LONDON - Olympic Stadium (79,999)

[IronMan89]

Originally Posted by bing222

sydney 2000 stadium was the best ever stadium for the olympics

I agree with you... not only the stadium but Australia is a great place for Olympic Games
IMO, the London's Games aren't about legacy, and this is what disturbs me the most. I wonder if is there any "big" stadium in England which could host a major athletic event?? If so I apologize but If there isn't, what legacy do you let by resizing the olympic stadium to only 25.000 seater? So appart from the Olympic swimming pool and the "Velodrome", I don't see major upgrade from London with those games

[DarJoLe]

Originally Posted by IronMan89

IMO, the London's Games aren't about legacy, and this is what disturbs me the most. I wonder if is there any "big" stadium in England which could host a major athletic event??

Wembley Stadium.

Originally Posted by IronMan89

what legacy do you let by resizing the olympic stadium to only 25.000 seater? So appart from the Olympic swimming pool and the "Velodrome", I don't see major upgrade from London with those games

Apart from the largest urban park built in Europe in 150 years, extensive new transport links, a whole new residential city with 50% affordable housing, a massive swathe of former toxic industrial wasteland regenerated into natural wetlands and nature reserves and a selection of top quality sports venues suitable in size for the local community and council to maintain to high standards for the next century. Yeah, no major upgrades whatsoever.

[IronMan89]

Wembley stadium can host track and field??

A park... yes the legacy will be something ecological... politics are just waiting pressure to do things like that... It will be interesting to call your 25.000 seat stadium "the London Olympic Stadium" in 20 years...
OG really need change I think... England infrastructure doesn't need the games to be developped anymore while we see so many poor or not so poor countries that aren't able to build infrastrucures...Athens games for this reason were good, same for Beijing, hope we don't go in the Atlanta, London direction in 2016, like 2014

[Gherkin]

Wembley can be converted into an athletics stadium, but the capacity would be reduced to about 60,000/70,000 seats as the lower tier would be covered up by the running track. I doubt it'll ever happen to be honest.

[TallBox]

Originally Posted by DarJoLe

....a massive swathe of former toxic industrial wasteland regenerated into natural wetlands and nature reserves and...

That's not very 'sustainable' - natural wetlands contribute 76% of the world's output of methane, a greenhouse gas with 62 times the global warming potential of CO2.

I hope for our climate's sake, that you've simply got your wires crossed and are misquoting from somewhere. Don't be fooled by media buzzwords like 'natural' or 'green' or even 'sustainable'.

[DarJoLe]

Originally Posted by shaun

I hope for our climate's sake, that you've simply got your wires crossed and are misquoting from somewhere. Don't be fooled by media buzzwords like 'natural' or 'green' or even 'sustainable'.

After the Games the Olympic Park will be transformed into the largest urban park created in Europe for more than 150 years.

The new park will be connected to the tidal Thames Estuary to the south and the Hertfordshire countryside to the north.

It will be designed to enrich the local ecology, restoring wetland habitats and planted with native species.

The canals and waterways of the River Lea will be cleaned and widened, and the natural floodplains of the area will be restored to provide a new wetland habitat for wildlife for birdwatchers and ecologists to enjoy. The natural river system of the valley will be restored, canals dredged and waterways widened.

The park will be planted with native species, including oak, ash, willow, birch, hazel, holly, blackthorn and hawthorn, providing a home for wildlife in the middle of the city.

The world-class sports facilities will be adapted for use by sports clubs and the local community as well as elite athletes. New playing fields sitting alongside these facilities will be adapted for community use.

The Olympic Village, where athletes and officials will stay during the Games, will be converted into homes, many available for key workers such as teachers and nurses.

In all, over 9,000 new homes will be built within the Park. Riverside housing, shops, restaurants and cafes will provide new amenities for the local community.

A range of transport improvements serving the Park are already underway, including an extension to the Docklands Light Railway, increased capacity on the Jubilee Line and the upgrade of Stratford Regional Station.

The communities surrounding the Park will enjoy access to the open space via a network of canal towpaths, footpaths and cycleways.

Economically, the area will be transformed. Thousands of new jobs will be created in the Park alone, many of these coming from the conversion of the International Broadcast Centre/Main Press Centre to create a new centre for employment in Hackney.

In addition, job and training opportunities will be created for local people, and local residents will be engaged in the planning of the Games and the benefits the project will bring afterwards.

There will also be a wealth of benefits to the wider community, such as cross-city transport improvements in London, more training and job opportunities for the UK and the chance for a vast array of businesses to be involved.

The Games will leave a key legacy of national benefits in culture, sport, volunteering, business and tourism.

We are working with the London Thames Gateway Development Corporation, London Development Agency, the Greater London Authority and the Host Boroughs to develop the Legacy Masterplan Framework, which will set out a clear vision for the future pattern of development of the Park, which will begin immediately after the Games.

[somataki]

Originally Posted by DarJoLe

After the Games the Olympic Park will be transformed into the largest urban park created in Europe for more than 150 years.

The new park will be connected to the tidal Thames Estuary to the south and the Hertfordshire countryside to the north.

It will be designed to enrich the local ecology, restoring wetland habitats and planted with native species.

The canals and waterways of the River Lea will be cleaned and widened, and the natural floodplains of the area will be restored to provide a new wetland habitat for wildlife for birdwatchers and ecologists to enjoy. The natural river system of the valley will be restored, canals dredged and waterways widened.

The park will be planted with native species, including oak, ash, willow, birch, hazel, holly, blackthorn and hawthorn, providing a home for wildlife in the middle of the city.

The world-class sports facilities will be adapted for use by sports clubs and the local community as well as elite athletes. New playing fields sitting alongside these facilities will be adapted for community use.

The Olympic Village, where athletes and officials will stay during the Games, will be converted into homes, many available for key workers such as teachers and nurses.

In all, over 9,000 new homes will be built within the Park. Riverside housing, shops, restaurants and cafes will provide new amenities for the local community.

A range of transport improvements serving the Park are already underway, including an extension to the Docklands Light Railway, increased capacity on the Jubilee Line and the upgrade of Stratford Regional Station.

The communities surrounding the Park will enjoy access to the open space via a network of canal towpaths, footpaths and cycleways.

Economically, the area will be transformed. Thousands of new jobs will be created in the Park alone, many of these coming from the conversion of the International Broadcast Centre/Main Press Centre to create a new centre for employment in Hackney.

In addition, job and training opportunities will be created for local people, and local residents will be engaged in the planning of the Games and the benefits the project will bring afterwards.

There will also be a wealth of benefits to the wider community, such as cross-city transport improvements in London, more training and job opportunities for the UK and the chance for a vast array of businesses to be involved.

The Games will leave a key legacy of national benefits in culture, sport, volunteering, business and tourism.

We are working with the London Thames Gateway Development Corporation, London Development Agency, the Greater London Authority and the Host Boroughs to develop the Legacy Masterplan Framework, which will set out a clear vision for the future pattern of development of the Park, which will begin immediately after the Games.

Actually the biggest urban park of Europe after 2012 will be the Hellenikon Metropolitan Park in Athens.

[TallBox]

Originally Posted by DarJoLe

After the Games the Olympic Park will be transformed into the largest urban park created in Europe for more than 150 years.

The new park will be connected to the tidal Thames Estuary to the south and the Hertfordshire countryside....

That's really bad. Not being facetious, but while natural wetlands increases animal diversity, it really is not good for the climate (current methane levels are 1745ppb compared to a historical 650kyr average range of 320-790ppb). It'd be more environmentally friendly to build a motorway junction (remember, 62x more polluting than CO2).

This is the kind of myopic thinking (on the part of the LDA) that went into T5 as well. How much did it cost again (££ and CO2) for ecological remediation to remove a few hundred badgers? High-profile projects like these should accommodate the issues on the EIA where possible but stop pandering to the pressure groups that threaten litigation over it. Friends of the Earth and groups like them, bless 'em, do a good job at quantifying the number of species in an area etc, but they don't know jack about the global issues of pollutant emissions and wasted energy.

To be honest, a lot of the 'sustainability' aspect of the London 2012 games seems a gimmick to me, other than a few aspects: 20% onsite renewable generation (if it's even achieved), CHP and greenery. From the LDA's history (wrt Palestra) and from what colleagues at Buros tell me, I wouldn't be surprised if their sustainable ethos either doesn't work or gets panned by quantity surveyors.

Furthermore, the media and public needs to dissociate subjective terms like 'biodiversity' and 'natural habitat' from the real issues of heteronuclear pollutant emission and associated stratospheric warming, which should be our no1 preoccupying environmental consideration. Long story short: people need a lesson in science.

[marrio415]

the only gimmick is that you think it's a gimmick read what darjole has written again 2012 is all about legacy and if you or iron man can't see that then you really are blind

[TallBox]

Originally Posted by marrio415

the only gimmick is that you think it's a gimmick read what darjole has written again 2012 is all about legacy and if you or iron man can't see that then you really are blind

*sigh* This is the problem with the public. Scant knowledge of real sustainability issues and mindlessly parroting dumbed-down media blurbs but with the audacity to consider themselves an authority on the matter.

marrio415 - don't have such a reckless attitude to the environment. It's not a case of 'plant a few trees, throw in a couple cycle tracks and it'll all be okay'. We have to move away from the Dave Angel Eco Warrior mentality

[JimB]

Originally Posted by shaun

That's really bad. Not being facetious, but while natural wetlands increases animal diversity, it really is not good for the climate (current methane levels are 1745ppb compared to a historical 650kyr average range of 320-790ppb). It'd be more environmentally friendly to build a motorway junction (remember, 62x more polluting than CO2).

This is the kind of myopic thinking (on the part of the LDA) that went into T5 as well. How much did it cost again (££ and CO2) for ecological remediation to remove a few hundred badgers? High-profile projects like these should accommodate the issues on the EIA where possible but stop pandering to the pressure groups that threaten litigation over it. Friends of the Earth and groups like them, bless 'em, do a good job at quantifying the number of species in an area etc, but they don't know jack about the global issues of pollutant emissions and wasted energy.

To be honest, a lot of the 'sustainability' aspect of the London 2012 games seems a gimmick to me, other than a few aspects: 20% onsite renewable generation (if it's even achieved), CHP and greenery. From the LDA's history (wrt Palestra) and from what colleagues at Buros tell me, I wouldn't be surprised if their sustainable ethos either doesn't work or gets panned by quantity surveyors.

Furthermore, the media and public needs to dissociate subjective terms like 'biodiversity' and 'natural habitat' from the real issues of heteronuclear pollutant emission and associated stratospheric warming, which should be our no1 preoccupying environmental consideration. Long story short: people need a lesson in science.

Well, shit....if we can't restore tiny areas of natural wetlands to what they once were for fear that the world will suffocate in all enveloping methane, then the world must have been one truly fucked up place before man mercifully came along and destroyed all the previously existing vast hectares of wetlands in order to build motorways and cities and factories and to develop intensive farming.

Yep, mother nature is the enemy. Man is the saviour.

Seriously, mate...get a grip. And don't talk down to others on this board. Long story short: you need a lesson in humility.

[BeestonLad]

Originally Posted by marrio415

the only gimmick is that you think it's a gimmick read what darjole has written again 2012 is all about legacy and if you or iron man can't see that then you really are blind

Why do you always get so defensive, you're like a little kid. Id prefer to listen to someone like Shaun who actually sounds like he knows what hes on about

[TallBox]

JimB

To be fair, I started out having a go at the LDA and the tone of my post was written with that in mind. Marrio410 then obviously disagreed with me (without reason or qualification, mind you) so I retorted.

On the subject of humility, why don't you suggest it to some of the blindly supportive proponents of the London Olympics* who won't hear of any comment that bears detriment to the games and are quick to flame any dissenters? It's like they're children singing "la-la-la I'm not listening *2012 Olympics are the greenest* la-la-la" . But when I come along, somebody who has a little knowledge in the field and contributes to the discussion but ends up saying something those blindly supportive forumers dislike hearing, I'm told to be humble

On the rest of your post.... god help us. It's that kind of hippy attitude that damages the environmentalist 'cause' (for want of a better word); the idea that in order to be environmental, we need to give up civilisation and urbanity and retreat to the forests to live off the land. Obviously, that will turn people away and is indeed why it deterred me for some time from being an 'environmentalist'. Sustainability means maintaining our way of life as best we can without raping our planet. So that means, while I support the greenery after the Olympics, I'm sceptical as to any claim for it being sustainable considering that proposed natural wetlands are going to exacerbate the climate problem, not remediate it. The ODA have a nice idea, but I just hope that the implementation is better than what's coming out of the press releases.




*Not directing this at DarJole, who although is very supportive, has also been instrumental in propagating London 2012 development information to this forum

[veronika]

After 2028 none of us need to worry about anything

[marrio415]

Whats the point in saying something when people are obviously against it no matter what you say.This is why i support the games.1-Regenerating one of the poorest parts of london if not the uk.Stratford looks like a bomb has hit it,there are no jobs/or any great paying jobs of worth.The olympics will bring business,jobs,new infrastructure to the area not to mention the benefits of the olympic park i.e the sporting and recreational facillities and the olympic village which will be turned into affodable housing and then there's the Stratford City Development to.I've been a few times to stratford and this surely has to be good for the residents.2 London and the country will be in the world spotlight after the Bejing games right up until closing ceremony of the paralympics.And we should and will show the whole world what london as a city and the country is about(the noise coming from this forum though says were nothing but a bunch of wingers.)We should be proud of what is gonna be achieved THATS THE LEGACY.I have to say if this was the world cup coming everyone would be up for it rightly so but it wouldn't bring to stratford what the olympics is bringing would it.Beeston Lad yes i do get defensive about this thats because i'm sick of the negativity toward this and okay were all entitled to opinions but it does get to a point where it's like hang on,if this was Nottingham you certainly wouldn't be on here bashing it as we know what some parts of Nottingham is like.I wish my hometown got a regeneration like that.I think just because it's london as well is why people bash it,this country has a habit of knocking the good were like the tabloids.Well there's my say if you don't like it lump it.BRING ON 2012

[ben77]

Can someone remind me how much this is costing. Isn't it around 500 million. This is my only real problem with this stadium. It just seems so much compared to other stadia being built currently.

[IronMan89]

Yes, 670Millions €.... at start the price was 400M€ (280M£)

[Flogging Molly]

All this bickering comes down to one thing. Everybody wants one of the worlds most organised and outstanding cities to fail. Im from Birmingham, I have a right to, but even I am not that ignorant to see they are going to produce one of the finest games in history! Why do others feel the need to oppose everything being done!

Money leads to success. London has more then any other city apart from Beijing when it comes to the games. It is going to be along way off being a failure. Wake up and smell the coffee guys.

[IronMan89]

they were awarded the Games with LIES

[Mo Rush]

Originally Posted by IronMan89

Yes, 670Millions €.... at start the price was 400M€ (280M£)

at the start every bid city quoted ridiculous prices, thats the IOC's issue not the bid cities. the IOC asked for 2005 prices.