Possible zoning changes for 400 foot buildings in South Lake Union

[velciane]

They prevent taller buildings south of downtown due to the industrial areas... the growth is going to move east and north due to logistics and terrain.... I support density in SLU 100%.

[Rogue Linguist]

Originally Posted by velciane

They prevent taller buildings south of downtown due to the industrial areas... the growth is going to move east and north due to logistics and terrain.... I support density in SLU 100%.

But why wouldn't the City allow equal density in Belltown? It doesn't make sense to me that they don't. It both looks and feels odd to me.

[mhays]

As a Belltown resident, I'd love to see comprehensive 400' zoning at least.

[velciane]

I feel that Belltown should be of equal heights, but it would need to be staggered as you get closer to the waterfront. Similar to the CBD.

[rj2uman]

Originally Posted by Sounder

It can't get too high because of SeaTac airport. That's why we need the increased height limits in South Lake Union. Who cares about the freeway views? Hopefully in a few decades the sucker is capped and the space utilized.

I think that 400 feet can be more than accodated all the way south through at least the Sodo area. Even with Boeing Field. And I guess that no one but myself cares about the view from the I-5. As I said it was just a nostalgic thing for me. Oh and all the people on Capitol Hill that will lose their veiw lol.

[citruspastels]

I'm with ya!

I think much of SLU could use an upzone, just not all the way to the water front. I think most views would be respected and lots of density would be created with the "transit oriented" option.

[mokocoko]

Originally Posted by rj2uman

I think that 400 feet can be more than accodated all the way south through at least the Sodo area. Even with Boeing Field. And I guess that no one but myself cares about the view from the I-5. As I said it was just a nostalgic thing for me. Oh and all the people on Capitol Hill that will lose their veiw lol.

That land is mostly filled-in tide flats. It can't support large buildings. Even just putting up an elevated track for the Link Light Rail line required all the structural supports to anchored 150 feet underground. For a 400 building it might have to be 1000 feet.

[rj2uman]

I thought most of the tidal flats were even further south and west towards Harbor Island. I tried to google some good maps to see but got tired and ate a burrito instead.....

[Rogue Linguist]

Originally Posted by mhays

As a Belltown resident, I'd love to see comprehensive 400' zoning at least.

So would I. Why don't they allow it? I mean, there are already 30-storey buildings in that area. Just to leave it out of this slew of zoning upgrades will leave it looking like some sort of bowl. I personally think it should receive the most consideration of any district in the city for zoning upgrading. It's the most logical place.

[Rogue Linguist]

Originally Posted by velciane

I feel that Belltown should be of equal heights, but it would need to be staggered as you get closer to the waterfront. Similar to the CBD.

But it seems that it's not even staggered--it's just really restricted.

[Sounder]

Originally Posted by rj2uman

I thought most of the tidal flats were even further south and west towards Harbor Island. I tried to google some good maps to see but got tired and ate a burrito instead.....

Just about everything south of Pioneer Sq. to the hill is fill.

[Sounder]

Here is a map. Pioneer Sq. is the dark spot on the right across from Alki.



Here is a later map from 1874:

[Seattlelife]

Now that I have thought about this for a while I certainly would like to see the height increase.

I am mad at myself for being so influenced by that article. People complaining about increased height bother me as much as the people that complain about a new 520 bridge, a renovation of Key Arena, the price of car tabs and, heaven forbid, concerts in the Seattle Center!! Give me a break.

Some people just can't seem to see beyond the walls of their comfortable home.

[CrazyAboutCities]

People will always find ways to complain about anything. I am sure all of us have something to bitch about too. That is part of life whether we like it or not.

[Seattleguy]

I am generally in favor of taller buildings, but I really like the views of the Space Needle and the Olympics being preserved from densely crowded Capitol Hill. Maybe I am just being nostalgic here. I like driving down from the Hill and seeing if this is going to be a "mountain viewing day" or not.On the other hand, I don't see why heights in the Denny Triangle and Regrade should be restricted to heights less than the CBD. That doesn't make sense.

[SeattleRedhawk86]

Couldn't agree more on the last post.

[Seattlelife]

Originally Posted by Seattleguy

I am generally in favor of taller buildings, but I really like the views of the Space Needle and the Olympics being preserved from densely crowded Capitol Hill. Maybe I am just being nostalgic here. I like driving down from the Hill and seeing if this is going to be a "mountain viewing day" or not.On the other hand, I don't see why heights in the Denny Triangle and Regrade should be restricted to heights less than the CBD. That doesn't make sense.

I certainly want to keep the Space Needle away from tall towers just like I wouldn't want to see anything tall next to the Eiffel Tower. It just seems like people are concerned about the height change for the wrong reasons is all.

[velciane]

Originally Posted by Seattlelife

I certainly want to keep the Space Needle away from tall towers just like I wouldn't want to see anything tall next to the Eiffel Tower. It just seems like people are concerned about the height change for the wrong reasons is all.

I understand your comment, but I am curious to where you would propose to put new development.

[Sounder]

Originally Posted by Seattleguy

I am generally in favor of taller buildings, but I really like the views of the Space Needle and the Olympics being preserved from densely crowded Capitol Hill. Maybe I am just being nostalgic here. I like driving down from the Hill and seeing if this is going to be a "mountain viewing day" or not.On the other hand, I don't see why heights in the Denny Triangle and Regrade should be restricted to heights less than the CBD. That doesn't make sense.

Important view corridors should be preserved, and we should have design codes that prevent turning the area into a dark forest of skyscrapers, but if you want your views, move. Magnolia will still have unspolied views of the Olympics. If we don't build up in places where the demand allows it, we get sprawl.

[SeattleRedhawk86]

In the past five years, the South Lake Union neighborhood has morphed from a run-down area of low-income housing and abandoned manufacturing to an office hub with its own streetcar, Whole Foods and loft condos.

On Tuesday, Seattle started sketching out a new skyline for the neighborhood, one with 40-story condo and 24-story office towers potentially filling the blocks between Denny Way, Aurora Avenue and the lake shore. The city hopes to direct future regional growth to this area, adding 16,000 jobs and 8,000 more housing units by 2024.

The city will consider more than building sizes, said Diane Sugimura, director of the Department of Plannning and Development. "How can we also accomplish other objectives such as historical preservation, affordable housing, open space?"

The plans were presented at an open house Tuesday evening in the neighborhood of squat, rectangular buildings, or "bread loafs," as city planners call them. The tallest building in the area, the Mirabella retirement community under construction at Fairview Avenue North and Denny Way, is 12 stories.

In exchange for providing public benefits such as affordable housing, developers could potentially build up to 400 feet high. Nearby Queen Anne Hill is 456 feet tall. The details of those benefits have not been decided, Sugimura said.

The planning department will spend the next 12 months studying the environmental impacts of each alternative, and expects to make a proposal to the City Council in 2009. Given the long timeline, potential changes would probably not affect construction on online retailer Amazon's planned 1.6 million-square-foot headquarters, expected to open in 2010 and 2011.

The proposal for South Lake Union would build on what has been done downtown. The City Council in 2006 approved new zoning rules, allowing more height for downtown builders who paid into an affordable-housing fund. Ten building projects have taken advantage of the program so far, city planners said.

Sugimura presented four plans that ranged from keeping height limits much as they are now — about six stories — to allowing dramatically taller buildings by developers who provide public benefits.

Some highlights of what will be studied:

• Alternative 1. Residential buildings up to about 40 stories and commercial buildings up to 24 stories would be allowed along major streets. East of Minor Avenue North, residential buildings could rise to about 16 stories, and commercial buildings to eight stories. As with the Whole Foods building at Westlake Avenue and Denny Way, the top floors of the tallest buildings would be skinnier than the base floors.

This alternative would also allow tall residential towers with low row houses in between, similar to Georgia Street in Vancouver, B.C.

• Alternative 2. The tallest residential buildings, at about 40 stories, would be confined to areas closest to Aurora Avenue North and Denny Way. The heights would step down in the areas closer to the lake and Fairview Avenue North, to about 24 stories for both commercial and residential buildings. The area east of Minor Avenue North would keep its existing zoning limit of about seven stories.

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Both Alternatives 1 and 2 call for a residential core around Eighth Avenue North and Ninth Avenue North, north of Denny Park, where commercial development would be limited to two stories.

• Alternative 3. Residential buildings could go up to 240 feet, or about 24 stories, near the intersection of Aurora Avenue North and Denny Way. Commercial buildings could be built to about 12 stories in different areas east of Fairview Avenue North. The area east of Minor Avenue North would keep its existing zoning.

• Alternative 4. Keep existing zoning. Developers could build to about 12 stories along Denny Way and would be limited to six to eight stories in most other areas.

The plans do not specify what kind of public benefits developers would have to provide to build higher, but city planners said affordable housing, open space and sidewalk improvements would likely be part of the mix.

The city's proposals are similar to those suggested earlier this year by the community group South Lake Union Friends and Neighbors Community Council. The Seattle Times has a representative on the group's board and owns properties that would be affected by zoning changes.

Steven Paget, president of the group, said members will listen to neighborhood feedback, see what comes out of the environmental-impact study and eventually recommend a preferred alternative.

A representative for Paul Allen's development company, Vulcan, the area's biggest property owner, said no one was available to comment.

Kevin McCarthy, a board member for the community group Lake Union Opportunity Alliance, called alternatives 1 and 2 unacceptable, saying they were inconsistent with the city's growth plan. He likes alternative 3 but wants to limit towers to a single block and require planning for schools, affordable and low-income housing, libraries and other public services.

"If a small city is going to be built, there needs to be some planning to provide services for that neighborhood," he said.



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