London, would it? The idea for the name first came from London, Paris simply altered it, slightly and rather unoriginally.
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Old April 27th, 2008, 03:51 AM   #163
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The system in London is called the underground, or tube, not the metro. The first metro to be called a metro was the Paris metro. It's only after Paris that the word metro started to spread over other systems throughout the world.

If Paris wouldn't have called its system the metro, then the word wouldn't be used all over the world to designate this kind of urban rail networks. And this even if the metropolitan line in London was still called metropolitan line.

Maybe you consider the abbreviation unoriginal, but it's that abbreviation which has been first used in Paris to designate a whole network, and not just a line. Thus yes, I repeat. The word metro is a Parisian invention.
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Old April 27th, 2008, 04:38 AM   #164
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What was the Budapest Metró called previously? It dates further back than the Paris Metropolitain, right?
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Old April 27th, 2008, 04:46 AM   #165
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The system in London is called the underground, or tube, not the metro. The first metro to be called a metro was the Paris metro. It's only after Paris that the word metro started to spread over other systems throughout the world.
That's a moot point, most of the Underground when it was built originally was not called 'the tube', it was named after different companies, like the Metropolitan railway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Metropolitan View Post
If Paris wouldn't have called its system the metro, then the word wouldn't be used all over the world to designate this kind of urban rail networks. And this even if the metropolitan line in London was still called metropolitan line.
You're really playing up to the 'insecure French' stereotype... Paris wouldn't have called it the 'metro' if it weren't for London. I can't arsed with an argument so pointless, so please, do not bother replying to this post.
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Old April 27th, 2008, 04:55 AM   #166
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Originally Posted by iampuking View Post
That's a moot point, most of the Underground when it was built originally was not called 'the tube', it was named after different companies, like the Metropolitan railway.
The network in London has always been called the underground. It has never been called the metro. Granted the first line was managed by the Metropolitan railway which have indeed directly inspired the Paris metropolitan railway company. So "metropolitan railway" is a London invention and Paris indeed stole the name (like NYC by the way) however neither "metropolitan" nor "metro" have ever designated the London urban rail network. The several lines operated by various companies during the 19th century were called altogether "the underground railways". Then, when they merged into one company in 1908, it became "the underground".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin S View Post
I just checked the Oxford English Dictionary and that does confirm that the word Metro is 20th Century and comes from its use in Paris, so I apologise for my misconception.
Well, I didn't know the Oxford English Dictionary was known for its "insecure French" stereotype.

Last edited by Metropolitan; April 27th, 2008 at 06:10 AM.
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Old April 27th, 2008, 04:58 AM   #167
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What was the Budapest Metró called previously? It dates further back than the Paris Metropolitain, right?
The Földalatti, which means the underground in Hungarian.
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Old April 27th, 2008, 09:46 AM   #168
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Can we stop this silly squabble right here please?

It's pretty obvious that the term 'Metro' in the modern sense was coined in Paris, even if it was possibly influenced by London's Metropolitan Railway, that's pretty irrelevant. Especially considering the Metropolitan Railway was at the time pretty much indistinguishable from any of the other main line railways companies operating out of London bar the fact it had a significant portion of tunnel at the London end with subterranean stations. The vast bulk of the railway was overground (out to Verney Junction and Brill beyond Aylesbury in Buckinghamshire), and remained steam-hauled long after the first electric metro / Tube lines opened. It's a real stretch to say the Metropolitan Railway was a Metro even if it was the world's first subterranean railway when opened... I'd argue the Metropolitan Line only became a metro when it was electrified, and even then as a purist you could say not until 1960 when the line was cut back from Aylesbury to Amersham and all steam services ended.
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Old April 27th, 2008, 06:42 PM   #169
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Quote:
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That's a moot point, most of the Underground when it was built originally was not called 'the tube', it was named after different companies, like the Metropolitan railway.
The first London underground line was called the Metropolitan and the second the Metropolitan District, which must have been very confusing and was shortened to District. 'Tube' comes from the 'Twopenny Tube', which was the marketing name for what was later to become the Central Line.

Strictly speaking, the Metropolitan, District and Circle Lines are not tubes as they run sub-surface in main line gauge tunnels and cuttings.

The use of the name 'Bakerloo Line' proved controversial in its day as it reflected the Americanisation brought in by Yerkes. A more British name would have been Baker Street and Waterloo Railway.
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Old May 1st, 2008, 07:50 PM   #170
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I wouldn't consider San Francisco's BART a Metro.
Alright, but the city there`d like you to consider it one. It`s like London`s line out to Amersham: it might`ve passed equestrian estates, farms and whatever there was back in the day (has its extremity lost its countryside up there yet?), but it was nonetheless the Underground`s service.
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Old September 3rd, 2008, 11:44 PM   #171
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Maybe the most spaghetti-like system of lines: Hamburg -- even the new U4 line (short white line in the south) adds to the mess.
With spaghetti-like I mean only the horseshoe-shaped curvature of every line, of course - not the network density.
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Old September 3rd, 2008, 11:49 PM   #172
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Lausanne's line m2 will be the world's steepest subway line.
Source: http://www.sueddeutsche.de/automobil/738/308681/text/

It will have rubber tyres and will open for one day on 18 September for a celebration and actually open with regular operation in October 2008.
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Old September 4th, 2008, 02:18 AM   #173
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steepest?
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Old September 4th, 2008, 05:15 AM   #174
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As in grade.
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Old September 4th, 2008, 09:59 PM   #175
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Lyon's line C

Probably one of the steepest Metro segment in the world, with a 17.4% (1 in 5.74) gradient.
It is the only métro line in Lyon were iron-wheels and catenary are used. In the steepest segment, the métro uses a rack rail to climb the hill.

Before refurbishement



After...
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Old September 5th, 2008, 02:41 AM   #176
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How does it feel for the passengers?
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Old September 7th, 2008, 03:08 AM   #177
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Cheapest subway fare in the world

Mexico's subway, as of January 1, 2002, it's been $2 (two) Mexican Pesos ever since, which is about $0.20 cents (US).

It is also the first subway to use colored symbols to define each station. This was due to a highly number of illiterate people who used the Metro as a primary mean of transportation around 1970, when the first few Metro lines were inaugurated.

Pantitlan station (at the very east of the Mexico centre) is one of the Busiest Transfer Stations in the world connecting lines 1, 5, 9, A, of the STCM, a trolley line and about 100 bus lines.

Line A, for instance, during peak hours, the amount of people waiting for the Metro is amazing. There's been reports of people throwing themselves off the railtracks right before the Metro passes by and ends up being a "Suicide", authorities say. However, it's really due to the huge amount of desperate people who want to get in the Metro first and the "Pushing-to-be-the-first-ones" to get in there bring fatal consequences. Mexico is not the only one who suffers from this issue. I've read that Seoul's subway is the same way and in England, drivers are protesting because of a film about people who commit suicide on the railtracks.



This is of course nothing to be proud of in any country for any reason.

-=uɐqɹn=-
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Old September 7th, 2008, 04:36 AM   #178
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There were protests from rail unions over a film that apparently made a mockery of suicide by jumping in front of Tube trains. There was nothing to do with people getting pushed on the tracks because ones behind them are incredibly thoughtless and selfish.
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Old September 9th, 2008, 07:36 PM   #179
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this is all about poor organization - shut down half of escalators, 2/3 of turnstiles or close 2/3 of entrance doors, so people will accumulate in safe on a street instead of platform.
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Old September 12th, 2008, 12:00 PM   #180
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Quote:
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The bigest Metro extension (growth)?: Madrid, 165km of full Metro from 1996 to 2007 (11-12 years). Madrid has currently 282km.


(by the way, what a such interesting thread!! ;-) )
Nope, Shanghai beats that. Went from 36.4km in 1998 to 228.4km today - a growth of 192km in only 10 years.
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