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Old June 4th, 2010, 11:41 AM   #1161
vijay_t
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kvijayasundaram View Post
Vijay_t,
watchout for turtle lovers in this forum, there are quite a few around, and will land right on you.
Once I tried to bring up the same point and I had a very bad experience with those turtle guys ( A.K.A environmentalists)
Let them come to me ... i will show how stupid they are ... the whole word saying india's infra is developing in TURTLE speed ( because of these turtle guys!! ).... China today achieved this elite stage because they won't listen these rubbish... china built one of the world's marvels dam by destroying 100's of village and even some city but in the end millions of people get benefited.... and 1000's of village and cities get development.

" No cities would be built with out massive environment changes "
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Old June 4th, 2010, 07:40 PM   #1162
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To the folks who argue Development should trump over Nature concerns -

I fully understand your emotions. Development cannot be stopped and I believe progress is part of mankind. I wish to simply highlight a few facts.

a) Its never MAN vs NATURE.. Remember we are part of Nature. So respecting the boundaries is only sensible. You dont touch fire because you burn yourselves.

b) When you claims cars or consumption pattern, please do not forget that their land area is more than three times the size of India. Their population is one third ours at best, which basically gives them a 9 times override. I am talking of US as an example.

c) If you noticed a large number of waterways and wet areas in Chennai have already been lost of development. See how the so called low lying areas go through every monsoon. Thats not due to development.. Thats due to lack of respect and understanding of Nature.

d) Since many times we have the habit of aping the West, please visit there and see the high standards they hold to protect their natural reserves.

Again, I am not for or against this particular project in the name of environment. I just wanted you to think outside your usual way of thinking.

Nature, we can harness for our development. Just imagine, if you could develop a miracle drug say for AIDS or CANCER which will only be possible only br protecting those turtles or a particular patch of forest or wetland then what will your attitude be towards the same.

Our culture has taught us to respect Nature we live in. (Thaiai pazhithalum thannirai pazhikathe)

So if you take science, culture or mere common sense, Nature respect is essential for not just progress but mere survival.

SO LET US ALL PROGRESS AND EVOLVE AND DEVELOP BY RESPECTING NATURE (AND THAT INCLUDES HUMANS TOO). HARMONY IS THE KEY WORD HERE
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Old June 4th, 2010, 08:07 PM   #1163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vijay_t View Post
Let them come to me ... i will show how stupid they are ... the whole word saying india's infra is developing in TURTLE speed ( because of these turtle guys!! ).... China today achieved this elite stage because they won't listen these rubbish... china built one of the world's marvels dam by destroying 100's of village and even some city but in the end millions of people get benefited.... and 1000's of village and cities get development.

" No cities would be built with out massive environment changes "

Even i had a very bad experience with the " turtle guys". nyway i agree with u 100%. if we dont kill the turtles we will definitely kill ourselves from the fumes from cars stuck in traffic burning 3-4 times more fuel than they ought to!! Some people were even worried about the fisherman getting displaced! Well i hope they do coz they have turned the coast into a cesspool with their open defecation!! And i speak from experience coz i took part in the recent coastal cleanup operation. In fact the kids from the slums derived pleasure in littering the place right in front of our eyes while we tirelessly cleaned the sands!!

Last edited by saurabh85; June 4th, 2010 at 08:52 PM.
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Old June 4th, 2010, 08:35 PM   #1164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vijay_t View Post
Let them come to me ... i will show how stupid they are ... the whole word saying india's infra is developing in TURTLE speed ( because of these turtle guys!! ).... China today achieved this elite stage because they won't listen these rubbish... china built one of the world's marvels dam by destroying 100's of village and even some city but in the end millions of people get benefited.... and 1000's of village and cities get development.

" No cities would be built with out massive environment changes "
Do you know how those 'World marvels dams' in china has damaged their ecosystem?

Go and read about the World famous Three Gorges Dam in China. Once touted as the world's largest project, China has recently admitted the devastations caused by it - And I'm not talking just about your so called 'Turtles'. It has increased the damages due to floods, destroyed agricultural lands downstream of the dam and so on.

After so many years of ruthless development without any concern for natural impacts, China is now paying for it. It is spending billions in trying to clear the injurious smogs caused in its big cities, replacing the lost forests due to rampant logging, cleaning up its major rivers like Yangt-ze, that were polluted by mindless industries...

India can never achieve that 'elite' stage by ruthlessly building without respecting nature. No single organism is alone or can be sacrificed in the name of development. Any such thing will have a chain reaction of effects. When people talk about the Olive Ridleys of Chennai, it is not just the turtles. It includes the entire coastal ecosystem of the place already endangered by the growing filth and polluted waterways like cooum.

Let us go ahead with infrastructural developments that are in tune with the ecosystem. Otherwise, years down the lane we'll again spend Billions cleaning up the mess that we cause today.

Always 'Seivana Thirundha chei' (Whatever we do, let us do it in the correct way)
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Old June 5th, 2010, 08:54 AM   #1165
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Can anyone please tell what is the status of maduravoyal- port expressway project. i am very much eager to know about that project as it will bring lot of prosperity to chennai. i am sure many will be using that road. can anyone tell me whats happening there???
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Old June 5th, 2010, 09:05 AM   #1166
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g k vasan and alagiri can surely help us to get clearance from environmental ministry. why are we still struggling to start the work
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Old June 5th, 2010, 09:16 AM   #1167
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Originally Posted by saurabh85 View Post
Even i had a very bad experience with the " turtle guys". nyway i agree with u 100%. if we dont kill the turtles we will definitely kill ourselves from the fumes from cars stuck in traffic burning 3-4 times more fuel than they ought to!! Some people were even worried about the fisherman getting displaced! Well i hope they do coz they have turned the coast into a cesspool with their open defecation!! And i speak from experience coz i took part in the recent coastal cleanup operation. In fact the kids from the slums derived pleasure in littering the place right in front of our eyes while we tirelessly cleaned the sands!!
Its high time the fishermen (Women) of chennai are civilised by the NGOs with the Govt's assistance.As the fish catch is decling they may be taught other skills and relocated.

Last edited by ranga; June 5th, 2010 at 10:55 AM.
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Old June 5th, 2010, 09:19 AM   #1168
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Originally Posted by RajBang View Post
g k vasan and alagiri can surely help us to get clearance from environmental ministry. why are we still struggling to start the work
Jairam Ramesh is stubborn.Let the state govt commence construction come what may as the project has the blessings of the P.M
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Old June 5th, 2010, 09:26 AM   #1169
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Originally Posted by ranga View Post
Jairam Ramesh is stubborn.Let the state govt commence construction come what may as the project has the blessings of the P.M
IS THE PROJECT SHELVED??????????????????????
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Old June 5th, 2010, 05:37 PM   #1170
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Originally Posted by vijayvmail View Post
Do you know how those 'World marvels dams' in china has damaged their ecosystem?

Go and read about the World famous Three Gorges Dam in China. Once touted as the world's largest project, China has recently admitted the devastations caused by it - And I'm not talking just about your so called 'Turtles'. It has increased the damages due to floods, destroyed agricultural lands downstream of the dam and so on.

After so many years of ruthless development without any concern for natural impacts, China is now paying for it. It is spending billions in trying to clear the injurious smogs caused in its big cities, replacing the lost forests due to rampant logging, cleaning up its major rivers like Yangt-ze, that were polluted by mindless industries...

India can never achieve that 'elite' stage by ruthlessly building without respecting nature. No single organism is alone or can be sacrificed in the name of development. Any such thing will have a chain reaction of effects. When people talk about the Olive Ridleys of Chennai, it is not just the turtles. It includes the entire coastal ecosystem of the place already endangered by the growing filth and polluted waterways like cooum.

Let us go ahead with infrastructural developments that are in tune with the ecosystem. Otherwise, years down the lane we'll again spend Billions cleaning up the mess that we cause today.

Always 'Seivana Thirundha chei' (Whatever we do, let us do it in the correct way)
Well said ..
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Old June 6th, 2010, 11:13 PM   #1171
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Green flag for Expressway feasibility report

http://www.deccanchronicle.com/chenn...ity-report-629

June 3: The work on the first phase of an elevated expressway connecting Lig-ht House and East Coast Road is all set to start with the steering committee of the state highways depart-ment accepting the detailed feasibility report of the project. “We have sent the DFR for the state government’s appr-oval. After getting a go-ahe-ad from the government, we will float tender for preparing the detailed project rep-ort,” a senior highways department official said.

“Following the completion of DPR, the project has to get coastal regulation zone clearance. After getting all the clearances, the work will be completed in three,” the official said. The highlight of the elevated corridor is the proposed signature bridge to come up across Adyar Riv-er near Srinivasapuram. “The proposed bridge is modelled on Sydney Harbour Bridge. The 250 metre-long bridge would be constructed at a cost of Rs 32 core,” the official said.

...
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Old June 7th, 2010, 02:24 AM   #1172
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Maduravoyal interchange - Courtesy - Dinamalar

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Old June 7th, 2010, 03:05 AM   #1173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vijayvmail View Post
Do you know how those 'World marvels dams' in china has damaged their ecosystem?

Go and read about the World famous Three Gorges Dam in China. Once touted as the world's largest project, China has recently admitted the devastations caused by it - And I'm not talking just about your so called 'Turtles'. It has increased the damages due to floods, destroyed agricultural lands downstream of the dam and so on.

After so many years of ruthless development without any concern for natural impacts, China is now paying for it. It is spending billions in trying to clear the injurious smogs caused in its big cities, replacing the lost forests due to rampant logging, cleaning up its major rivers like Yangt-ze, that were polluted by mindless industries...

India can never achieve that 'elite' stage by ruthlessly building without respecting nature. No single organism is alone or can be sacrificed in the name of development. Any such thing will have a chain reaction of effects. When people talk about the Olive Ridleys of Chennai, it is not just the turtles. It includes the entire coastal ecosystem of the place already endangered by the growing filth and polluted waterways like cooum.

Let us go ahead with infrastructural developments that are in tune with the ecosystem. Otherwise, years down the lane we'll again spend Billions cleaning up the mess that we cause today.

Always 'Seivana Thirundha chei' (Whatever we do, let us do it in the correct way)
Boss ...i am in singapore..i went to china few times... some i agree with u ...we can not and must not follow china way fully...they are mad... the point is every medicine have side effects, to come out from poverty, to change one billion people life, to clean up a messed country like india we need a medicine called Money, sure it will give some side effects to do one of the very tough mission in the world..... but we must take the medicine and the side effects can be handled.

Even though you are saying china is spending billions to tackle the side effect, they already earned trillions and cured poverty a lot...

In India only some guys thinks so brilliant and even oppose to axe trees to build roads, dams, fly overs, air port ...etc .... Can you tell me which city in the world built with out doing this ??? ......if you really care nature in particle way then you must ask govt to put more tress in others place when they cut in one place........ when india try to develop, you peoples talk about global warming, nature, moon, mars ...balh blah... which are affected only by developed countries not by india. WE CAN NOT STOP OUR GROWTH BECAUSE OF OTHER RICH COUNTRIES MISTAKE ...

Can you tell me if they built this Express way is those pillars of express way going to spit acid or any dirty things in to sea to kill the turtles ???... do you know how many bridges, flyovers and even tunnels built in the sea ?? it will harm those sea nature for short term only after that no harm for them...... if you still say those turtle can not live here if they built this express way then no prob we must sacrifice some thing to develop the city to give more jobs to poor humans to feed their kid and family who can't live in this world .........there is no one to worry about poor humans as much they worry about animals. India is a big country we already giving a lot of space for many animals , we can't pay huge price to let these animals live in cities ...

Last edited by vijay_t; June 7th, 2010 at 03:25 AM.
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Old June 7th, 2010, 04:16 AM   #1174
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good find friend. how u got it?
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Old June 7th, 2010, 05:23 AM   #1175
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^source is from dinamalar.com from the gallery at the end of the main page.
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Old June 7th, 2010, 05:51 AM   #1176
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So sharp bends!!.. Motorists need to be careful.
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Old June 7th, 2010, 06:05 AM   #1177
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^source is from dinamalar.com from the gallery at the end of the main page.
thanks satishanu, i got it
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Old June 7th, 2010, 06:24 AM   #1178
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Boss ...i am in singapore..i went to china few times... some i agree with u ...we can not and must not follow china way fully...they are mad... the point is every medicine have side effects, to come out from poverty, to change one billion people life, to clean up a messed country like india we need a medicine called Money, sure it will give some side effects to do one of the very tough mission in the world..... but we must take the medicine and the side effects can be handled.

Even though you are saying china is spending billions to tackle the side effect, they already earned trillions and cured poverty a lot...

In India only some guys thinks so brilliant and even oppose to axe trees to build roads, dams, fly overs, air port ...etc .... Can you tell me which city in the world built with out doing this ??? ......if you really care nature in particle way then you must ask govt to put more tress in others place when they cut in one place........ when india try to develop, you peoples talk about global warming, nature, moon, mars ...balh blah... which are affected only by developed countries not by india. WE CAN NOT STOP OUR GROWTH BECAUSE OF OTHER RICH COUNTRIES MISTAKE ...

Can you tell me if they built this Express way is those pillars of express way going to spit acid or any dirty things in to sea to kill the turtles ???... do you know how many bridges, flyovers and even tunnels built in the sea ?? it will harm those sea nature for short term only after that no harm for them...... if you still say those turtle can not live here if they built this express way then no prob we must sacrifice some thing to develop the city to give more jobs to poor humans to feed their kid and family who can't live in this world .........there is no one to worry about poor humans as much they worry about animals. India is a big country we already giving a lot of space for many animals , we can't pay huge price to let these animals live in cities ...
I never said that we should stop our development projects. I do know of so many places where there are tunnels and highways out on the sea. And as you said there will be side effects.

All I am saying is that the side effects should just be that - side effects. They should not turn into a disaster.

The coastal expressway plan is a new one for us in Chennai. It is not like any other project in the city. So, we should take extra care to ensure that there are no major disasters - this includes all spheres: environment, economical, safety and social.

This will be long term structure coming up on fragile ecosystems. We can undo any damage caused. So, we should perform adequate research beforehand and then proceed. If there are potential problems, we should have proper road maps to handle those. This is all I'm saying.
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Old June 7th, 2010, 10:24 AM   #1179
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a) Its never MAN vs NATURE.. Remember we are part of Nature. So respecting the boundaries is only sensible. You dont touch fire because you burn yourselves.
You are talking like tamil teacher with out facts and figures....

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Originally Posted by satchitananda View Post
b) When you claims cars or consumption pattern, please do not forget that their land area is more than three times the size of India. Their population is one third ours at best, which basically gives them a 9 times override. I am talking of US as an example.
So meaning can we ask japan and singapore not to buy cars ? by your calculation.... ?? they wont listen anyway. We Indians for centuries become most backward people compared to others.
A small Story, If i am rich, i got a very big house, centralized AC, TV, Lift..etc even no need so much.... my neighbor is a poor family they don't have even power & living in hut ... they suddenly start to earn money and getting their basic need like lights and fans ..... so can i go and tell him don't use more than two FAN because of "environment" ...if he accept i am ready to drop one fan also (but i got full AC)..... same thing what happens in the global warming stage ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by satchitananda View Post
c) If you noticed a large number of waterways and wet areas in Chennai have already been lost of development. See how the so called low lying areas go through every monsoon. Thats not due to development.. Thats due to lack of respect and understanding of Nature.
We didn't lost this due to development , we lost because of slum like development (unorganized) ...no funding and govt let everybody to do what ever to survive ...end up like this...now they got money to spend for projects.

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Originally Posted by satchitananda View Post
d) Since many times we have the habit of aping the West, please visit there and see the high standards they hold to protect their natural reserves.
I went to Europe, China, Australia, SE asia... i used to see news from other countries ...when people like u protest to stop some basic development which india desperately needs ..they are laughing at us..they are saying we are stupid ... google it to believe......As i said, if you really educated you will ask govt to replace the loss of nature to compromise instead of protesting against a project. Ask govt to put 200 tress when they cut 100. Its meaningful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by satchitananda View Post
Again, I am not for or against this particular project in the name of environment. I just wanted you to think outside your usual way of thinking.
You are !! By igniting this fire of foolishness ...when educated people like u wont understand then once the fire ignited it will burn the whole thing.

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Originally Posted by satchitananda View Post
Nature, we can harness for our development. Just imagine, if you could develop a miracle drug say for AIDS or CANCER which will only be possible only br protecting those turtles or a particular patch of forest or wetland then what will your attitude be towards the same.
Brother come on ... your imagination is too much.... few decades before in the place where is your home is now located lot of tress were there and animals too...can you please leave your home and plant those again so that we can get back your dreamy nature.


Quote:
Originally Posted by vijayvmail View Post
I never said that we should stop our development projects. I do know of so many places where there are tunnels and highways out on the sea.
Did you see the news.. if i am not wrong they said they are going to build a bridge same like the one in Australia ..so is the proof enough that its not something new in the world to experiment ...even mubai i already buit one right ?....... in chennai only people talk like scientist when even a common thing try to implement...example: Wearing Helmet, water harvesting

Quote:
Originally Posted by vijayvmail View Post
All I am saying is that the side effects should just be that - side effects. They should not turn into a disaster.
Building bridges won't cause Tsunami...don't see many english movies...Just kidding ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by vijayvmail View Post
The coastal expressway plan is a new one for us in Chennai. It is not like any other project in the city. So, we should take extra care to ensure that there are no major disasters
Boss ...Indian cities are not updated to the world standard ...we are many decades behind.... most of the thing we are trying to do will be new for us for sure....but it not a reason to oppose , to take more proactive step already indian govt always use experts from abroad for most of the projects ...thats good enough.
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Old June 7th, 2010, 12:21 PM   #1180
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What is the conceptual difference between chennai byepass and ORR n IRR ? all cut major highways rite ?
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