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Old June 4th, 2010, 09:01 AM   #2061
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Australia's immigrant population follow their homeland teams like you wouldn't believe.

When Greece won Euro 2004, the streets of Sydney and Melbourne were gridlocked by Greek Australians celebrating.

When Italy won World Cup 2006, the streets of Sydney and Melbourne were gridlocked by Italian Australians celebrating.

When Spain won Euro 2008, the streets of Sydney and Melbourne were gridlocked by Spanish Australians celebrating.

You just would never see that on the streets of New York, Chicago or Los Angeles (all cities with massive First, Second, and third generational immigrant populations).

So, yes, Australians will be going to other games.
False.

NY, Chicago, and LA are stocked full of immigrants. Mostly from Central and South America
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Old June 4th, 2010, 11:56 AM   #2062
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Australia's immigrant population follow their homeland teams like you wouldn't believe.

When Greece won Euro 2004, the streets of Sydney and Melbourne were gridlocked by Greek Australians celebrating.

When Italy won World Cup 2006, the streets of Sydney and Melbourne were gridlocked by Italian Australians celebrating.

When Spain won Euro 2008, the streets of Sydney and Melbourne were gridlocked by Spanish Australians celebrating.

You just would never see that on the streets of New York, Chicago or Los Angeles (all cities with massive First, Second, and third generational immigrant populations).

So, yes, Australians will be going to other games.
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False.

NY, Chicago, and LA are stocked full of immigrants. Mostly from Central and South America
Isn't that what he said ?
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Old June 4th, 2010, 07:04 PM   #2063
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Isn't that what he said ?
What he said is that you'd never see that in New York, LA or Chicago, but we see this sort of thing all the time. Just go to youtube and search for WC celebrations in NY or NJ.
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Old June 4th, 2010, 10:46 PM   #2064
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Unfortunately, the awarding of a World Cup in the 21st century has very little to do with the amount of immigrants celebrating in the streets. That's all fine and dandy and makes for great youtube videos, but it all comes down to money to FIFA. Fact is, the USA has dozens of massive World Cup ready stadiums and all the infrastructure in place with very little additional investment needed. That's what FIFA are looking at.
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Old June 5th, 2010, 06:15 PM   #2065
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What he said is that you'd never see that in New York, LA or Chicago, but we see this sort of thing all the time. Just go to youtube and search for WC celebrations in NY or NJ.
Sure....you just didn't seem to be addressing that part of it the way you phrased your response....maybe he meant the whole city doesn't join in - just pockets? Good job by the USA on the 3-1 friendly win over Australia....though to be honest neither looked like they'll be too busy at the end of the tournament. Lets hope they were both hiding their true form due to it being a friendly.
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Old June 5th, 2010, 06:16 PM   #2066
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Unfortunately, the awarding of a World Cup in the 21st century has very little to do with the amount of immigrants celebrating in the streets. That's all fine and dandy and makes for great youtube videos, but it all comes down to money to FIFA. Fact is, the USA has dozens of massive World Cup ready stadiums and all the infrastructure in place with very little additional investment needed. That's what FIFA are looking at.
Why, does FIFA pay for the upgrades?
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Old June 5th, 2010, 08:47 PM   #2067
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FIFA are going to make a huge amount of money with all these massive WC-ready stadiums already in existence. No other country can pull in these attendances. For example, the average attendance would be about 68,000. 1994 was a financial juggernaut, and this time around, it will be the biggest moneymaker in the history of sport. FIFA is in the business of making money. And it helps that very little additional investment is needed, which means less potential headaches.
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Old June 5th, 2010, 10:18 PM   #2068
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You just would never see that on the streets of New York, Chicago or Los Angeles (all cities with massive First, Second, and third generational immigrant populations).
Boston: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1Dgb...eature=related

The Bronx: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvtnK...eature=related

San Francisco: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRIbrk-8BLo

Fairview, New Jersey: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAoLs...eature=related

ALGERIANS CELEBRATING BECAUSE THEY MADE THE WORLD CUP: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPxoH7Icmvw

I'd say you were dead wrong on this one.
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Old June 6th, 2010, 02:52 AM   #2069
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Obviously he had no clue ..
In San Diego, CA. I was there in Little Italy with my friends and it was full of people, and not just Italians.
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Old June 6th, 2010, 03:08 AM   #2070
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FIFA are going to make a huge amount of money with all these massive WC-ready stadiums already in existence. No other country can pull in these attendances. For example, the average attendance would be about 68,000. 1994 was a financial juggernaut, and this time around, it will be the biggest moneymaker in the history of sport. FIFA is in the business of making money. And it helps that very little additional investment is needed, which means less potential headaches.
So if this is all FIFA decide on (money from attendance) then USA will win the 2018 bid and Australia can go for 2022?
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Old June 6th, 2010, 03:09 AM   #2071
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...

You just would never see that on the streets of New York, Chicago or Los Angeles (all cities with massive First, Second, and third generational immigrant populations).

....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Archbishop View Post
Would seem so
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Old June 6th, 2010, 05:10 AM   #2072
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Originally Posted by slipperydog View Post
FIFA are going to make a huge amount of money with all these massive WC-ready stadiums already in existence. No other country can pull in these attendances. For example, the average attendance would be about 68,000. 1994 was a financial juggernaut, and this time around, it will be the biggest moneymaker in the history of sport. FIFA is in the business of making money. And it helps that very little additional investment is needed, which means less potential headaches.
FIFA doesn't give a damn about additional investment in stadiums - it's not their money anyway. Even South Africa and Brazil are managing to to what they have to, so FIFA won't care about the headaches with the much more powerful countries that are bidding now. For what it seems to me, they actually prefer newly-built stadiums because their projects can be exactly like the ideal parameters defined by their guideline book - and this is one of the strenghts of the Russian bid.

But you have a point about the attendances. That's something FIFA prioritizes, and the threshold will be raised after 2014. It is indeed one of the most positive aspects of USA 2022. The question is whether it's enough to make up for the fact that it's obviously too soon to go back to the U.S.

We're witnessing a very important moment in this race at which Australia is having trouble to keep up with the U.S. bid while Qatar seems to emerge as a serious contender.
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Old June 6th, 2010, 08:43 AM   #2073
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FIFA doesn't give a damn about additional investment in stadiums - it's not their money anyway. Even South Africa and Brazil are managing to to what they have to, so FIFA won't care about the headaches with the much more powerful countries that are bidding now. For what it seems to me, they actually prefer newly-built stadiums because their projects can be exactly like the ideal parameters defined by their guideline book - and this is one of the strenghts of the Russian bid.

But you have a point about the attendances. That's something FIFA prioritizes, and the threshold will be raised after 2014. It is indeed one of the most positive aspects of USA 2022. The question is whether it's enough to make up for the fact that it's obviously too soon to go back to the U.S.

We're witnessing a very important moment in this race at which Australia is having trouble to keep up with the U.S. bid while Qatar seems to emerge as a serious contender.
Not sure I agree that Australia is struggling to keep up. Its bid has the stadiums, the funding and that support of the major codes and crwods will be large, as with all major events here. It may be a smaller country in population but it certainly punches above its weight in sport and the crowds that attend.

In saying that the USA has the advantage over everyone in fact it is a market of 300 million, richest country in the world but to be honest, the stadium advantages people are sprooking really is overplayed. USA '94 looked bland and, although successful in crowd numbers, never really has achieved anywhere near the goal of making Football a serious player in the US. If they are playing the card again to try and give Football a lifeline in that market, it is a floored argument.

I still think US is favourite, but Qatar would definately be a mistake alone. Australia has just as good a chance of getting it though if all elements of the bid are seriously considered.
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Old June 6th, 2010, 09:46 AM   #2074
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The MLS is going from strength to strength, especially in the last few years. Lot of soccer specific stadiums going up, expansions teams outperforming expectation, and crowds are growing (averaging something like 19,000) this season.

Perfect time to give them another WC to consolidate on the growth. Personally I don't think the US needs a WC to continue their growth, but FIFA would no doubt see it as a bonus, especially as it would benefit both FIFA and the US soccer.

The state of the MLS is something the A-League can only dream of at the moment. And thats with the lack of national media coverage of soccer in general.

"Give football a lifeline"... clearly someone who has no idea what is happening in US soccer at the moment. I don't see A-League teams building stadiums at the rate MLS is... I don't see A-League clubs playing to sold out stadiums.. Educate yourself a bit more before making such statements. (And if it counts, I live in Aus as well)
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Old June 6th, 2010, 10:00 AM   #2075
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Originally Posted by Sportsfan View Post

When Spain won Euro 2008, the streets of Sydney and Melbourne were gridlocked by Spanish Australians celebrating.

You just would never see that on the streets of New York, Chicago or Los Angeles (all cities with massive First, Second, and third generational immigrant populations).

So, yes, Australians will be going to other games.
One thing I have learned on SSC is never put it past the average Canadian and to a lesser extant Australian to feel they have uniquely invented and monopolized the idea of diversity.
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Old June 6th, 2010, 10:03 AM   #2076
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The MLS is going from strength to strength, especially in the last few years. Lot of soccer specific stadiums going up, expansions teams outperforming expectation, and crowds are growing (averaging something like 19,000) this season.

Perfect time to give them another WC to consolidate on the growth. Personally I don't think the US needs a WC to continue their growth, but FIFA would no doubt see it as a bonus, especially as it would benefit both FIFA and the US soccer.

The state of the MLS is something the A-League can only dream of at the moment. And thats with the lack of national media coverage of soccer in general.

"Give football a lifeline"... clearly someone who has no idea what is happening in US soccer at the moment. I don't see A-League teams building stadiums at the rate MLS is... I don't see A-League clubs playing to sold out stadiums.. Educate yourself a bit more before making such statements.
I dont need to educate myself before making statements. Football or 'soccer' really has taken a long time to develop in the US. It is growing but it is still a niche sport on the sporting landcrape in the US. It is much more of a niche sport than in Australia for instance.

That is not an un-educated statement at all so please do not try and make it sound like someone has no idea what they are on about. Its all in the eye of the beholder, and all see it differently. For instance, most americans I know still cringe at the thought of Football and the MLS in particular, even after the 16 years since the WC held there. Another WC there will not change their minds, as it didnt succed in doing the first time around.

The fact is that the whole point of trying to consolidate a position really is not a valid argument, when there are markets out there where Football can become a lot larger in the national pysche than it will take in the US. Australia is just one example where Football is on the verge of taking over from Rugby League as the 2nd largest professional sport in this country. That would be a huge turnaround, where it was 4th largest only 5 years ago. Rugby Union is already behind it now. The A-League is currently growing in the amount of teams, building new markets and making a statement that only 5 years ago (at the point of its foundation) it would never have believed possible.

So yes, the A-League can only dream of emulating the size and scope of the MLS in many ways, but only 5 years in , its well and truely on its way to where it needs to be. That is with no home WC to kick start its next level of growth. So theres a bigger world out there than the US and all the short-term commercial value it will bring FIFA, is not the be all and end all of the formula needed by the game.
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Old June 6th, 2010, 11:37 AM   #2077
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One thing I have learned on SSC is never put it past the average Canadian and to a lesser extant Australian to feel they have uniquely invented and monopolized the idea of diversity.
We have to have one or two faults....to make us less perfect and more likeable.
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Old June 6th, 2010, 11:52 AM   #2078
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I dont need to educate myself before making statements. Football or 'soccer' really has taken a long time to develop in the US. It is growing but it is still a niche sport on the sporting landcrape in the US. It is much more of a niche sport than in Australia for instance.

That is not an un-educated statement at all so please do not try and make it sound like someone has no idea what they are on about. Its all in the eye of the beholder, and all see it differently. For instance, most americans I know still cringe at the thought of Football and the MLS in particular, even after the 16 years since the WC held there. Another WC there will not change their minds, as it didnt succed in doing the first time around.

The fact is that the whole point of trying to consolidate a position really is not a valid argument, when there are markets out there where Football can become a lot larger in the national pysche than it will take in the US. Australia is just one example where Football is on the verge of taking over from Rugby League as the 2nd largest professional sport in this country. That would be a huge turnaround, where it was 4th largest only 5 years ago. Rugby Union is already behind it now. The A-League is currently growing in the amount of teams, building new markets and making a statement that only 5 years ago (at the point of its foundation) it would never have believed possible.

So yes, the A-League can only dream of emulating the size and scope of the MLS in many ways, but only 5 years in , its well and truely on its way to where it needs to be. That is with no home WC to kick start its next level of growth. So theres a bigger world out there than the US and all the short-term commercial value it will bring FIFA, is not the be all and end all of the formula needed by the game.
Personally I see no indication that anything you say is true. You lost me at 'A-League close to overtaking NRL'...simply daft. Not even close.
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Old June 6th, 2010, 12:24 PM   #2079
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Personally I see no indication that anything you say is true. You lost me at 'A-League close to overtaking NRL'...simply daft. Not even close.
If you say so. Not even close? Really is just too negative to believe. Look at the facts, the national coverage of Football vs NRL, you will be very surprised just how off the mark you are. The gap is close now and a WC would very easily put the NRL in its wake.
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Old June 6th, 2010, 12:30 PM   #2080
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^

Hate to dissapoint but A-legaue is catching NRL.
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