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Old February 8th, 2009, 02:51 PM   #281
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its really not brain surgery to adjust a stand to add a tunnel
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Old February 8th, 2009, 02:59 PM   #282
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobH View Post
Yes, but there's no way the main stand will be ripped up at Old Trafford to comply with this just for TV reasons.
That is exactly the reason why the FIFA prefers bids with a lot of proposed stadia rather than existing ones. New stadium can always designed along the newest FIFA stadium guideline. Where it is difficult and expensive to implement these requirements on existing infrastructure.
And believe me the FIFA will insist on their own ideas of what a World Cup stadium has to look like. They are neither used nor willing to make compromises.
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Old February 8th, 2009, 04:03 PM   #283
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FIFA may well prefer a country to build 12 new stadiums but very few countries will be willing to do that. Compromises will be made in the US, in England, in Spain...it sounds like Qatar would be perfect for them!
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Old February 9th, 2009, 02:22 AM   #284
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In that case the Benelux has something to offer. Possibly only 1 stadium will only be updated to meet the FIFA requirements. All the others will be brand new or expanded.
There are already plans without a WC for a lot of them, a possible WC would only boost them.
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Old February 9th, 2009, 03:38 AM   #285
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Great Britain has many very nice stadiums and a lot of traditional stadiums. But you don't have many very large stadia with a capacity of 50.000 plus X.
I believe that might be a serious problem for winning a Worldcup bid. There are quite a few countries that have more of those very large stadia than the UK. And for a worldcup you would probably need at least 6 arenas wih a capacity of 50.000 and more, I believe. And the worldcup bid is not relly anything much emotional, it's mostly about money, about the big business. And if the Fifa makes more money with a worldcup somewhere else they'll just go there instead of the UK.
So as good as the infrastructure is in the uk, the stadias capacities are mostly at the rather low end for a worldcup.
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Old February 9th, 2009, 04:04 AM   #286
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Quote:
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Yes, but there's no way the main stand will be ripped up at Old Trafford to comply with this just for TV reasons.
uhm yes it will. I remind you, its called the FIFA world cup. South Africa has learnt this lesson very well.
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Old February 9th, 2009, 09:14 AM   #287
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alemanniafan View Post
Great Britain has many very nice stadiums and a lot of traditional stadiums. But you don't have many very large stadia with a capacity of 50.000 plus X.
I believe that might be a serious problem for winning a Worldcup bid. There are quite a few countries that have more of those very large stadia than the UK. And for a worldcup you would probably need at least 6 arenas wih a capacity of 50.000 and more, I believe. And the worldcup bid is not relly anything much emotional, it's mostly about money, about the big business. And if the Fifa makes more money with a worldcup somewhere else they'll just go there instead of the UK.
So as good as the infrastructure is in the uk, the stadias capacities are mostly at the rather low end for a worldcup.
Eh?


This is Japan '02.


Yokohama International Stadium 70,000
Saitama Saitama Stadium 2002 63,000
Fukuroi Shizuoka 'ECOPA' Stadium 50,600
Osaka Nagai Stadium 50,000
Rifu Miyagi Stadium 49,000
Ōita Ōita Stadium 43,000
Niigata Niigata Stadium 42,300
Kashima Kashima Stadium 42,000
Kobe Kobe Wing Stadium 42,000
Sapporo Sapporo Dome 42,000

Germany '06 had 74,000 and 67,000 as it's largest stadiums, most were less than 50,000. So England can do better than the last two WCs in terms of seating capacity.

Just for starters:

Wembley 90,000
Old Trafford 76,000 -90,000
Stanley Park 75,000
Emirates 60,000
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Old February 9th, 2009, 09:48 AM   #288
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Sunderland was designed to be expanded to 64,000. You have to think a World Cup would see that happen.

Then there's also expanded grounds at Newcastle and Aston Villa.
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Old February 9th, 2009, 01:17 PM   #289
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Hello, I've read this entire thread with some interest, as I'm keen to track the progress in England bidding for 2018.

Regarding the Stadia, there is one that hasn't been mentioned yet, although it could be a little controversial, but I'll throw it out there for discussion!

Stadium:MK in Milton Keynes.

A brand new stadium with a current capacity of 22,000. The second tier is already in place, and awaiting seating (probably this summer if financing is found) which will bring it to 32,000. However, it has also been cited that the stadium can be increased to 45,00 quite readily, should the need ever arise.
So that's a brand new 45,000 seater stadium, built to UEFA Elite standard, designed by the same people as Wembley & Emirates stadiums, with open concourse and large, padded seats (as with Emirates)
Location Wise, Milton Keynes has fantastic transport links (East Coast Main Line, M1 etc) and is a fast growing area.

It's not going to be at the top of any wish list, but is surely at least worth looking at?

(ps, please don't flame me )

Some pretty good images can be found HERE
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Old February 9th, 2009, 01:25 PM   #290
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Will Milton Keynes be abe to cope with the tourists etc. and, although I don't know the city well, is it really somewhere we'd like to choose over, say, Portsmouth or Bristol as a location if either of those stadiums come to fruition?

Also, I wonder whether there would be a bad taste left picking MK Dons' Stadium. A lot of football fans still don't particularly like the club and would be loathed to see its stadium representing England and English footballing tradition along with the likes of Man Utd, Newcastle, Liverpool etc.

I have to say, the stadium does look like one of the best small-medium sized stadiums in England. I'd have no worries about the quality of the ground if it were expandable to 45,000. But the other factors make me question whether it's a serious option.
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Old February 9th, 2009, 01:52 PM   #291
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^
You raised a couple of good points

With regards to 'coping' with tourists, I don't that would be a problem. MK is a fairly major business hub, so has dozens of good hotels, and has good wider transport links. Public transport would need addressing - as it's shockingly poor in MK. As to whether we would want tourists to visit MK, I don't see why not. Sure, it's got nothing on the likes of Portsmouth, Bristol, with regards to history etc, but it's still a good location, and would offer people an alternative to the more traditional towns & cities. Remember that a lot of tourists to England love to shop here, and MK is pretty much perfect for that
The sticking point, I agree, would be the whole 'MK Dons' situation. From experience, the bitterness has died down a little in the last couple of years, and are actually doing a lot to promote football in the community in general, and that's being recognised. But ultimately, it goes back to what was being said earlier, regarding it being an England bid, regardless of the host club stadiums being used. If it's the best choice of stadium, it should be used regardless of the host club.
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Old February 9th, 2009, 02:05 PM   #292
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Also, I read on a post that we should be content with getting an average of 50,000 per match. Unless I'm mistaken, but for the '66 World Cup we averaged over 50,000 per match. It would be disappointing if we couldn't drastically exceed that figure.
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Old February 9th, 2009, 02:27 PM   #293
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All seaters vs terraces don't forget. But even taking that into account, we should get an average of 60k per match in a realistic bid (according to my calculations anyway).
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Old February 9th, 2009, 03:24 PM   #294
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by 2018 milton keynes should be one of the countries biggest cities, so it definately could cope imho
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Old February 9th, 2009, 04:07 PM   #295
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quintana View Post
The "this is world cup is ours" and "there is no way we can lose" mentality prevalent among a lot of Englanders.
As a born and raised Englishman, I have to agree with you on this.
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Old February 9th, 2009, 08:16 PM   #296
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aldredd View Post
^
You raised a couple of good points

With regards to 'coping' with tourists, I don't that would be a problem. MK is a fairly major business hub, so has dozens of good hotels, and has good wider transport links. Public transport would need addressing - as it's shockingly poor in MK. As to whether we would want tourists to visit MK, I don't see why not. Sure, it's got nothing on the likes of Portsmouth, Bristol, with regards to history etc, but it's still a good location, and would offer people an alternative to the more traditional towns & cities. Remember that a lot of tourists to England love to shop here, and MK is pretty much perfect for that
The sticking point, I agree, would be the whole 'MK Dons' situation. From experience, the bitterness has died down a little in the last couple of years, and are actually doing a lot to promote football in the community in general, and that's being recognised. But ultimately, it goes back to what was being said earlier, regarding it being an England bid, regardless of the host club stadiums being used. If it's the best choice of stadium, it should be used regardless of the host club.
I don't think the hate will ever completely dissipate. I just don't see the FA putting Milton Keynes forward as part of a bid, not after the heat they took from the various supporters unions on the issue.
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Old February 9th, 2009, 08:19 PM   #297
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Milton Keynes could very possibly be at a level to cope yes, quite easily...the issue is whether the World Cup, with all it's history and heritage should go to a team, franchised from another team in a way now restricted by the FA (following the furore involved).

Surely there have to be better stadiums from better teams than them?
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Old February 9th, 2009, 09:23 PM   #298
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Originally Posted by flierfy View Post
That is exactly the reason why the FIFA prefers bids with a lot of proposed stadia rather than existing ones. New stadium can always designed along the newest FIFA stadium guideline. Where it is difficult and expensive to implement these requirements on existing infrastructure.
And believe me the FIFA will insist on their own ideas of what a World Cup stadium has to look like. They are neither used nor willing to make compromises.
On the flipside though an existing stadium has less chance of being held up by building/funding problems, suffered design flaws or being a white elephant after the event. In Englands case alot of the draw for the event would be the venues people associate with famous teams aswell so having them move to new ones just before the event really wouldnt make the best of that.

The recent craze for so many totally new venues comes largely from the host not FIFA IMHO as we can see by stadiums being built but not even used(LTU arena, Toyota stadium).
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Old February 10th, 2009, 01:16 AM   #299
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if only London was allowed 3 stadiums, then we could add the 83,000 capacity Twickenham Stadium. (Obviously the RFU would have to comply) Then we could have around 5-6 stadiums with over 60,000 seater capacity.
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Old February 10th, 2009, 01:18 AM   #300
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alemanniafan View Post
Great Britain has many very nice stadiums and a lot of traditional stadiums. But you don't have many very large stadia with a capacity of 50.000 plus X.
I believe that might be a serious problem for winning a Worldcup bid. There are quite a few countries that have more of those very large stadia than the UK. And for a worldcup you would probably need at least 6 arenas wih a capacity of 50.000 and more, I believe. And the worldcup bid is not relly anything much emotional, it's mostly about money, about the big business. And if the Fifa makes more money with a worldcup somewhere else they'll just go there instead of the UK.
So as good as the infrastructure is in the uk, the stadias capacities are mostly at the rather low end for a worldcup.
are you serious?
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